Hoss Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 Just bought a pocket pistol, 2nd model 38SW manufactured around 1889 I think. I know no load data can be posted, but if anybody would care to PM me some info, I would appreciate it. I know these were designed for BP, but I've read lots of different forums that indicate that light smokeless loads, and even the factory available loads are safe to shoot in these old guns, provided they are tight and lock up well to start with. I've even read that S&W has said they are safe to shoot smokeless with. Of course I've heard the old quote, attributed to Abraham Lincoln, that one should not believe everything posted on the internet! What do yall think? I'm really looking forward to tinkering with this old gun, and trying out pocket pistol side matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
German Jim Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 I have an H&R in .38 S&W and have shot factory smokeless rounds through it. It funtioned fine until it broke. Something internally like a spring. The last patent date on the barrel is April 7, 1896. I had a good gunsmith fix it and since then I've shot nothing but BP through it. I don't know if fireing smokeless "broke" it or not, but no more smokeless for my little H&R. I've had no problem with BP. I would advise BP only, but maybe I'm just overly cautious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Fill 'Em 67797 Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 I used to have a few and shot light smokeless loads in them without issue. I used this load data: http://www.reloadammo.com/38sw.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 I've got several old pocket pistols in .38 S&W, and even the ones made in the smokeless era get BP loads. Typical BP load, fill to the bullet base. Use a BP lubed .360" sized bullet. I like a 140 grain RNFP. There are way too many of these pocket pistols loosened to the point of no longer being functional or even safe to shoot for me to shoot anything but BP in them. Good luck, GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butch McGie, SASS#71758 Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 In the center of a Hodgdon reloading manual, just before the Shotshell Data, there is a section on Cowboy Loads. It lists several for 38 S&W. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bramble Mountain Buzzard Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 I have a "Lemon Squeezer" of same vintage as yours. I'd stay away from smokeless. They are not big strong modern guns. Why take the chance? Besides fill that 38 full of black powder and top it off with a 146 grainer and you still have almost no recoil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedalia Dave Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 Stick with the BP or a sub. It is not about how tight the gun is. Even if the gun was factory new unfired condition it doesn't matter. It is all about the strength of the metal. Metallurgy was not as advanced when that pistol was made as it is now. You may have a gun strong enough to take light or even moderate smokeless loads or you may have a pistol that will fail with the first round, the 10th, the thousandth or never. There is no easy way of ever knowing. So ask yourself if you want to take that gamble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat Brules Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 Hi Hoss,It IS about the metal available for firearms manufacture back in the mid-to-late 1800's. But it's (obviously) the difference in how black powder vs. smokeless powder ignites and and burns is what causes the issues. Graphically, one ignites and burns in a long arc; the other ignites and spikes when it detonates, kind of like the impact of a sledge hammer. The older metalurgy can't stand up to that, no matter how you reduce your loads or if you mix black with smokeless. Reduced loads only delay the inevitible. I recommend you don't use smokeless in any amount or configuration in a weapon designed for black powder use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ninety Caliber Al, 50218 Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 I have a 2nd model single action made in 1880 and shoot ony BP. I'm shooting 148 gr hollow based wadcutters and seating them about midway . With APP you can use bullets lubed or smokeless and leans is real easy . Loads by plume same as the "Holy Black". A hoot to shoot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linn Keller, SASS 27332, BOLD 103 Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 You've already received much good advice. To my learned colleagues I can add only that I am using HBWCs for the payload. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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