Seldom Seen #16162 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 I watched the movie "Assault on a Queen". For those that haven't seen this flick at the end of the movie a Coast Guard Cutter sinks the bad guys U-boat by ramming it. This got me to thinking that it seems like the movie Navy always ram U-boats they catch on the surface. This doesn't make sense to me as they have a perfectly good 5" gun on the foredeck. The Navy ships must be made of tough steel cause they never even dent the bow of the ship when they ram the sub. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfgang, SASS #53480 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 I vaugly recall that movie from long, long ago. In a movie they do what will look good in the film. In war I think they do whatever is available to sink the sub. If it is in front of them . . . ram it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 In the movies they ram them but it was a rare occurrence in combat. HMS Harvester The HMS Hesperus also rammed and sank the U-93 while defending a convoy. The damage caused her to be drydocked for several months. The Royal Navy then issued a policy discouraging ramming. Given the slow speed of a U-Boat compared to a destroyer, it would be fairly easy to hit one on the surface but you took the chance of sending both craft to the bottom..Destroyers are light and fast and generally don't hold up well when being used as a battering ram. An Icebreaker would be well suited for the role but they're kinda slow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badger Mountain Charlie SASS #43172 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Adds drama in the move. Kinda like the gunfight in the street. Looks good, probably didn't happen that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Bill Burt Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 I served 4 years in the USN submarine service and I can tell as far as modern subs go that is not even close to reality. Think about it, the service ship is designed to take the pounding from dealing with surface conditions. The submarine is designed to take the same, plus submerge to triple digit depths. The hull is very thick and designed to flex when it is subjected to pressure. The second sub I served on the USS Von Steuben SSBN 632, keel laid in the early 60s at one point held the record for peace time tonnage sunk, meaning it had accidently sunk more surface ships than any other sub, primarily due to accidently surfacing under them. Bottom line, when a sub make physical contact with a surface ship, the surface ship loses. About the only exception to that would be if the sub gets rolled and loses control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S. Quentin Quale, Esq. SASS 9953 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Spent 16 years in the air ASW business. Concur that it's more drama than practicality. BUT, there were instances where it happened. Usually it was a "desperation" or "surprise" event from the view of the surface vessel. Even in WWII a sub hull was tougher than a DDs bow. The biggest thing would be while the DD could take some damage and still go home the sub could not. ANY breach meant the boat could not dive and that meant it was dead meat. Maybe not in the dark of night when the collision occured, but at first light when it would be sighted by other ships or aircraft. SQQ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apache Hawk 60642 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Have ya ever seen a "U-Boat?" I mean.....come on... dey are "u"s rat ? What happens when ya shoot a "U?" Bulliet comes flyin' back at ya !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apache Hawk 60642 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Ya ever seen a "U-Boat ?" I mean.....Come on......really ? Everyone knows "U-Boats" are u shaped so.... A bulliet comes rat back at ya !!!!! Dats why dey always git rammed !!!! GEEZH.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apache Hawk 60642 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 I served 4 years in the USN submarine service and I can tell as far as modern subs go that is not even close to reality. Think about it, the service ship is designed to take the pounding from dealing with surface conditions. The submarine is designed to take the same, plus submerge to triple digit depths. The hull is very thick and designed to flex when it is subjected to pressure. The second sub I served on the USS Von Steuben SSBN 632, keel laid in the early 60s at one point held the record for peace time tonnage sunk, meaning it had accidently sunk more surface ships than any other sub, primarily due to accidently surfacing under them. Bottom line, when a sub make physical contact with a surface ship, the surface ship loses. About the only exception to that would be if the sub gets rolled and loses control. I rode 2 subs in da service. I don't know how does guys handle dat. All cramped up like dat and no really fresh air. MAN.... Hats off to da "Silent Service !!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Bill Burt Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 I rode 2 subs in da service. I don't know how does guys handle dat. All cramped up like dat and no really fresh air. MAN.... Hats off to da "Silent Service !!" Thanks. Everyone who served made sacrifices, to be honest my biggest one was probably extended periods of boredom. Imagine being on a very large bus without windows for a couple of months plus. I do remember periscope liberty though, the chance to look out and see the sky, mainly at night, when you hadn't seen anything farther away than a few yards...pretty cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apache Hawk 60642 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Thanks. Everyone who served made sacrifices, to be honest my biggest one was probably extended periods of boredom. Imagine being on a very large bus without windows for a couple of months plus. I do remember periscope liberty though, the chance to look out and see the sky, mainly at night, when you hadn't seen anything farther away than a few yards...pretty cool. Michael Silverhawk Sergent 1st Class 3rd Combat Engineers 82 Airborne 5th Group Special Forces U. S. Army Retired Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Bill Burt Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Michael Silverhawk Sergent 1st Class 3rd Combat Engineers 82 Airborne 5th Group Special Forces U. S. Army Retired Thomas Burt, PO2 SS USS Von Steuben, SSBN 632 Blue United States Navy My hat's off to you Pardner I only did four years, and a lot easier ones than you I'm sure! I would never have made the grade in Special Forces, barely did where I was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apache Hawk 60642 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Well, Thanks , Pard. I did just what da donkey chasein' da carrot wood do !! Da Army kept it just out of reach, so I wood run to caught it !!! Can we say...........DAAAAAAAA !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Ramming is just dramatic. Like running away from an explosion while the bomb is going off. Not much about Hollywood is practical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deja Vous Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Guys.. I love reading your posts and never having been the service I know very little about it except for what guys say about it. I rarely ask much about the experience cuz my father told me not too, since it does bring up a lot of bad memories I guess.. But the sub/uboat stuff i pretty interesting to a know nothing like me... So, thanks for the post.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 I had an uncle who served 3 years on a DD. He never walked right after that, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willie Wheelgun Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 My uncle was on a DE in WWII and never had the chance to ram a Jap sub, but he did say that you would plot a course to intersect where you expected the sub to be as that was key to effective depth charge dispersal. If the poor bastard surfaced, so be it. Remember that the Japs rammed John Kennedy's PT boat which was made of plywood. A five inch gun would have done the job. I was in the Army Combat Engineers. We didn't have any fun like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckhorn Woodie Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 I think Captains just like the idea of saying "ramming speed" just once 6 years in the Navy and I was only on a boat once for about 20 minutes to by some smokes and I looked at a cupple of them sinking black suppositories tied up to a dock....never had a hankering to spend any time on either one. SeaBees UT2 72-78 MCB5 Keflavik Iceland San Point Navel Air Station, WA MCB5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Bill Burt Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Ever heard about the exploding toilets? All the human waste drops down into a sanitary tank. The bottom of the toilet bowl has a ball valve. When the tanks get full, time to flush them overboard. Problem is when you're several hundred feet down you have to add a pretty good bit of pressure so the tank will flush. That pressure is sitting on the other side of that ball valve, your waste is sitting on the top of that ball valve. Best not to flush unless you're hankering for a face full of feces. Of course if the Machinist Mates are in a 'fun' mood they may forget to hang the signs "pressurizing sanitary tank, do not flush'. Ahh sweet memories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallaby Jack, SASS #44062 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 .... just how fast is "Ramming Speed" anyway ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 .... just how fast is "Ramming Speed" anyway ? Depends on how fast they row. Ya gotta have a big sweaty guy beating the drum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 .... just how fast is "Ramming Speed" anyway ? (I stole this reply from somewhere on the internet.) In the years before accurate naval gunfire, ramming was a very common tactic. Pre-gunpowder ships used this almost exclusively. Since ramming is most effective when the ram (a pointed device under the waterline, extending from the bow) penetrates as far as possible, "Ramming Speed" describes the maximum speed available [thus putting maximum force on the impact]. It is not an authentic naval term, per se. The correct term is "Flank Speed" but in an informal situation, "Ramming Speed" may have been used to imply that all available speed is needed as soon as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sneaky Gun Runner SASS 79775 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 This is why fast attacks are more fun than boomers. Fast attack = Shore leave. Boomer = stay hid. I mean, you just got close enough to the top to deploy the towed array and then "bloop". Back to the bottom. OK landlubbers. Submarine fun time. 1. Submarines can be tracked by plotting the bends in the Van Allen belts surrounding Earth. 2. Dollar for dollar and man for man, the submarine is the country's most economical weapon. Comprising only 1.6 percent of the Navy's World War II personnel, the submarine service accounted for 55 percent of all enemy shipping destroyed. 3. Modern submarines can travel faster submerged than they can on the surface. They can fully submerge in less than a minute. 4. Per cubic inch, there is more science packed into a submarine than into any other warship. 5. More decorations for valor have been awarded, per man, to the submarine service than any other Navy Branch. 6. USS GEORGE WASHINGTON, the world's first ballistic missile nuclear powered submarine, constructed in record time, set a record of its own by remaining submerged 67 days on its initial Polaris missile deterrent patrol in the Atlantic. 7. Probably the most expensive ballast ever carried by a ship was two tons of gold and eighteen tons of silver coins carried by the U.S. submarine TROUT while on a trip from Corregidor to Pearl Harbor early in World War II. TROUT had removed her moveable ballast to allow for a larger cargo of ammunition to be transported for the defenders on the embattled island. Lcdr. Fenno, TROUT's CO, planned on replacing the ballast with sand bags, but found none were available. The gold and silver from the Bank of the Philippines was substituted as ballast, which also solved the problem of removing the treasure to a safe place prior to invasion by the enemy. 8. ...and finally, there are only two types of seafaring vessels in the Navy. Submarines and targets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Four-Eyed Buck,SASS #14795 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Usually a ramming was a last resort/emergency thing/tactic. One WW II account had a destroyer ramming a U-Boat, getting hung up, and the crew had to resort to throwing coffee cups and whatever else they had at hand whenever the sub's crew came into sight on deck trying to abandon. Believe this was U.S.S. Borie, not sure if she was a DD or DE. The story of the Pacific fleet's subs is one of my favorite reads. I've been on board the Cod up in Cleveland, cramped isn't the word. Claustrophobic is more like it........Buck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seldom Seen #16162 Posted January 26, 2011 Author Share Posted January 26, 2011 Depends on how fast they row. Ya gotta have a big sweaty guy beating the drum. I thought only headhunters in darkest Africa have drums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Bill Burt Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 8. ...and finally, there are only two types of seafaring vessels in the Navy. Submarines and targets. I used to have a shirt with that on it, had a ship in the periscope sights on the front and one sinking on the back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willie Wheelgun Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 I have been told that all Navy ships are minesweepers once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 I thought only headhunters in darkest Africa have drums. Never saw Ben Hur huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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