45-70 Mold for Henry Sidegate

[Bisley Joe]

Howdy!

I recently acquired a Henry sidegate in 45-70 and want to get a bullet mold for it.

I would like to be able to shoot regular modern ammunition as well as hand load black powder (and probably modern powder too).

 

This rifle is not for SASS: it will serve as a trail gun for when I am in bear country.

I was recently up in the Yellowstone area, camping in my little trailer with my dogs. A couple of times I had to go outside at night and, although I didn't see any bears, it was still a concern with only a 9mm pistol, a .38 revolver, and a .357 magnum lever gun.

I am not going to hunt. This will be a rifle for if I have no other choice. I also will be carrying a Ruger Bisley in .45 Colt with Buffalo Bore ammo.

 

I am looking at:

 

Lee 457-405-F Double Cavity Mold SKU: 90374

 

and

 

Lee 459-405HB Single Cavity Mold SKU: 90268

 

The single cavity mold is a little more expensive than the double cavity, but the grooves seem deeper, better for black powder. It also has a hollow base (about the size of a pea I heard).

 

Any input on which one would be best for the Henry?

I ordered 250 cases of Starline brass for the 45-70 and 1000 large rifle primers.

Again, this will be a trail gun, but would be good to be able to also use it with BP if needed.

 

Thanks.

Joe

[Chickasaw Bill SASS #70001]

slug the bore , that will tell you the dia, needed 

 

  CB

[Sedalia Dave]

If I were looking for a 45-70 round to use for defense against bears, I would opt for a 450 to 500 grain, blunt nosed a bullet, loaded as hot as I could safely load. (No Ruger only loads) Load dummy rounds first and make sure they'll chamber and cycle properly. I would definitely cast it from Linotype.  Slug the bore and size the bullet to be .001" to .0015" larger in diameter than the bore.

 

I say this because you want a round that will penetrate deeply and reach vital organs. Light weight fast bullets will not do this reliably when shooting a charging bear. Same for softer cast lead it will mushroom too soon and not penetrate far enough. If you hit bone the hard cast bullet will punch through while a softer bullets will likely break apart.

 

Skip factory loads as almost all are designed for deer and similar game. The bullets are soft lead and loaded to trap door specifications. This makes them a poor choice for dangerous game like bears.

 

Skip the BP for defensive bear loads. Save it for plinking.

 

For plinking loads either WW or 20:1 alloy will work well.

 

Of the two moulds you listed I would avoid the Lee hollow base mould.  They are hard to cast properly and not needed in a modern rifle. Their only real application is for use in rifles with oversized bores.

 

[Sedalia Dave]

I would practice shouldering the rifle from your chosen carry position and shooting several of the defensive bear drills on the net.  You may find that some carry options take too long between carry and firing the first round.

 

A revolver loaded with bear stopping rounds would always be at the ready. Practice goes without saying.

[Bisley Joe]

Great advice!

Thanks!

I ordered some 350 Grain Jacketed Flat Nose Buffalo Bore for the 45-70 

Also ordered Buffalo Bore+P 325 Grain Flat Nose for the Ruger.

 

I prefer heavier rounds for the 45-70 though, but these seemed to have good energy and velocity. Hopefully I didn't pick the wrong ones.

[Bisley Joe]

Also, I don't have the rifle yet-it's on the way. I will have to get a "kit" to slug it then.

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

Be very aware of the length of nose in front of the crimp groove.   My Marlin 1895 only likes the shorter noses - won't feed most 405 grain cast slugs.  For a mold for that, I really like the NOE 460-350 RF  (a Ranch Dog mold design) that for me casts to about 330 grains with gas check installed.  A short nose but a wide meplat (flat) on the tip.

 

Modern made 45-70s are usually 0.458 groove diameter - things have standardized a lot in last 20 years.

 

good luck, GJ

 

 

Edited October 23 by Garrison Joe, SASS #60708

[watab kid]

im not quite sure what your asking but im getting that you bought a rifle , its a henry , it has a sidegate to load the magazine , and i think you want to know what bullet mold to buy that will load well ...........if thats correct , the prefered one in my mind is round nosed flat point , it will load and chamber well , a round nose will work but there are some safety concerns regarding a bullet against the primer i guess , others will respond 

[Flanigan Flats]

In bear country trash and food control is a must while camping. 
 

A large container of bear spray kept very handy is much better than a gun. Especially in an organized and populated campground. 
 

I prefer a big loud gun with as much flash as possible if I have to discourage a bear. My bear plan is more to scare and discourage than to actually shoot a bear. 
 

your dogs should normally do that. But…… Yellowstone bears are very “unique”.