WTC

[Ranger Dan]

Never seen this done, just curious if it would be legal to do. Traditional 2 handed shooter engages rifle string with 9 rounds, leaving one on the carrier. Draws pistol and cocks it. RO and peanut gallery yelling "1 more"... shooter holds pistol in off hand and grabs rifle, closing lever and picking it up in one motion and engages the last rifle target successfully, sets rifle down and opens lever ejecting the spent case. Then engages pistol string. Seems this would be legal?

[The Rainmaker, SASS #11631]

Two loaded guns in hand - only gunfighters can do this.

If the cocked revolver was transferred to weak hand, that's a no-no as well.

Set rifle down (hands off) with round still inside.

[Barry Sloe]

Transferring a cocked revolver from strong hand to off hand is a SDQ.  Better to take the MSV and miss.

 

BS

[Rye Miles #13621]

I think he should have continued with his pistol and went back to the rifle and finished the last round. 

[Ranger Dan]

3 minutes ago, Rye Miles #13621 said:

I think he should have continued with his pistol and went back to the rifle and finished the last round. 

That would be a procedural.

[Griff]

NO, not legal.  Unless shooter is registered as a gunfighter, if the rifle is still in hand when the 1st revolver is drawn, they've already earned the "P" for shooting out of category.  Letting go of the rifle then adds the MSV for the round still in rifle when discarded, and if the shooter doesn't go back to rifle to pick up last rifle round, they've earned the illusive tri-fecta of penalties!   Yes, they can avoid all that by shifting the revolver from one hand to the other, earning a SDQ, negating the other penalties.  .All of the above is generally referred to as a "train-wreck"!

[Ranger Dan]

14 minutes ago, Barry Sloe said:

Transferring a cocked revolver from strong hand to off hand is a SDQ.  Better to take the MSV and miss.

 

BS

You're not transferring the revolver at all, it is already in the off hand of a 2 handed shooter.

[The Rainmaker, SASS #11631]

1 minute ago, Ranger Dan said:

You're not transferring the revolver at all, it is already in the off hand of a 2 handed shooter.

??? Not for me it ain't

Off hand cocks the gun, that's all

[Ranger Dan]

1 minute ago, Griff said:

NO, not legal.  Unless shooter is registered as a gunfighter, if the rifle is still in hand when the 1st revolver is drawn, they've already earned the "P" for shooting out of category.  Letting go of the rifle then adds the MSV for the round still in rifle when discarded, and if the shooter doesn't go back to rifle to pick up last rifle round, they've earned the illusive tri-fecta of penalties!   Yes, they can avoid all that by shifting the revolver from one hand to the other, earning a SDQ, negating the other penalties.  .All of the above is generally referred to as a "train-wreck"!

So it is illegal for a duelist to pick up a long gun while shooting their second pistol?

[Rye Miles #13621]

4 minutes ago, Ranger Dan said:

That would be a procedural.

I think it would be a MSV which is better than a Better than a SDQ

Here's what I found in the rules:

 

If a empty round is left or found in the action or chamber, or a live round on the carrier of an open action, a Minor Safety Violation (MSV) will be assessed. However, if the action is opened, and a live/unfired round is ejected, a Stage DQ (SDQ) will be assessed for a long gun with a “live round under a cocked hammer having left the shooter’s hands”. In this case, there is no opportunity to correct this condition before firing the next firearm, as the penalty takes effect upon leaving the shooter’s hands

[The Rainmaker, SASS #11631]

1 minute ago, Ranger Dan said:

So it is illegal for a duelist to pick up a long gun while shooting their second pistol?

No, and I see a guy do it all the time, but he doesn't have a round still in the rifle that was discarded and he hasn't cocked his pistol yet.

If rifle is empty, you can draw and start shooting pistol.

[Hoss]

The rule says only GF or BW can have 2 loaded REVOLVERS in hand. 
 

assuming he did not change hands with cocked revolver, assuming he did not close lever of rifle then pick it up (not sure how to do it otherwise) I think just the MSV.  But I could also see a SDQ for unsafe gun handling. 

[Ranger Dan]

2 minutes ago, Hoss said:

The rule says only GF or BW can have 2 loaded REVOLVERS in hand. 
 

assuming he did not change hands with cocked revolver, assuming he did not close lever of rifle then pick it up (not sure how to do it otherwise) I think just the MSV.  But I could also see a SDQ for unsafe gun handling. 

Closing the lever and picking up the rifle has the rifle "in hand" and it touching the table does not matter.

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

45 minutes ago, Ranger Dan said:

Never seen this done, just curious if it would be legal to do. Traditional 2 handed shooter engages rifle string with 9 rounds, leaving one on the carrier. Draws pistol and cocks it. RO and peanut gallery yelling "1 more"... shooter holds pistol in off hand and grabs rifle, closing lever and picking it up in one motion and engages the last rifle target successfully, sets rifle down and opens lever ejecting the spent case. Then engages pistol string. Seems this would be legal?

NO.

36 minutes ago, The Rainmaker, SASS #11631 said:

Two loaded guns in hand - only gunfighters can do this.

If the cocked revolver was transferred to weak hand, that's a no-no as well.

Set rifle down (hands off) with round still inside.

The rule is "Only Gunfighters and B-Western categories allow two loaded revolvers “in hand” at the same time."
SHB p.14

10 minutes ago, Ranger Dan said:

So it is illegal for a duelist to pick up a long gun while shooting their second pistol?

NO.

[Griff]

19 minutes ago, Ranger Dan said:

So it is illegal for a duelist to pick up a long gun while shooting their second pistol?

I misspoke, it is a procedural for two loaded revolvers in hand, but actual working of the action and firing it might be considered unsafe gun handling.  However, one would need to be present and watch how the shooter handled it to make that call.

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

The shooter COULD pick up the rifle and fire it with the offhand while continuing to hold the cocked revolver in the strong hand with NO PENALTY.

IF it was done SAFELY.

 

 

[Hoss]

8 minutes ago, Ranger Dan said:

Closing the lever and picking up the rifle has the rifle "in hand" and it touching the table does not matter.

Not saying it couldn’t be done, but would be pretty awkward at best. 

[The Rainmaker, SASS #11631]

Sorry, forgot those B Western fellas can do gunfighter things

[Hoss]

Just now, PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L said:

The shooter COULD HAVE picked up the rifle and fired it with the offhand while continuing to hold the cocked revolver in the strong hand with NO PENALTY.

IF it was done SAFELY.

Except for the MSV for setting rifle down with round on carrier?  Granted, he has not fired pistol yet, but has cocked it. 
 

[Rye Miles #13621]

6 minutes ago, PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L said:

The shooter COULD pick up the rifle and fire it with the offhand while continuing to hold the cocked revolver in the strong hand with NO PENALTY.

IF it was done SAFELY.

 

 

He set the rifle down though and cocked his pistol. Isn’t that an MSV or at least a P once the rifle left his hands?

[Ranger Dan]

4 minutes ago, PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L said:

The shooter COULD pick up the rifle and fire it with the offhand while continuing to hold the cocked revolver in the strong hand with NO PENALTY.

IF it was done SAFELY.

 

 

Why not the strong hand? Previous WTC the shooter was able to remove a spent hull from a shotgun with either hand because a 2 handed shooter is not "transferring" the pistol as it is in both hands.

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

1 minute ago, Hoss said:

Except for the MSV for setting rifle down with round on carrier?  Granted, he has not fired pistol yet, but has cocked it. 
 

 

The MSV penalty can be negated before FIRING the next firearm.

Quote

Long guns will be emptied and discarded with their barrels pointed safely downrange. This condition may be corrected on the clock, prior to the next round being fired.

SHB p.16

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

Final answer:

Don't try this.

"Unsafe firearm handling" is a judgement call by the TO.

Manipulating and firing a long gun with one hand would likely be considered as such for a SDQ penalty.