Captain Bill Burt Posted June 22, 2013 Posted June 22, 2013 This type call has probably been addressed here before but I couldn't find it. So, stage instructions call for a rifle, pistols, shotgun sequence. Shooter starts in the middle of the bar with a whiskey bottle and glass in hands ATB places them on the bar, moves to his rifle on the left side of the bar and begins. In this case ATB, the shooter places the items on the bar takes a step left and draws and cocks his first pistol. The TO says 'Stop!' The shooter stops and the TO instructs him to decock his pistol, re-index it, and restart. In support of the call I offer: SHB 7. De-cocking may not be done to avoid a penalty if cocked at the wrong time, position or location once a round has gone down range. NO gun may be de-cocked on the firing line except by pointing it down range and pulling the trigger or while under the direct supervision of the Timer Operator (TO). (This requires a positive indication/acknowledgement from the TO to the shooter). The penalty for de-cocking is a Stage Disqualification. This was cited in contrary opinions: SHB 8. Once a revolver is cocked, the round under the hammer must be expended in order for it to be returned to a safe condition. Once a rifle is cocked, either the round under the hammer must be expended or the action opened in order for the rifle to be returned to a safe condition. Shotgun shells may be removed, if necessary, without penalty in order to return the firearm to a safe condition.
Fingers McGee Posted June 22, 2013 Posted June 22, 2013 I'd say that the TOs "STOP" and actions taken under rule 7 trumped rule 8 and the shooter got a break. Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee
Grizzly Dave Posted June 22, 2013 Posted June 22, 2013 Round had not gone downrange, shooter was under direct supervision and direction of the TO, no call. Edit to add - not sure if the TOs actions fall under not allowing a shooter to start in a faulty position, but it could be argued.
Dang It Dan 13202 Posted June 22, 2013 Posted June 22, 2013 No round had gone down range AND the command to "stop" was given by the TO. No call. You got a free-bee. Start over. Have a nice day.
Marauder SASS #13056 Posted June 22, 2013 Posted June 22, 2013 Yup. What you quoted for 8 tell what to do IF you are NOT under the conditions stated in 7. Since the shooter was under the conditions set by 7, and the shooter was following TO direction, I say no call.
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 Hi Capt. Bill, IMO , if there are conflicting rules, select the one that gives Benefit of the Doubt to the shooter. You didn't mention the rule that states "Restarts shall be allowed for a competitor to achieve a clean start, up to the point at which the first round goes down range." Restart! Regards, Allie Mo
Kiowa Kid, SASS #69870L Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 Hi Capt. Bill, IMO , if there are conflicting rules, select the one that gives Benefit of the Doubt to the shooter. You didn't mention the rule that states "Restarts shall be allowed for a competitor to achieve a clean start, up to the point at which the first round goes down range." Restart! Regards, Allie Mo +1 KK
Anvil Al #59168 Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 No round down range. De-cocked under RO's instructions. Restart and try again. No call.
Snakebite Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 The stage had not started yet... even if the T.O. had not stopped the shooter, the shooter could have requested a restart, and ask for the T.O. to supervise the de-cocking of the handgun as long as the first round was not fired. If this situation the T.O.was quick enough to catch the shooter before the first round was fired, and supervise the de-cocking... good for him/her. SHB 8. would be applied once the stage has started. Snakebite
White Buffalo Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 I like these you make the call. For just starting in the sport has taught me a lot about what to do and not do on the shooting line. Thanks all
Buck D. Law, SASS #62183 Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 The TO did an excellent job! IMO, a TO who is on their game will (when this happens) immediately take charge and instruct the shooter to lower their hammer or in the case of a rifle, either lower the hammer or open their lever. The goal is to do so BEFORE the shooter has to think about what to do.
Rance - SASS # 54090 Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 My TO at Illinois State just last week saved me from this exact scenario.. Rifle, Pistol, shotgun... I drew my pistol and cocked it.. TO said no.. but ya gotta send it downrange.. Someone from the posse said "Round hasn't gone downrange.. Stage hasn't started.." I held gun down range safely.. the TO said "I'm telling you to decock yer gun" Did it.. Saved me.. Rance Thinkin'.. Wow was I grateful!! Edit.. this is a mess.. everytime I hit enter.. it gave me a new Quote???
Captain Bill Burt Posted June 23, 2013 Author Posted June 23, 2013 Did this happen on our Posse Capt? Yep, a certain Classic Cowboy of small stature was the shooter. No one 'argued' the call, but it was politely questioned afterward.
El Sabre Posted June 23, 2013 Posted June 23, 2013 I also avidly read these scenarios, for the same reason as does White Buffalo. This is one of the most valuable parts of the Wire for the FNG. Mark
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