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Bart Solo

Dry Fire At Loading Table

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Just curious why the two different methods is preferred.

 

My guess is that got one of them terribly wrong. Dry firing is as if you were shooting your gun except you do not have any ammo in the chamber. Mistakes often do and will eventually happen. So now you're instructing that full speed dropping of the hammer is a OK. Now what happens when that mistake happens? Quite easy, a round is going when and where you did not intend on it going. It could go in a harmless direction and do nothing except change the color of one's pants. On the other hand it could make contact with something/someone that you had no intention of your backstop. Right now, I could care less about the SASS rules, because common sense and manufacturers warnings (ten rules of safety) are more specific and considerably safer than SASS's. SASS prides itself on its safety record yet they are set up to have a big ding in that record that I promise you will not read too well in the local or national papers. Smithy.

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My guess is that got one of them terribly wrong. Dry firing is as if you were shooting your gun except you do not have any ammo in the chamber. Mistakes often do and will eventually happen. So now you're instructing that full speed dropping of the hammer is a OK. Now what happens when that mistake happens? Quite easy, a round is going when and where you did not intend on it going. It could go in a harmless direction and do nothing except change the color of one's pants. On the other hand it could make contact with something/someone that you had no intention of your backstop. Right now, I could care less about the SASS rules, because common sense and manufacturers warnings (ten rules of safety) are more specific and considerably safer than SASS's. SASS prides itself on its safety record yet they are set up to have a big ding in that record that I promise you will not read too well in the local or national papers. Smithy.

 

Actually, the proper phrase is "I couldn't care less"...unless you actually could care less...

 

Seriously, you need to go to matches more...see what actually goes on there, and then you'll understand better what is going on.

 

I always dryfire my rifle. I always slowly close the bolt making sure that the rifle is unloaded and does not have a round in the chamber before I dry fire it. But I'm damned if I'm going to get a SDQ for having the hammer on the safety notch!

 

Oh yea, I also visually check that the follower is visible. That way I know that a round isn't stuck in the tube.

 

Then I make sure that the gun is pointing in a safe direction.

 

There ya go! It's safe now! No black magic going to insert a round in my gun.

 

Oy!

 

:wacko:

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My guess is that got one of them terribly wrong. Dry firing is as if you were shooting your gun except you do not have any ammo in the chamber. Mistakes often do and will eventually happen. So now you're instructing that full speed dropping of the hammer is a OK. Now what happens when that mistake happens? Quite easy, a round is going when and where you did not intend on it going. It could go in a harmless direction and do nothing except change the color of one's pants. On the other hand it could make contact with something/someone that you had no intention of your backstop. Right now, I could care less about the SASS rules, because common sense and manufacturers warnings (ten rules of safety) are more specific and considerably safer than SASS's. SASS prides itself on its safety record yet they are set up to have a big ding in that record that I promise you will not read too well in the local or national papers. Smithy.

I thought you were through with SASS shooting due to physical ailments. I must have missed that you were back shooting.

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Cold Canyon I am through with the shooting portion but still have fond memories of when I did get to shoot and like to hear about you folks and the current goings on with SASS. It is a sport I miss deeply, more so than any other shooting sport I've been involved in. And......

 

Seriously, you need to go to matches more...see what actually goes on there, and then you'll understand better what is going on.

 

Phantom, I was speaking from a very biased position with my job of 25 years that had me armed quite a few times throughout though my main position was that of dispatcher, I still strapped on the iron when called upon. In my department, they owned and maintained all of the firearms so we'd show up 15-20 minutes ahead of shift and management were sticklers about picking up and dropping off the firearms. After dropping the magazines both handgun and long-arm we'd pull the bolt back to show that it was empty. Only for the weapons supervisor immediately doing the same, by pulling the bolt back to make sure the chamber was empty. After this double check happened the gun was secured into a bullet box (or something similar it was called) and the trigger pulled to where if the gun went off, the round would safely go into the bullet trap and be contained. I remember that that bullet trap had to earn its keep on a few occasions even though the gun was checked twice? Go figure. Same procedure was done on both rifle and handgun and only the handgun was kept with a live round in the chamber, not the rifle. The academy was filled with teaching paranoia and fear about passing off a weapon to a partner or turning it in or picking it up. I guess some of that 25 years worth of drilling has rubbed off on me a little bit. Smithy.

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An observation and a question.

I was mistaken that it was obvious to the most casual observer that the rifle has no rounds in the chamber or mag when the hammer is lowered and not so the revolver.

Do you really advocate pulling the trigger on ANY firearm without full control and complete knowledge of where it is pointing? Hope not.

 

Be careful out there pards.

 

BJT

 

Nope. But I don't drop the hammer on my rifle, I ease it down. Same with the pistols.

 

Now in WBAS I do drop the hammer/dry fire the 97 to make sure it is gonna feed that first round up outta the mag.

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If you are pulling the trigger and letting the hammer fall, no. Ease the hammer down, yes.

 

Maybe I was taught wrong - A firearm is always loaded.

 

How many of you folks advocating dry firing at the loading table would take that same firearm, put the barrel on your foot and pull the trigger?

 

When I was a youngster, I did just that with a "unloaded" .22. I had the habit of setting the gun barrel on my foot. Fortunately, that time I shot a hole in the floor. Lesson learned. A firearm is always loaded.

 

The next time any of you "let the hammer fall" think about putting the barrel on your foot and pulling the trigger. No sweat, right? What's a hole in one foot?

 

A firearm is always loaded. Too much common sense for ya?

 

Doc

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First, I accept the ruling .

 

But WHY is it UNSAFE to shoulder the rifle and pull the trigger but SAFE to hold it down low and pull the trigger ?

 

Just wondering.

 

Also, since a number of posts claim that your know that the rifle is unloaded because you show it to the loading officer, where in the rules does it require you to cycle or show at the loading table ?

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First, I accept the ruling .

 

But WHY is it UNSAFE to shoulder the rifle and pull the trigger but SAFE to hold it down low and pull the trigger ?

 

Just wondering.

 

Also, since a number of posts claim that your know that the rifle is unloaded because you show it to the loading officer, where in the rules does it require you to cycle or show at the loading table ?

 

It's not a question about safety...it's all about sitting at the loading table and...warming up...practicing...etc.

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All you pards that drop the hammer unabated on the rifle surely don't do the same with yer pistols do ya? Just curious why the two different methods is preferred. So long as I can keep easing my rifle hammer down I am a happy camper. Sorry to have got so many knickers in a knot but I'm sure I wasn't the only one not clear on this controversy.

 

 

Just to answer your question, I drop the hammer on the rifle before I load, but after checking for "clear." I pull the trigger and drop the hammer rather than lowering it to make certain that I am not leaving the hammer in the half-cock postion on my '73. Then I load.

 

With my pistols, USFA Single Actions, I lower the hammer because the gun is now loaded, and to avoid peening out the hole in the recoil shield, which creates drag on the shell bases. (I have had that)

 

Others' mileage may vary, of course!

 

Buena suerte, amigo!

eGG

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It's not a question about safety...it's all about sitting at the loading table and...warming up...practicing...etc.

 

That is EXACTLY the reason that the rule/definition specifies "bringing into a shooting position".

 

Before the implementation of the NO DRY FIRING rule, it was common practice by some competitors to do a "function check" at the LT by dry firing (as defined) prior to loading.

Revolvers were cycled and/or rifle was levered & hammers dropped same as if being fired.

 

IIRC, a less-experienced shooter at the LT was next in line to a shooter doing just that and, thinking it was a good idea, proceeded to do the same with a revolver that had already been LOADED.

 

That incident was one of the reasons for establishing the current rule/definition.

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If you are pulling the trigger and letting the hammer fall, no. Ease the hammer down, yes.

 

Maybe I was taught wrong - A firearm is always loaded.

 

How many of you folks advocating dry firing at the loading table would take that same firearm, put the barrel on your foot and pull the trigger?

 

When I was a youngster, I did just that with a "unloaded" .22. I had the habit of setting the gun barrel on my foot. Fortunately, that time I shot a hole in the floor. Lesson learned. A firearm is always loaded.

 

The next time any of you "let the hammer fall" think about putting the barrel on your foot and pulling the trigger. No sweat, right? What's a hole in one foot?

 

A firearm is always loaded. Too much common sense for ya?

 

Doc

 

COMMON SENSE and SAFETY is PRECISELY why I let the hammer fall unabated when I pull the trigger on my rifle at the loading table. But I sure don't point my muzzle at my foot! Or anything else that I wouldn't want to shoot. I keep the muzzle pointed in the designated safe direction(down range, at a berm, at a baffle, etc.) That is the purpose of having loading tables, to assure you are loading your firearms in as safe a manner as possible. And as I stated in an earlier post on this thread, I feel it is safer to have an A.D. at the loading table with your rifle pointed in a safe direction. Easing the hammer down(while an approved method by the rules) to me could lead to having the hammer down on a live round which could lead to an A.D. in an unsafe direction should you happen to stumble, drop your rifle, etc. on the way to the firing line. I'm willing to risk the MDQ at the loading table using what I consider to be the SAFER practice of dropping the hammer UNABATED while the rifle is pointed in a SAFE direction. Others may feel differently. As long as SASS rules are followed I'm fine with whichever method a pard/pardette chooses for him/herself. :)

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In a way I am sorry I started this discussion but, on the other hand, I am glad we have looked closely at the rules concerning dry firing at the loading table.

 

I have always eased my hammer down, but at POP this year I watched as several out of town shooters dropped their hammers unabated after cycling their actions to show their rifles clear. They all seemed to have a reason for doing it, and I figured POP wasn't the first rodeo for anybody who can shoot a 17 second stage. :rolleyes:

 

I have enjoyed this thread, but I think we are churning.

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Good day ye merry band of Gentlemen,

 

Now for the next round of discussion may I propose the subject of dryfiring at the unloading table. You know you have seen it many times. Shooter shows clear, spins the cylinder on his trusty sixshooter, cocks the hammer and snaps the trigger or cycles the lever on his long gun several times to show clear then snaps the trigger to drop the hammer.

 

Aye, maybe this is not a good topic as the list of DQ's may make for short possees.

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Good day ye merry band of Gentlemen,

 

Now for the next round of discussion may I propose the subject of dryfiring at the unloading table. You know you have seen it many times. Shooter shows clear, spins the cylinder on his trusty sixshooter, cocks the hammer and snaps the trigger or cycles the lever on his long gun several times to show clear then snaps the trigger to drop the hammer.

 

Aye, maybe this is not a good topic as the list of DQ's may make for short possees.

AGREED!

 

But...if you insist...please start another thread.

 

I think this'uns about played out.

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Good day ye merry band of Gentlemen,

 

Now for the next round of discussion may I propose the subject of dryfiring at the unloading table. You know you have seen it many times. Shooter shows clear, spins the cylinder on his trusty sixshooter, cocks the hammer and snaps the trigger or cycles the lever on his long gun several times to show clear then snaps the trigger to drop the hammer.

 

Aye, maybe this is not a good topic as the list of DQ's may make for short possees.

 

The only weapon that you drop the hammer to show clear after chech'n for a clear chamber is the 1911.

Long guns have action open when you leave the OLT.

Revolvers, never seen the "pull the trigger deal" to show clear at the OLT. I have been a RO2 for many years and worked many OLTs at shoots here and out of state.

LG

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The only weapon that you drop the hammer to show clear after chech'n for a clear chamber is the 1911.

Long guns have action open when you leave the OLT.

Revolvers, never seen the "pull the trigger deal" to show clear at the OLT. I have been a RO2 for many years and worked many OLTs at shoots here and out of state.

LG

 

We are talking SASS/CAS here...

 

These thingies that we use in this game are GUNS...they are not used against anyone...therefore they are not WEAPONS.

 

OY!

 

:wacko:

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We are talking SASS/CAS here...

 

These thingies that we use in this game are GUNS...they are not used against anyone...therefore they are not WEAPONS.

 

OY!

 

:wacko:

 

 

Agree and good point.

 

Firearms,rifles, pistols, shotguns, and guns in general and the sort are really TOOLS that has the ability to deliver a projectile at some distance if used in the hands of a human. A nail gun fits that description as well. It (firearms) can be used as a tool to inflict serious injury and possible death if used as a weapon in the hands of a human. It can not do it on its own.

 

Just about any object (tool) can be easily converted to a 'weapon' ,,,, all depends on the intent of the human using it..

 

 

At least that is how I see it.

 

Blastmaster

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What's an OLT? Now at the ULT why would anyone dry fire the rifle? It has to be open to leave from the ULT to return it to the cart.

 

And no we do not use weapons in this game. We use cowboy gunz.

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We are talking SASS/CAS here...

 

These thingies that we use in this game are GUNS...they are not used against anyone...therefore they are not WEAPONS.

 

OY!

 

:wacko:

There ya go Fantum, now I have to start a thread about the weapons we use in CAS.

 

Fillmore

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We are talking SASS/CAS here...

 

These thingies that we use in this game are GUNS...they are not used against anyone...therefore they are not WEAPONS.

 

OY!

 

:wacko:

 

Get over it :rolleyes:

They are weapons used for sport.....

LG

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What's an OLT? Now at the ULT why would anyone dry fire the rifle? It has to be open to leave from the ULT to return it to the cart.

 

And no we do not use weapons in this game. We use cowboy gunz.

 

ULT it is......

LG

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Get over it :rolleyes:

They are weapons used for sport.....

LG

 

And...Baseball bat are weapons used for sport...and forks are weapons used for eating...and pens are weapons used for writing...

 

Ya need to get over the fact that they are tools that are weapons only when used as such.

 

:FlagAm:

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GEEEZZZZ... :wacko:

Do I see the topic changin' :blink:

 

Rance <_<

Thinkin' I thought it was over on post #18 :mellow:

 

 

Edit: Sorry I was mistaken... :blush:

It was answered correctly by Wyatt in post #2 :unsure:

PaleWolf verified the correct answer in post #25 :rolleyes::)

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And...Baseball bat are weapons used for sport...and forks are weapons used for eating...and pens are weapons used for writing...

 

Ya need to get over the fact that they are tools that are weapons only when used as such.

 

:FlagAm:

 

Now, say good night Phantom :lol: :lol:

OH, BTW baseball bats, forks and pens do not have serial numbers or are they regulated by the BATFE ;)

You call'em whatever you want, as will I <_<

 

LG

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Now, say good night Phantom :lol: :lol:

OH, BTW baseball bats, forks and pens do not have serial numbers or are they regulated by the BATFE ;)

You call'em whatever you want, as will I <_<

 

LG

 

Automobiles, buses, trucks and such have serial numbers and are not regulated by the BATFE, but are not called weapons even though they cause thousands of injury and death per year.

 

So in your world, if whatever is regulated by the BATFE, then

 

it lumped into the 'WEAPON" catagory automatically?

 

BATFE = Beaurau of Alcohol,Tobacco, Firearms, Enforcement? Something like that? In your world they should have named it BATWE =Beaurau of Alcohol,Tobacco, WEAPONS, Enforcement

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Now, say good night Phantom :lol: :lol:

OH, BTW baseball bats, forks and pens do not have serial numbers or are they regulated by the BATFE ;)

You call'em whatever you want, as will I dry.gif

 

LG

 

 

Boy, you didn't think that one out.........hang on its gonna be a Lumpy ride ;)

 

Wyatt

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Now, say good night Phantom :lol: :lol:

OH, BTW baseball bats, forks and pens do not have serial numbers or are they regulated by the BATFE ;)

You call'em whatever you want, as will I <_<

 

LG

 

Then I'll only use guns that have no serial number...and are cap 'n ball...there ya go!

 

Too funny...serial numbers and regulated by BATFE...great logic...great arguement!

 

:lol:

 

Sorry that you don't see the silliness of your position.

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:lol: :lol: Sure don't take much to wind you up does it? :o;)

I'm going shoot'n..... B)

God I love this place.........It's better than pay TV.

:D ,

LG

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Interesting how the Wire has changed over the years. In the distant past, some posts have been deleted where the poster continuously used the W------ word instead of gun, pistol, rifle, shotgun. It was rare but happened.

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And...Baseball bat are weapons used for sport...and forks are weapons used for eating...and pens are weapons used for writing...

 

Ya need to get over the fact that they are tools that are weapons only when used as such.

 

:FlagAm:

 

:lol: In PA, you can't walk into a court house with a baseball bat, cause it will be deemed to be a weapon. I dare you to try walking in with a fork. ^_^ And, the pen is mightier than the sword, so it must be a weapon :lol:

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Seems we still haven't discovered what the meaning of is, is. This thread defies lodgic.

 

RBK

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:lol: :lol: Sure don't take much to wind you up does it? :o;)

I'm going shoot'n..... B)

God I love this place.........It's better than pay TV.

:D ,

LG

 

DIVERT-DIVERT-DIVERT!!!!!!

 

Actually, I'm not wound up at all...and I probably shoot a lot more then you.

 

Fact is that you call guns weapons regardless of whether they are being used as such...and I have ALWAYS found that funny. Then of course you had no real arguement for it.

 

so...you did the only logical thing...

 

:wacko:

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