Smokin Gator SASS #29736 Posted June 20, 2017 Share Posted June 20, 2017 Just a heads up. I just received an e mail from Cabelas about backordered Winchester 4440 brass. Don't know how much they have, but some is available. I've had it backordered for a couple of years at 2 places. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Hanger #3720LR Posted June 20, 2017 Share Posted June 20, 2017 44-40 Starline brass is listed as available. Now! Winchester 44-40 brass is manufactured seasonally. Not all year long. My distributer lists 44-40 Winchester as in stock but they will not sell to public. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokin Gator SASS #29736 Posted June 20, 2017 Author Share Posted June 20, 2017 They are sending the back order plus I ordered 250 more cases. I did get some starline but haven't loaded any yet to see how it chambers in my Marlin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warden Callaway Posted June 20, 2017 Share Posted June 20, 2017 Grafs show it in stock but at nearly twice the price of Starline. I only have experience with Starline. It seems to work just fine in my guns. https://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/19618 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noah Cash Posted June 20, 2017 Share Posted June 20, 2017 I grabbed 1000 Starline a couple years ago and it works fine in Win (Mrouku) "73 and Taylors Runnin Irons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Whiskers Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 It would seem Winchester has gone to "we want to keep stuff for retail products". AA featherlite powder is available if you can find some old stock; but someone in here a while back said Winchester is keeping it in house for their lo recoil lo noise SG shells. I tried to contact Winchester a while back to see about the powder and 44-40 brass and NO ONE there would answer the phone OR email. Same thing with the 220 grain bullets their factory cowboy loads use. I can understand that being a proprietary product. The Winchester 44-40 brass can be found on Gunbroker and Auction Arms if you want to pay the price to get it. Starline is much more reasonable although I do prefer the Winchester brass when I can find it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokin Gator SASS #29736 Posted June 21, 2017 Author Share Posted June 21, 2017 I still need to give the Starline a try. I had trouble with some brass,can't remember the brand, in the past. Others have mentioned having good results with Winchester especially when loading .429 or .430 bullets as far as it chambering in their gun. Anyway just letting those that want it, some is available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Whiskers Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 I have a couple of pistols that don't like the .430 bullets. I started ordering .428 bullets and they not only chamber easier, but they work better with any brand of brass, even RP brass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warden Callaway Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 11 minutes ago, Charlie Whiskers said: I have a couple of pistols that don't like the .430 bullets. I started ordering .428 bullets and they not only chamber easier, but they work better with any brand of brass, even RP brass. I'd read so much about the throats being so tight on 44WCF that they wouldn't work on anything larger than 428 bullet diameter. And people having accuracy problem with throats tighter than bore diameter and having to open up the throats to match the bores. When I started loading for my Marlin, I got Starline brass from Grafs. I don't think they had the Winchester in stock at that time and I wouldn't have paid that much for it anyway. I used 200g 430 diameter SNS bullets because that's what I already had a stock of. Then i got the Smoke Wagons so I just used the same loads and they worked just fine. The other day I was cleaning the Smoke Wagons so I went to the loading bench and got a bullet. I measured it to confirm it was 430 diameter. I was a little shocked to see it drop through the throats of the chambers on both guns. It's not easy to get a consistent reading with measuring the throats with a caliper but I was getting 433-435 diameter. Here is 5 from one SW and 5 from the other. Here is a 5 shot group from 160g 430 diameter bullets from Badman. BlackMZ loads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driftwood Johnson, SASS #38283 Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 Howdy When I first started loading 44-40 I used Winchester brass exclusively. Winchester has the thinnest brass at the case mouth of any 44-40 brass I measured, usually about .007. This helped when a 'fat' bullet such as .428 or .429 was needed for a tight chamber. But eventually I became disenchanted with Winchester because the brass was difficult to find. I understand they don't make it very often. I have been using Starline brass exclusively for 44-40 for a number of years now. It is usually available, and the brass is just about as thin at the case mouth as Winchester. Usually runs between .007 and .008. Whenever I need more I order 250 or 500, don't remember right now. I also use Starline exclusively for 45 Colt now, and 45 Schofield, 44 Russian, and 38-40. I don't even bother looking for anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Hanger #3720LR Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 If you run one of the Winchester 60,66 or 73s, you may have had issues with extraction. My suggestion is to measure the rim groove where the extractor drops in to grab the case. I found that Starline has the most generous groove width and depth that allows the extractor to get a better grip. In most cases where extraction was a problem, I found that just changing to Starline usually took care of the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Whiskers Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 Before I started reloading I was buying factory 44-40 cowboy loads. Back then they ran about $11-15 (that was my dealer cost at that time) by the case lot. I was shooting a Uberti 75 Remington and an OMV. I had no problems getting Winchester factory loads to chamber in the 75, and the Ruger would digest any brand. The Ultramax used Starline brass. I had to go through each 50 round box of the Ultramax and see which would chamber in the 75. Out of a 50 round box maybe 20-30 would go. Those were put into a 2nd box marked 75. What I shoot now is the 75 once in a while and, Great Western Pietta built Alchemista's, and they all chamber fine with the .428 and any brand of brass. My 73 isn't picky and never has been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trailrider #896 Posted June 21, 2017 Share Posted June 21, 2017 Don't know how the new runs of Winchester brass are, but the thousand or so I originally acquired about 20 years ago have been reloaded about 20+ times, with the only losses where my Rossi old Cougar in .44-40 would "pitcher mouth" the case on ejection, and the bend was, in some few instances, too much to work out. The other lost cases were literally lost in tall grass. I still use .430" hardcast commercial (BHN 17-22) in my OM Vaqueros with the .425" throats, and get excellent accuracy at 25 yds. If the current lots of Winchester .44-40 brass are as good as the old lots, I'd go for them. Of course I'm not shooting CAS as much as I used to, and have about 400 rounds of brass on my loading bench waiting to be reloaded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 I guess I am something of an oddity. I use all kinds of different brass for .44-40. I have a mix of Winchester, Remington, Starline, Hornday, and a few random cases of other makers that I can't remember off the top of my head. Over the years this brass has been aquired as new brass found in the stores or gunshows, and sometimes as loaded ammo when I was really in a need for more brass but could not find any empties or when some off brand was at my local gunshop for an unsually low price. I make no effort to sort the brass by manufacturer, reload with .428" bullets, Trailboss for smokeless and some stuff in black for use in antique revolvers. Never had any problems with this system. I have a good supply of brass now. Not seen a need to purchase loaded ammo in I can't remember how long. For brass, well, if I am at a gunshow and I happen to come across some for a good price, I'll pick some up. Keep in mind that I shoot several different calibers so I don't burn through brass as often as some other do. But I use pretty much the same system for every caliber I load. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozark Shark Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 Love Starline 44-40. I bought 1,000 rounds 4 years ago and still cycling 95%+ of it. No failures, but a few crushed by feet beyond use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duffield, SASS #23454 Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 On 6/21/2017 at 8:53 PM, H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 said: I guess I am something of an oddity. I use all kinds of different brass for .44-40. I have a mix of Winchester, Remington, Starline, Hornday, and a few random cases of other makers that I can't remember off the top of my head. Over the years this brass has been aquired as new brass found in the stores or gunshows, and sometimes as loaded ammo when I was really in a need for more brass but could not find any empties or when some off brand was at my local gunshop for an unsually low price. I make no effort to sort the brass by manufacturer, reload with .428" bullets, Trailboss for smokeless and some stuff in black for use in antique revolvers. Never had any problems with this system. I have a good supply of brass now. Not seen a need to purchase loaded ammo in I can't remember how long. For brass, well, if I am at a gunshow and I happen to come across some for a good price, I'll pick some up. Keep in mind that I shoot several different calibers so I don't burn through brass as often as some other do. But I use pretty much the same system for every caliber I load. I'm with Uriah on this, except that I use .430 bullets. Never a problem in my Vaqueros, Uberti 1873 rifle or a pair of cattlemen. Starline makes great brass, and they were kind enough to give me a tour of the factory a couple of years ago, Duffield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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