Widder, SASS #59054 Posted June 27, 2015 Posted June 27, 2015 We were at Cleveland TN, shooting with the Ocoee Rangers. Rain set in. Last summer, I had repaired some broken wood inside the Tang area of the stock with Gorilla Glue, just like the pixs you recently posted. I wasn't aware the Gorilla Glue had succumbed to the elements this past year and during the course of my rifle sequence, it locked up tighter than a bank vault. Removing the stock immediately told me the whole story. And I immediately recollected your Thread and all the good post it initiated, especially from Straight Arrow Hombre. So why do I post this info? Because even the best prepared Widdermatic in the world can have an gremlin pop up and cause a total lockup of the action. My split stock will be fixed more permanently this time. Looks like a trip to Lowe's for some accra-glass is in order. Thanks for your thread............ and I hope this thread might help someone else should this type incident happen to them. My Widdermatic can run thousands of rounds without haveing any mechanical issues. Smoooooth feeding, positive ejections, etc..... But there are some 'Stealth Gremlins' still out there waiting to rear their ugly heads. ..........Widder
Grizzly Dave Posted June 27, 2015 Posted June 27, 2015 As much as we use our irons, and use them hard at times, sometimes it's amazing we don's have more problems with them than we do. Best of luck with your repair!
Billy the Avenger Posted June 27, 2015 Posted June 27, 2015 Make sure your screws are tight Billy the Avenger
Null N. Void Posted June 27, 2015 Posted June 27, 2015 Yep, Last week my extractor decided to give up without warning on my '73. We run them so hard compared to the original design. SBS
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted June 27, 2015 Posted June 27, 2015 Widder-If it's an internal stock fix. Let me suggest JB Weld. Much stronger the accuglass etc. You want the slow set type. Then when the repair is made. Put it in the warmest place in the house to 'set'. BTW: We ALL know Widder has a few loose screws- Good luck, OLG
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted June 27, 2015 Author Posted June 27, 2015 Widder-If it's an internal stock fix. Let me suggest JB Weld. Much stronger the accuglass etc. You want the slow set type. Then when the repair is made. Put it in the warmest place in the house to 'set'. BTW: We ALL know Widder has a few loose screws- Good luck, OLG Thanks Lumpy..... for the encouraging words...... Yes, I already have some JB Weld and will use it based on your recommendation. and YES, it is inside the tang area of the stock. Its not a serious, totally break of the stock but it is a nice split inside that area. Hey Billy. Yep, I keep the screws pretty snug. Hope to see you at GOA. ...........Widder
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted June 27, 2015 Posted June 27, 2015 Let me know how it works out for you. I have had very good results using JB for hidden stock work. When set, it can be filed and shaped as needed. OLG
Warden Callaway Posted June 27, 2015 Posted June 27, 2015 It helps to make sure there is no oil or finish on the surfaces being glued. I at least rough up the areas and if there is enough wood, I make a tenon or peg of some kind.
Chili Ron Posted June 28, 2015 Posted June 28, 2015 Howdy, Ive seen old rifles with brass tacks or wires used possibly repairs done in the field. You could try that for the look and maybe for a little more strength? Good luck with that wood work, pard. Best CR
Straight Arrow Hombre Posted June 28, 2015 Posted June 28, 2015 Hey Widder, OLG is right on with the JB weld advice. I use PC-7 which is a very similar slow cure 2-part epoxy. Are you gluing an ear back on? If so here's my method for clamping. I use two wood door shims and wrap them in clear packing tape. (Helps with release from epoxy. The tapered shims allow you to control the tension on the inside of the tang cutout. Don't put too much tension or you'll split the stock. Shims just need to be snug. The. Clamp the outside with a quick grip clamp. You can then put another clamp perpendicular to that one. One end on the ear and one on the first clamp. Also I use Johnson's paste wax as a release agent on the tape wrapped shims. Typically very little sanding is required.
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted June 28, 2015 Author Posted June 28, 2015 Lumpy, Chili and Hombre....... Thanks for the tips and suggestions. Chili, because of the nature of the break (crack), I will probably try to fix it as simple as possible. Which will probably be similar to the suggestion from Hombre. Hombre, YES, it is the ear. The SPLIT is the ear and about 1.5 to 2" OVAL type piece of wood. It appears to be a clean split, as it was originally last summer. And it also appears the only thing holding the split piece on is some of the glue fibers down inside the tang area. I would post pixs but don't know how. I didn't pursue to totally remove the split piece or try any repairs until everything is dry. When I made this repair last summer with the Gorilla Glue, I used a nice strong rubber band to hold it in place until it dried. And because of the rubber band texture, I was able to scrape off the stuck portion of the rubber band after it all dried. I like the 'tapered shim' idea. Thanks again everyone. I'll do my repairs tomorrow and have ole Warthog ready for action soon (its a .32 H&R Mag..... ) And Thanks for the JB Weld information. I keep it in my work area but have never used it with wood. Sounds like a great fix-it material. ..........Widder
Warden Callaway Posted June 28, 2015 Posted June 28, 2015 I've not tried Gorilla Glue. A frend that build rustic furniture told me the surfaces need to be dampened with water before applying. I'm assuming the water activities the setting of the glue? I've tried 2-part epoxy and had the repairs fail more than once. I've re-repaired with Brownells Acraglas and have had no failures. I've use JB Weld for metal to matel repairers. One being to add a spring steel shim under the carrier on my Marlin 1894 conversation to C45S. I've used it to replace a missing barrel end plug on a couple of double barrel shotguns. The latest use of JB weld was to add a fish scale size piece of .007 feeler gauge to the end of the cooking rod on my Stevens 311. I was trying the $7.00 fix and went too far. I've not used JB Weld on wood.
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted June 28, 2015 Author Posted June 28, 2015 Howdy Warden. I have also used JBW on attaching a piece of jigsaw blade to the ramp of a carrier to reset the timing. In the 1/2 dozen I've done, I think all but ONE have been successful lasting a couple or more years now. I no longer do the jigsaw modification but rather send the carrier to Gunner Gatlin and let him install his SUPER HARD piece of steel in the ramp and often ask him to give me a .005 or little higner lift in the ramp. This allows for a slightly quicker initial rise in the carrier just in case the owner wants to load a slightly shorter round in the rifle. And it doesn't effect the initial timing of moderately longer rounds. I'm gona try the JBW today. Ifn it don't work, I can always blame Lumpy..... Hope you are doing well. ..........Widder
Warden Callaway Posted June 28, 2015 Posted June 28, 2015 Hijacking the topic a little but here is my version of the carrier - I use some flat spring stock. Hard as glass. It's a bit disturbing to find out how soft the metal the carrier is made from and how fast the snail cam can wear into it.
Texas John Ringo, SASS #10138 Posted June 28, 2015 Posted June 28, 2015 There is now a JB Weld specifically for wood.
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted June 28, 2015 Author Posted June 28, 2015 Ringo, THANKS. I'll have to check into that at the local Lowes or Home Depot. That could really be helpful. ..........Widder
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted June 28, 2015 Author Posted June 28, 2015 Hijacking the topic a little but here is my version of the carrier - I use some flat spring stock. Hard as glass. It's a bit disturbing to find out how soft the metal the carrier is made from and how fast the snail cam can wear into it. You are soooooo right about the metal of the carrier. For its intended purposes of minimal and casual usage in lever action rifles, timing issues might not ever become apparent. But with Cowboy shooting, those timing gremlins can pop up mighty fast when that snail cam starts to wear on the carrier ramp. ..........Widder
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted June 28, 2015 Posted June 28, 2015 There is now a JB Weld specifically for wood. Have you tried it?? I haven't seen this yet. Widder-You may well want to reinforce this fix with a steel rod through the 'tongue' into the wrist if the stock. A 1/8" dia drill rod would work well here. OLG
Texas John Ringo, SASS #10138 Posted June 28, 2015 Posted June 28, 2015 Have you tried it?? I haven't seen this yet. Widder-You may well want to reinforce this fix with a steel rod through the 'tongue' into the wrist if the stock. A 1/8" dia drill rod would work well here. OLG Yes, tried on a Marlin 94 that slipped out of a case and landed on the toe. Broke from the bottom base plate screw hole to right below where the lever ends. Completely broke off. Glued it back, sanded, stained and put pure boiled linseed oil on it.
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted June 28, 2015 Posted June 28, 2015 THX-It's now on my 'gotta-git-it' list. OLG
Warden Callaway Posted June 28, 2015 Posted June 28, 2015 My Marlin slipped from the soft sock I put them in or transport. Fortunately, it landed flat square on my toes. Smarted for a bit but no damage done to the gun.
Colorado Coffinmaker Posted June 28, 2015 Posted June 28, 2015 Just as an addendum, JB Weld (excellent stuff) is a form of two part epoxy. It bonds and forms chemically. The key portion of the job is an absolutely CLEAN surface, free of ANY kind of oils. Once good surface contact is made, very little clamping is required. Gorilla Glue is a polyurethane based adhesive and does need a tiny amount of moisture to adhere and form a good bond. In the past (professional cabinet maker), we did notice some "creep" with Gorilla Glue after curing. Not a fan of Gorilla Glue. Coffinmaker
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