hud Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 hmm, cost. 2 bucks more for a box of 500 45s then 38s. primers are the same. more powder true that, but in an 8 lb keg, who notices. brass, a few bucks more per bag. Im not really seein the overall here. oh well, just my 2 cents, oh, didnt factor that in hud Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Shapiro Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 hmm, cost. 2 bucks more for a box of 500 45s then 38s. primers are the same. more powder true that, but in an 8 lb keg, who notices. brass, a few bucks more per bag. Im not really seein the overall here. oh well, just my 2 cents, oh, didnt factor that in hud At 50,000 rounds or more a year, it adds up quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hud Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 I thinkin not many people shoot NEAR that much, but ok. hud Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Coles SASS 1188 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Only to a certain point, afterwhich it slows ya down. A light loaded 45 is more then capable of performing at top-speeds. Remember that match speeds are a bit different then Side Match speeds. Cheers! Phantom I light loaded 45 gives you less recoil than a full power 45, less recoil = easier to shoot fast. If you frame the question as can you load a 45 light enough that it can be competitive with the 38s? Then the answer is sure. But then again, at that point, you might as well just shoot the 38s. They are cheaper to feed and you can really get your recoil down. Shooting light loads is not a magic formula of course, practice and skill come into it as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Shapiro Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 I thinkin not many people shoot NEAR that much, but ok. hud I would hazard a guess that the vast majority of shooters that make it up to, or near to, the top shoot a tremendous amount of ammo in practice. The price of practice ammo adds up very quickly. I switched to 38's mainly for the cost issue. The other was damage to my hands and wrists from 75000 rounds one year of 45 Colt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 hmm, cost. 2 bucks more for a box of 500 45s then 38s. primers are the same. more powder true that, but in an 8 lb keg, who notices. brass, a few bucks more per bag. Im not really seein the overall here. oh well, just my 2 cents, oh, didnt factor that in hud 2 bucks more for a box of 500 45s vs 38s?????? Really????? Don't think so. Just checked 4 other places that sell cowboy bullets. Average cost for 500 105's was $33 bucks 500 125's was $36 bucks 500 180gr 45's was $46 bucks. Thats closer to $10 bucks per 500. That pays for my primers in full right there. .38 range brass in not that hard to find at a good price. Good luck doing that with .45 brass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errol Plain, SASS #47739 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 A disadvantage? Heck no, we get all of those style points don't we !!! On a more serious note, I went from shooting full case (2F) 45's with a 250 gr bullet to the same amount of powder in my ROA's shooting a round ball that only weighs about 145 grs. My times are slightly better (not enough to be a threat!) but I am not sure if it is due to less recoil or the change to gunfighter. Probably too many variables in there to mean anything. But I do have a lot of fun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rufus Brady Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 You saying Warthogs are disadvantaged? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost, SASS #50125 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 The real gamers are using the 45's. Throwing a larger pill at the target lessens the chance of a miss. Ghost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hud Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 2 bucks more for a box of 500 45s vs 38s?????? Really????? Don't think so. Just checked 4 other places that sell cowboy bullets. Average cost for 500 105's was $33 bucks 500 125's was $36 bucks 500 180gr 45's was $46 bucks. Thats closer to $10 bucks per 500. That pays for my primers in full right there. .38 range brass in not that hard to find at a good price. Good luck doing that with .45 brass Sorry, just quoting what they cost at my shop. I am now remembering why I stopped posting here, again, sorry if I have done something wrong. And adios Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Sorry Hud. Did not mean to make you mad. Just trying to understand your numbers. If someone is making 105-125 bullets (which is around the most popular) for the same price as .45's. They are over charging for the .38's or taking a loss on the .45's Just in the cost of the lead. Starline brass $118 bucks for 1,000 .38's. $166 bucks for 1,000.45's Again. Just trying to understand the numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tex Fiddler SASS Life 10127 Posted October 18, 2011 Share Posted October 18, 2011 There are some factors that favor 45s, which I have noticed: - I have never had a split case cause a rifle jam using .45s. The bullets fit tighter and thin split 45 cases are easy to feel when reloading. - The guns are lighter, easier to maneuver and wear all day. - One load for rifle and pistol makes for consistency in reloading. - I have the same recoil on all targets (plates and knockdowns) in big matches. Consistent recoil is a really good, one less thing to think about when getting ready for the stage, and it makes reloading simpler. - The recoil is smooth, more of a push than a pop. That big case has to fill before starting the bigger bullet moving. ---tex fiddler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Junky Posted October 18, 2011 Share Posted October 18, 2011 2 bucks more for a box of 500 45s vs 38s?????? Really????? Don't think so. Just checked 4 other places that sell cowboy bullets. Average cost for 500 105's was $33 bucks 500 125's was $36 bucks 500 180gr 45's was $46 bucks. Thats closer to $10 bucks per 500. That pays for my primers in full right there. .38 range brass in not that hard to find at a good price. Good luck doing that with .45 brass Hud....Not pickin' on ya' either but I've been down this road and you are over looking a few things. AA's numbers are close to what I've seen. So, it's the lead, more powder and brass that gets ya'.....then add the fact that if you shoot big matches many times you hafta' leave that 45 brass on the ground it adds up. Without practice the wife and I go through 1000 rounds a month just shooting matches so if you add it all up there is a bigger difference than you think. Granted you won't get rich off the savings but I won't pay the extra just to say I shoot 45's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
backshootin beauford mcgee Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 Being new and sloooowww! I'm usually at the back anyway. However, my thought is that how much powder is in there makes more difference that the hole size. Last year I started shooting with 44 mags in smokeless 200 grain at 800fps in the pistols. There was some recoil. I lightened the load to 200 grain at 700 fps and had no recoil and speeded up a bit (along with practice and figuring some things out). This year, I went to BP and shoot 30 grains of FF under a 200 grain in 44-40, I'm slow again. I use 60 grains and 1 ounce in 12ga shotshells and 120 grains and 1 1/2 ounce shot in my 'gamer' 10 ga loads. I am quite willing to bet I would be faster with 32-20's and a 20 ga. Just because the smoke would be lighter for one reason, but I could no longer shoot Pale Rider which kinda evens up the class a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nichols Creek, SASS #77627 Posted October 22, 2011 Share Posted October 22, 2011 Ok. Sure Bud can win EOT with 44s, T-Bone can win with a hammered double, and sure Duece can win using box stock guns but, can 38 FanTum beat 45 Fantum? Can 45 IROT beat 38 IROT? How about some empirical evidence from shooters who have done some research on the subject. Thanks. Fillmore Phantom has shot my 45's (faster than me) just as fast as he shoots his 38's(with mouse phart loads ). And that was the first time he ever picked them up. So, my answer based upon field research would be , no difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bone SASS #36388 Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 Just my humble opinion,,,, I have shot 45 lc for 11 yrs now. Started at 250 gr factory loads and now shoot 170 gr. Nuttin Gracefull started out shooting 45 lc then moved to 38 spl. We have determined that there is no way a 45 can be as fast as a 38 spl shooter. reasons being !!!! 1. bullet size. 2.casing size. Drag time going into/out of the chamber of your rifle 3.Powder burn rate. 4. recovery time/ size does matter. 5.speed of bullet. 6.extractor failure. 7.Rifle can never be as smooth. 7.5 weight of the cylinder in the 38 to turn faster and smoother. 8. NO,, the 45 shooter cannot be as fast as the 38... shoot 45's and move to 38's- not much difference. 9. Take the 38 shooter and put 45's in his hands it will take him a while to adjust... I have won several fastest rifle side matches with other cowboys 38 rifle... 9.5 It even takes longer to clean your guns.....ask a 45 lc man. My rifle always looks like I have never cleaned it... Just ask??? 10. Bud can shoot anything and beat us all,, he's a great shooter.... and that's a fact !!!!! you know its true.. This analysis was tested and proved on the Bar 3 shooting range. Your results may vary from ours.. The cowboy who practices will be better than those who don't, there is no natural shooters we all have to work it.. I think???.. T-Bone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Harland Wolff, SASS #5019 Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 ...What T-Bone said! I have been shooting .45 Colt in this game for 18 years now; it is NO hinderance! ...I'm thinking I might need a set of .38s... 38-40s that is! Harland Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bart Solo Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 I am not experienced enough to seamlessly jump back and forth between 38 and 45, but now that I have shot my last annual for the year, I think I am going to use my 45s the rest of the year. They are just more fun to shoot. Early in October I shot 45 in a match and spent practice time working on a new 45 Cowboy Special load. Then I shot 38 at Border Wars. It took me a few stages to readjust and my times showed it. Just about every reloading component is cheaper in 38 than in 45. That doesn't mean I save money, it just means I shoot more. I have also found the 38 to be easier to load. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diamond S Doug Posted October 28, 2011 Share Posted October 28, 2011 I think the answer is can you physically handle the recoil the same. Some folks cannot and that is why I think they are slower with them. That includes both muzzle rise/recoil and hand/arthritis issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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