Death by car exhaust

[Alpo]

I read, some years back, that because of the catalytic converters on the new cars, you could not kill yourself with exhaust any more.

 

However, on the NCIS episode I'm watching, a woman is murdered by car exhaust.

 

Typical Hollyweird stupidness, or was I misinformed about the CO-poisoning not being possible?

[Shorty Jack Hammer]

I have been to several successful exhaust assisted suicides using modern catalytic converter equipped vehicles…..Now I'm a cop not a medical examiner so i don't know if was the exhaust contents per se or the fact that oxygen was eventually replaced by the exhaust gases. Either way it worked.

[DocWard]

To the best of my knowledge, car exhaust still contains carbon monoxide, even though it is reduced by the converter.

[Utah Bob #35998]

You can still do it, convertor not. While the levels of carbon monoxide are lower now with converters, it is still deadly. Takes a bit longer is all.

[Abilene Slim SASS 81783]

What Doc, UB and Red Horse said. Source: CO poisoning/vehicles

How can CO poisoning occur if the engine has a catalytic converter? Exhaust gas that leaks out before the catalytic converter has high CO concentrations. Out-of-tune or misfiring engines produce elevated concentrations of carbon monoxide and unburned fuel that can destroy the catalytic converter. During cold starts the catalytic converter is ineffective. And if there is insufficient oxygen (caused by operation in a closed building or with a defective oxygen system), there will not be enough oxygen for oxidizing the CO to CO2.

What is the problem with pick-up toppers, open tailgates, and holes in the vehicle body?For carbon monoxide poisoning to occur, a person must breath the CO. Holes allow the CO to enter the vehicle. Every year several people die while sitting in old vehicles with defective exhaust systems and holes rusted through the vehicle floor. When a vehicle is moving, holes or openings in the rear of the vehicle are under a suction which pulls in exhaust fumes. All holes in the car body must be sealed. The suction effect applies when a rear tailgate window or the trunk is left open or when persons ride in the back of a pick-up truck under a topper. The suction produced as the truck is driven and the lack of ventilation in the topper combine to produce a potentially deadly combination. Normally active children who sleep while in the back of a pick-up may be sleepy because they are breathing carbon monoxide. In California, several cases of children dying in the back of pick-ups under a topper have been documented.

[Rusty Chains]

Depends on the car, tough to do with a Prius! Otherwise with a normal car in an enclosed space, enough carbon dioxide will kill ya. If you remember back to Apollo 13 one of the things that nearly killed the astronauts was build up of carbon dioxide in the cabin.

[Church Key, SASS # 33713]

One of the saddest stories I've ever read was the woman who had a remote start on her vehicle, which was kept in a garage under her bedroom. Tossed her purse on a chair, auto start happened for some reason, she was suffocated.

[Dusty Hill, sass # 49256]

Here in the Denver area cars have to pass emissions testing every 2 years. The CO has to be below a certain level to pass, but they don't give off as much as pre catalytic converter era cars.



I stand corrected, I should have said CO instead of Co2

[Alpo]

I notice several people in this thread have mentioned Carbon Dioxide. CO2.

 

I always thought the killer in car exhaust was carbon MONoxide. CO.

 

Now, yes, if CO2 replaces enough oxygen, you suffocate, the same way playing with laughing gas kills. To much Nitros and it replaces the O2 you need to breathe, and you die.

 

But carbon MONoxide is actually poisonous, ain't it? I mean, Carbon Dioxide is everywhere. You EXHALE CO2. When you talk to someone you are breathing it into their face. It can't be poison.

[Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984]

Yes, CO2 is not the problem unless it replaces all of the oxygen, which will stop the car from running as well as any human. Most garages are so leaky that that will not happen. CO will kill without depleting the oxygen.

[J-BAR #18287]

Carbon Monoxide molecules actually combine with hemoglobin in red blood cells, preventing oxygen molecules from occupying their normal sites on the hemoglobin molecule; carbon monoxide will kill even if there is plenty of oxygen in the available air. The suffocation occurs at the cellular level.

 

Carbon dioxide is heavier than air, so be wary of enclosures that don't allow gasses/air to escape from the floor to the outside. In some large hog slaughter plants, the hogs are loaded onto a ferris wheel like carrier, which anesthetizes them by dipping them into a pit filled with carbon dioxide for a minute or so. They are unconscious coming out of the pit so they can be bled out safely; easier than mechanical stunning with a bolt or bullet, or electrical stunning prior to sticking.

[Blackwater 53393]

There are enough other toxins in exhaust gasses emitted by catalyzed vehicles to easily do what CO does and just as quickly. What most people don't know is that the converter emits corrosive gasses and liquids in steam form that are just as noxious as CO!!

[Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619]

yeah, CO is a much bigger danger than C02 in these situations.

[Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984]

There are enough other toxins in exhaust gasses emitted by catalyzed vehicles to easily do what CO does and just as quickly. What most people don't know is that the converter emits corrosive gasses and liquids in steam form that are just as noxious as CO!!

Name them.

[Utah Bob #35998]

Uhh. ..... should we send somebody br Alpo's place to check on him.

[Alpo]

Bring deer meat. I'm running low.

[Blackwater 53393]

Name them.

 

When I worked in the automotive industry, around the time that catalytic converters were introduced, we found traces of hydrochloric acid and hydrogen sulfide in the emissions. If you use regular mild steel tubing for exhaust on a catalyzed vehicle, it will rot out, in less than a year in some cases. They now use aluminized pipe or stainless in most applications.

 

The use of catalytic converters has been linked to increases in acid rain.

 

Also, when you fall in behind a vehicle with a bad converter or a vehicle being driven under heavy load, you can smell the noxious fumes. The converter is designed to work within a narrow range and at start-up and under heavy load they do NOT do what they are designed to do.

 

There have been a number of independent research studies done that are out there, although many of them have been hidden or squelched by the auto industry or the feds. I don't know where to find them now, but there was evidence of carcinogens found in a couple of tests I saw twenty-five years ago.