Need high load density recipes for .32 WCF (.32-20)

[Ustas B. Slim 24680]

To the Esteemed Collection of the Wise and Erudite,

I am looking for recommendations for a high density load for my .32 WCF that yields low pressure,  velocities in the 900fps range out of my wife and daughter's Pasta SAA clones with 4 3/4 barrels for Cowboy Action Shooting.

My current load is a 115 pill (.313 from https://cowboybullets.com/32-cal-115-grain_p_11.html ) over 4.6gr of Unique with a CCI 400 SRP.

My goal is to teach my youngest daughter to reload the .32WCF and I want a powder that makes a double charge observable by eye.   And of course I want limited leading on non-GC boolits and small velocity SDs and meters well in a Dillion Percussion powder measure:).

Here is my current "menu" of options:

 

 

 

as text

Burn           Mfg                Powder                       VDM             Gr per CC            Max Load               Load                    Starting           Load
Rate                                                                     Density/cc                                              gr                Density CCs            Load    gr     Density CC

9                  Alliant             Red Dot                    0.1413                7.077                      4.10                       0.58                           3.69           0.52
11                 Hodgdon        Clays                         0.1462               6.840                      4.50                     0.66                            4.05          0.59
13                Hodgdon        HI-SKOR 700-X       0.1343               7.446                       3.90                     0.52                            3.51            0.47
20               Alliant              Green Dot                0.1262               7.924                       4.50                     0.57                            4.05           0.51
34               Alliant              Unique                      0.1092               9.158                       4.60                     0.50                            4.14           0.45
38               Alliant              Herco                         0.1122                8.913                       4.90                     0.55                             4.41           0.49
57               Alliant              2400                           0.0742              13.477                     8.30                     0.62                             7.47           0.55
69               IMR                  4227                            0.0769              13.004                    9.70                      0.75                             8.73           0.67
71                Accurate         5744                            0.0752              13.307                    8.50                      0.64                             7.65           0.58
72               Accurate         1680                             0.0655              15.267                    13.00                    0.85                             11.70           0.77
77               Alliant              Reloader 7                 0.0728              13.736                    15.50                     1.13                              13.95           1.02
79               IMR                  4198                             0.0792               12.626                    12.40                   0.98                             11.16           0.88
                                
References                                
1   https://hodgdonpowderco.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/04/updatedburnrateschart-1.pdf  Nov-23    Burn Rate
2   https://www.tacticoolproducts.com/powder.pdf      Density    

Thoughts?

Thanks in advance

[Warden Callaway]

Black powder.  Can't get too much.

[Ustas B. Slim 24680]

Thanks @Warden Callaway, but not on the menu - yet...

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

25 minutes ago, Ustas B. Slim 24680 said:

Thanks @Warden Callaway, but not on the menu - yet...

What powders do you have on hand?

Several you listed, ain't that easy to find these dayz.  

[Warden Callaway]

I'd suggest a RCBS powder stop die but if I remember right,  the rod is too big for the 32WCF.  

 

Next safest thing is to charge in loading block and check the charges. I've looked thousands this way and no missed or double charge.

 

This is black powder but you get the idea.

 

[Ustas B. Slim 24680]

@Warden Callaway, really appreciate the suggestions.  I am an accomplished black powder enthusiast have shoot BP in SASS in .45 Colt, .44-WF and .45-70, as well as in .44 Navies and .45 Walkers.   But BP is not on the menu for the little girl.  In .32WCF even with grease cookies and Bore Butter tends to fowl-up after about 50 rounds out of the pistols.  Also BP is more static sensitive than most smokeless.  I want to teach the daughter reloading using our Dillion 550s first.  Then if she wants to shoot BP, I'll teacher how to do BP for .32WCF using one of our single stage presses.

[Ustas B. Slim 24680]

@The Original Lumpy Gritz what I have on hand is Unique, WST, WSF, BLC-2, 5744and powders for .30 cals (.308, 300 Savage, .30-06) nothing other than the 5744 which will give me a high loading density in the .32WCF. the 5744 I currently have on had is reserved for the .38.55, which is the wife's big bore target powder and the youngest daughter's deer round.

 

I'm planning ahead and accounting for the search time.  The next week end their is the Tri State Collectors Gun Show in Lima Oh, which is usually powder rich and the weekend after that is the next Ohio Gun Collectors Show, which typically has some powder.  I expect I'll find some pound containers of some of the alternatives on my list.  Then after some test lots, if we get good results, I'll search out 4# and 8# kegs to have some inventory.

 

And then of course is the daughter gets serious about Cowboy Shooting, with the wife also shooting .32WCF, I'll easily need to plan for on the order of 10K rounds a season.... (2 shoots a month x 5 months X 2 shooters + practice round

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

7 minutes ago, Ustas B. Slim 24680 said:

@The Original Lumpy Gritz what I have on hand is Unique, WST, WSF, BLC-2, 5744and powders for .30 cals (.308, 300 Savage, .30-06) nothing other than the 5744 which will give me a high loading density in the .32WCF. the 5744 I currently have on had is reserved for the .38.55, which is the wife's big bore target powder and the youngest daughter's deer round.

 

I'm planning ahead and accounting for the search time.  The next week end their is the Tri State Collectors Gun Show in Lima Oh, which is usually powder rich and the weekend after that is the next Ohio Gun Collectors Show, which typically has some powder.  I expect I'll find some pound containers of some of the alternatives on my list.  Then after some test lots, if we get good results, I'll search out 4# and 8# kegs to have some inventory.

 

And then of course is the daughter gets serious about Cowboy Shooting, with the wife also shooting .32WCF, I'll easily need to plan for on the order of 10K rounds a season.... (2 shoots a month x 5 months X 2 shooters + practice round

Of what you have, I would go with Unique. Start with a middle of the road load and a firm roll-crimp. 

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

BTW, you can use SPP in that .32WCF.

Your current load w/Unique, doubt the case will hold a double charge. 

[H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619]

If it comes back, try Trailboss.  A double charge of even a minimum load will overflow the case.

[Colorado Coffinmaker]

Whilst probably not on your menu (yet), you might give a thought to APP.  Large Powder bar so it won't bridge, 3f APP to the bottom of the bullet (any weight bullet) and fire away.  No pesky lube problems (don't need lube, actually), and easy clean-up.  Try it - - yule like it 

[Warden Callaway]

Started my boys out on Lyman Spartan press.  Chris is still using it at 51. 

 

[Abilene, SASS # 27489]

If you don't already have one, get a LED light kit for the 550.  I don't load .32 on the Dillon, but with low density WST in a .38, it is pretty low down in the case but I can still see it.  Get into the habit of looking down into the case after every upstroke, regardless of which powder.

 

As for loads, I loaded a couple hundred 32-20 with 5.0gr of Unique under a 115gr bullet, and it was fine.  I noticed a lot of variation in loading manuals.  That load was in the Laser Cast loading manual.  I don't recall what min and max were and that manual is 90 miles away.

[Ustas B. Slim 24680]

@The Original Lumpy Gritz, My current load is a 115 pill (.313 from https://cowboybullets.com/32-cal-115-grain_p_11.html ) over 4.6gr of Unique with a CCI 400 SRP..  And my .32 WCF cases will hold a double charge.  You can see tht its double loaded, but the case still holds it all.  That why I'm looking at higher load densities.  I want it to spill out of the case.

[Cholla]

Red Dot is about as close as you’re going to get to your requirements unless Trail Boss comes back soon. But even with Red Dot I don’t believe it’s going to over fill the case to the point it’s spilling out. 

[Warden Callaway]

I took a picture of the die block with 32WCF dies. Of interest is the RCBS powder level check die. Small enough rod to go into the 32WCF case. But only gives a visual display.  Doesn't alarm or block machine. 

 

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

2 hours ago, Ustas B. Slim 24680 said:

@The Original Lumpy Gritz, My current load is a 115 pill (.313 from https://cowboybullets.com/32-cal-115-grain_p_11.html ) over 4.6gr of Unique with a CCI 400 SRP..  And my .32 WCF cases will hold a double charge.  You can see tht its double loaded, but the case still holds it all.  That why I'm looking at higher load densities.  I want it to spill out of the case.

If loading on a progressive press.

Use a powder ck die.

Your only other choice is real BP.

FYI, most cartridges using smokeless, can easily hold a double charge of powder.

 

[Bison Bud]

First off, from the info. provided, I'd say that Unique is a good choice and Clays would also work well, but it's out of production right now unless something has changed that I don't know about.  As for your concerns over a double charge, I don't blame you one bit, but finding a propellant that will overflow the case on a double charge may be a tall order.  I too load on a Dillon 550B and since I really like the Lee Factory crimp die, I seat the bullet and do my crimping in positions 3 and 4.  Since that leaves me with no place for a powder check die, I have learned to leave the position 3 alignment pin out of the base plate and literally pull every case off the press and inspect the powder drop manually before putting it back into position 3 and seating a bullet.  Once inspected and returned to the press, you can easily keep the case in place with your finger on the base of the case as you start the ram upwards.  While this does slow things down a bit, I think it's worth the extra effort and in over 30 years of reloading, I have never made it to the range with a double charge or and empty case squib.  As I have said many times before, "If you want to shoot fast, it's probably better to load slow!"  Good luck and good shooting to all.   

 

I came back to edit this post, as I wanted to clarify that my 30 years of reloading was not all on the Dillon 550B.  I started with a Lee Turret Press and used it for quite a while before upgrading to the Dillon.  I still use the turret press for my 45/70 loads, but the Dillon loads everything else.  Anyway, my anti-double charge procedure was much the same with the Turret press, as I still removed the case after the powder drop and inspected the charge manually prior to seating the bullet.

 

I also wanted to mention that Trail Boss is probably the bulkiest powder out there and many folks in this game liked it primarily for that reason.  Unfortunately, it too has been out of production, but it is supposed to be coming back and some folks have been able to find some recently.  Whether that was old stock or new stock, I have no idea, but if you can get a hold on some I think it might serve your initial purpose well.  Again, good luck and good shooting to all.  

[Cusz M. Dutch SASS Life 55326]

https://www.leverguns.com/articles/paco/3220wcf.htm

 

tin can all the way up to bear loads