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Cheyenne Culpepper 32827

a truly Hypothetical WTC?

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two sweeps, one from right then the other from left,,, 5 targets.

 

shooter using first pistol engages first five targets, and then with same pistol engages the last target again, then pulls second pistol and taking up on the second target engages the last 4 targets,,, leaving one round in pistol,,, holsters it on spent round..... so, he engaged targets 1 2,3,4,5 engaged 5 again with same pistol and then with second five rounds engaged 4 3 2 1.... and left one in pistol, safely

 

edit,,,, only 5 rounds in first pistol.....

 

wtc? and why?

 

this did NOT happen but almost did....

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"engaged" or HIT?

What model revolver?

 

IF he HIT 6 targets with one revolver, he gets a SDQ. (assuming he's using a 6-shot SAA-type revolver)

REF: SDQ section RO1 p.24

any other penalties from that point on are irrelevant.

 

(reserving the right to edit response pending any additional relevant information)

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I will give it a go.

Probably be wrong.

 

P and a Miss/5 seconds for unfired round..

 

Would not call pointing a empty gun at a target and going click as engaged.

So when he shot the next round at 4. He got the P.

Did not fire 10 rounds.

So 5 seconds for unfired round.

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"engaged" or HIT?

What model revolver?

 

IF he HIT 6 targets with one revolver, he gets a SDQ. (assuming he's using a 6-shot SAA-type revolver)

REF: SDQ section RO1 p.24

any other penalties from that point on are irrelevant.

 

 

Did not think of having 6 in first pistol.

Assumed it just went click on empty chamber.

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only five rounds in first pistol....

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only five rounds in first pistol....

 

P for "out of order" (skipping a target somewhere during the 10-shot string) and a 5-second penalty for the unfired round.

 

This is a case of the "P" resulting in a "miss" ... NOT a "Miss causing a P"

 

What do I win? (at least until CC decides to throw a few more details into the pot)

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P for "out of order" (skipping a target somewhere during the 10-shot string) and a 5-second penalty for the unfired round

 

What do I win? (at least until CC decides to throw a few more details into the pot)

 

 

You mean I got it right. DANG. :)

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+1 Anvil Al. A P for not engaging target 5 on the second sweep (from right to left), and a Miss for the unfired round.

 

Because dropping the hammer on an empty cylinder on the first gun did not constitute engaging target 5.

 

Good luck, GJ

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no more details,,,,fired 5 rounds,,,

 

 

but if you engage the rifle with a jacked out round that counts,,,, why wouldn't this?

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no more details,,,,fired 5 rounds,,,

 

 

but if you engage the rifle with a jacked out round that counts,,,, why wouldn't this?

That was my thinking too.

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no more details,,,,fired 5 rounds,,,

 

 

but if you engage the rifle with a jacked out round that counts,,,, why wouldn't this?

 

Because we treat long guns differently than revolvers?

The shooter HIT the targets "out of order"...that's the "P".

...didn't he?

How about telling us the order in which the targets were actually HIT with FIRED rounds.

 

Leaving the unfired round (we're assuming he only actually SHOT 9 out of the ten) is a 5-second penalty.

 

He didn't "jack one out" of the revolver...did he?

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no more details,,,,fired 5 rounds,,,

 

 

but if you engage the rifle with a jacked out round that counts,,,, why wouldn't this?

 

 

Not in any of the probably 50 or so "light hit" rifle rounds I've shot in major matches over the last year. I get a light hit on a sweep, only I know about it most of the time, but I just shoot a round at the target I jacked a round out on, and keep an going down the sweep, loading round(s) at the end of the sweep to make up the jacked out round(s).

 

One of 4 ways to make up for kicking out a round in PWB's famous "4 ways to recover" article.

 

Good luck, GJ

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Engagement really can't happen until a bullet leaves the barrel on the attempted shot. Squibs and stuck slugs have never been scored a miss or a hit. They are called "rounds not fired," and penalized/scored the same 5 second penalty as a miss. Here's where the definition of Engaging the Target that we have now causes lots of confusion. IMHO.

 

Good luck, GJ

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Engagement really can't happen until a bullet leaves the barrel on the attempted shot. Squibs and stuck slugs have never been scored a miss or a hit. They are called "rounds not fired," and penalized/scored the same 5 second penalty as a miss. Here's where the definition of Engaging the Target that we have now causes lots of confusion. IMHO.

 

Good luck, GJ

So jacking a round out in the middle of a double tap sweep and moving on to the next target is an automatic P?

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shot first sweep,,, correctly,,,,, then enaged 6th "shot" on correct target and then with second pistol engage/shot 4 3 2 1

 

most writers around here are using "first 5 shots and then second five shots or rounds"

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So jacking a round out in the middle of a double tap sweep and moving on to the next target is an automatic P?

Did that bullet of the jacked out round leave the barrel? No.

Thus, target was not even engaged.

 

Moving on to next target if you still need the second shot on the target? Yep, that would be a P. No way to recover from it, because the double tap cannot be done after shooting the next shot at the next target in the sweep.

 

I don't know anyone willing to say you engaged (and "missed") that second shot on a double tap if you jacked out that round. And you surely can not come back later and put a makeup round on the target you skipped without earning the P.

 

Good luck, GJ

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It went click on a empty chamber that the gun had been fired dry already.

There was no round at all to even try to fire at it.

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It's a p because he engaged the 1st target on the second sweep with the first pistol , then engaged the second target of the second sweep with the second pistol leaving one unfired round in the second pistol

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Did that bullet of the jacked out round leave the barrel? No.

Thus, target was not even engaged.

 

 

 

Good luck, GJ

 

 

On the rifle I would have to disagree with you.

 

See Palewolfs Shooters choice at that point.

 

With rifle. Shooter can call it engaged and go to next target and take the miss.

OR.

Stay with that target. Keep in order so he can reload.

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Told you it gets complicated with the way the definitions are set now. :lol:

 

Good luck, GJ

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Culpepper, is your point that the pistols should be handled like the rifle under the shooter's choice rules or that those rules should be changed?

 

The relevant difference between this situation and jacked out round in a rifle string at that same point is that the shooter still has enough rounds to complete the string as written in the type of gun required without having to reload. Not so with a jacked out rifle round.

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so, if you have a misfire in a pistol and go on, it's a P because you dint fire a round at sed target??? don't think so!

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Told you it gets complicated with the way the definitions are set now. :lol:

 

Good luck, GJ

 

 

+1

 

Wish they would just do away with the engaged part. If it don't go bang.

Then it don't count in any gun would be much easier.

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so, if you have a misfire in a pistol and go on, it's a P because you dint fire a round at sed target??? don't think so!

 

 

I would see that different as it was a live round.

 

in the other. there is no live round at all left in the gun. It's is dry before he ever tried to make

it go click.

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shot first sweep,,, correctly,,,,, then enaged 6th "shot" on correct target and then with second pistol engage/shot 4 3 2 1

 

most writers around here are using "first 5 shots and then second five shots or rounds"

 

So shooter didn't engage the targets in the correct order with the 2nd five shots, earning the P, then leaving an unfired round in the pistol, earning the 5 second penalty.

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but he did engage it...... with the first of the next five rounds.... but didn't go bang.....

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Culpepper, is your point that the pistols should be handled like the rifle under the shooter's choice rules or that those rules should be changed?

 

The relevant difference between this situation and jacked out round in a rifle string at that same point is that the shooter still has enough rounds to complete the string as written in the type of gun required without having to reload. Not so with a jacked out rifle round.

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but he did engage it...... with the first of the next five rounds.... but didn't go bang.....

 

 

I would not call going click with a empty gun as engaged.

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I think it's simple. The stage instructions said to sweep the targets with next 5 shots he didn't do that he shot 4321 left one in the revolver instead of shooting 54321...it's a p

 

The fact that he tried to start the sweep with a empty pistol doesn't matter he still could have completed the sweep correctly

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I think it's simple. The stage instructions said to sweep the targets with next 5 shots he didn't do that he shot 4321 left one in the revolver instead of shooting 54321...it's a p

 

The fact that he tried to start the sweep with a empty pistol doesn't matter he still could have completed the sweep correctly

 

Add to the P the two misses, one on target 5 (1st target of second sweep) that was only "engaged" with the 6th shot/click from the first revolver, the 2nd miss for the live round left in the revolver.

 

Enough for a headache,

Barry Sloe

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ROI pg 30 seems to disagree with you.

 

 

But post #8 does.

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