Subdeacon Joe Posted August 24 Share Posted August 24 (edited) Seems as if NASA has recognized the obvious: https://apnews.com/article/boeing-spacex-nasa-astronauts-starliner-e4e81e5a6c23dee2f8f72260ddea011c NASA decides to keep 2 astronauts in space until February, nixes return on troubled Boeing capsule 1 of 8 | FILE - In this photo provided by NASA, Boeing Crew Flight Test astronauts Butch Wilmore, left, and Suni Williams pose for a portrait inside the vestibule between the forward port on the International Space Station’s Harmony module and Boeing’s Starliner spacecraft on June 13, 2024. (NASA via AP, File) Read More 2 of 8 | NASA Administrator Bill Nelson takes part in news conference as NASA decided it’s too risky to bring two astronauts back to Earth in Boeing’s troubled new capsule, at Johnson Space Center in Houston, on Saturday, Aug. 24, 2024. (NASA via AP) Read More 3 of 8 | In this long-exposure photo provided by NASA, Boeing’s Starliner spacecraft is docked to the Harmony module of the International Space Station on July 3, 2024. (NASA via AP) Read More 4 of 8 | FILE - NASA astronauts Suni Williams, left, and Butch Wilmore stand together for a photo enroute to the launch pad at Space Launch Complex 41 Wednesday, June 5, 2024, in Cape Canaveral, Fla., for their liftoff on the Boeing Starliner capsule to the international space station. (AP Photo/Chris O’Meara, File) Read More 5 of 8 | This photo provided by NASA shows Boeing’s Starliner spacecraft which launched astronauts Butch Wilmore and Suni Williams to the International Space Station docked to the Harmony module’s forward port on July 3, 2024, seen from a window on the SpaceX Dragon Endeavour spacecraft docked to the adjacent port. (NASA via AP) Read More 6 of 8 | In this photo provided by NASA, astronauts Butch Wilmore, left, and Suni Williams inspect safety hardware aboard the International Space Station on Aug. 9, 2024. (NASA via AP) Read More 7 of 8 | In this photo provided by NASA, Boeing’s Starliner spacecraft is docked to the Harmony module of the International Space Station on July 3, 2024, seen from a window on the SpaceX Dragon Endeavour spacecraft docked to an adjacent port. (NASA via AP) Read More 8 of 8 | FILE - In this photo provided by NASA, Boeing Crew Flight Test astronauts Suni Williams and Butch Wilmore, center, pose with Expedition 71 Flight Engineers Mike Barratt, left, and Tracy Dyson, aboard the International Space Station’s Quest airlock on June 24, 2024. (NASA via AP, File) Read More By MARCIA DUNN Updated 1:34 PM PDT, August 24, 2024 Share CAPE CANAVERAL, Fla. (AP) — NASA decided Saturday it’s too risky to bring two astronauts back to Earth in Boeing’s troubled new capsule, and they’ll have to wait until next year for a ride home with SpaceX. What should have been a weeklong test flight for the pair will now last more than eight months. The seasoned pilots have been stuck at the International Space Station since the beginning of June. A cascade of vexing thruster failures and helium leaks in the new capsule marred their trip to the space station, and they ended up in a holding pattern as engineers conducted tests and debated what to do about the flight back." Edited August 24 by Subdeacon Joe 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rye Miles #13621 Posted August 24 Share Posted August 24 If anyone could rescue them Elon can! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cypress Sun Posted August 24 Share Posted August 24 If I had to guess, both of them are secretly breathing a sigh of relief that they don't have to return in the Boeing. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rip Snorter Posted August 24 Share Posted August 24 Bad pun alert! Boeing in the Wind. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trailrider #896 Posted August 24 Share Posted August 24 30 minutes ago, Rye Miles #13621 said: If anyone could rescue them Elon can! Without being argumentative or being nit-picky, I would not say Butch and Suni need "rescuing". That would imply they are in peril of their lives by having to remain on the space station. They are certainly in for a much longer deployment than they expected when they launched on the Starliner test flight. And, yes, it is certainly a great thing that Elon Musk's SpaceX Dragons are designed with extra capabilities than normally the case. When Starliner departs the Station unmanned, its crew will need a "lifeboat" in case the station needed to be evacuated, such as when there is a danger of space debris colliding with it, which has been temporarily at various times. To provide for such a contingency, two extra seats will be configured in the Crew-8 spacecraft currently docked at the Station. Deorbiting and reentering in that configuration would not be the best thing, but doable. Crew-8 will depart in the four-crew configuration, however. In a few days, Crew Dragon-9 will launch from the Cape, but with two astronauts instead of four, with ballast and additional supplies, including two space suits compatible with the Dragon, for docking toward the end of September. The two members of -9 will stay aboard the Station until February 2025 or so, and Butch and Suni will also, returning from the Station aboard the Crew-9 craft. NASA has not announced which two astronauts or an astronaut and a cosmonaut will be "bumped" from the flight. They will certainly be disappointed, but will probably be reassigned to a future flight crew. Meanwhile, Butch and Suni will become part of the Station's operations, conducting experiments and doing maintenance. All-in-all, this was the best decision that could be made with the Starliner's problems. What will be interesting is what Boeing is going to do with the Starliner design. Whatever they do, will take time and some interesting engineering. We do need a backup to the Dragons. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kloehr Posted August 24 Share Posted August 24 I figured management (corporate and agency) would run the clock out before nixing the flight. In no way do any parties want unneeded deaths. If the capsule fails in re-entry, it was the right decision. If the capsule comes down OK, then still the right decision out of an abundance of caution. The reason I thought they would run the clock out first is to have an explanation for a re-entry failure; It was in orbit longer than the specs called for so failure was expected. Faces saved all around the table. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rip Snorter Posted August 24 Share Posted August 24 Just now, John Kloehr said: I figured management (corporate and agency) would run the clock out before nixing the flight. In no way do any parties want unneeded deaths. If the capsule fails in re-entry, it was the right decision. If the capsule comes down OK, then still the right decision out of an abundance of caution. The reason I thought they would run the clock out first is to have an explanation for a re-entry failure; It was in orbit longer than the specs called for so failure was expected. Faces saved all around the table. The old LEO Rule applies in spades - get home alive. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rye Miles #13621 Posted August 24 Share Posted August 24 (edited) 45 minutes ago, Trailrider #896 said: Without being argumentative or being nit-picky, I would not say Butch and Suni need "rescuing". That would imply they are in peril of their lives by having to remain on the space station. They are certainly in for a much longer deployment than they expected when they launched on the Starliner test flight. And, yes, it is certainly a great thing that Elon Musk's SpaceX Dragons are designed with extra capabilities than normally the case. When Starliner departs the Station unmanned, its crew will need a "lifeboat" in case the station needed to be evacuated, such as when there is a danger of space debris colliding with it, which has been temporarily at various times. To provide for such a contingency, two extra seats will be configured in the Crew-8 spacecraft currently docked at the Station. Deorbiting and reentering in that configuration would not be the best thing, but doable. Crew-8 will depart in the four-crew configuration, however. In a few days, Crew Dragon-9 will launch from the Cape, but with two astronauts instead of four, with ballast and additional supplies, including two space suits compatible with the Dragon, for docking toward the end of September. The two members of -9 will stay aboard the Station until February 2025 or so, and Butch and Suni will also, returning from the Station aboard the Crew-9 craft. NASA has not announced which two astronauts or an astronaut and a cosmonaut will be "bumped" from the flight. They will certainly be disappointed, but will probably be reassigned to a future flight crew. Meanwhile, Butch and Suni will become part of the Station's operations, conducting experiments and doing maintenance. All-in-all, this was the best decision that could be made with the Starliner's problems. What will be interesting is what Boeing is going to do with the Starliner design. Whatever they do, will take time and some interesting engineering. We do need a backup to the Dragons. It sure would be nice if they can get home before February. I don’t know if Elon can do it or if he would even be allowed. I meant Elon could rescue them sorta tongue in cheek. Get it ? 🙄 Edited August 24 by Rye Miles #13621 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subdeacon Joe Posted August 24 Author Share Posted August 24 1 hour ago, Trailrider #896 said: Without being argumentative or being nit-picky, I would not say Butch and Suni need "rescuing". Hmmmm..... Let's see..... A mission that has been "extended" for an indefinite amount of time because the people on that mission had no way to get back because their ride home is thought to be as reliable and safe as week old gas station sushi.... Sounds pretty much like stranded and in need of rescue, I don't care how you spin it, sugar coat it, try to cast it a favorable light, or try to say that it's a success in a different direction than originally intended. Like the kid in trouble for punching another kid in the gut and saying he didn't do that, all he did was hit the other kid's shirt. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kloehr Posted August 25 Share Posted August 25 Could spin it as a cooperative effort in the interests of long-term goals. Just hope Elon can get the crew home safely. While we all accept some risks in life, none of this is safer than getting groceries. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984 Posted August 25 Share Posted August 25 Be wary of hubris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forty Rod SASS 3935 Posted August 25 Share Posted August 25 One more government project that didn't work. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cypress Sun Posted August 25 Share Posted August 25 33 minutes ago, Forty Rod SASS 3935 said: One more government project that didn't work. Was there one that did? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forty Rod SASS 3935 Posted August 25 Share Posted August 25 6 hours ago, Cypress Sun said: Was there one that did? Not that I'm aware of. Wellll, theres WWII, but we didn't do that alone. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Coffinmaker Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 All You "Bad Mouthers" forget "Apollo??" Starliner isn't a government project that didn't work. I was part of the same program that gave us Space X Dragon. Starliner is a Boeing project that has failed. The "back-up" to Dragon certainly isn't Starliner. The back-up is having another Dragon ready to go. I'm ready to se that as yet un-flown Space Plane go Uppity up up and then come Downity down down (Successfully) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irish ike, SASS #43615 Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 Government projects tell us we don't want them running our healthcare system. 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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