GUNFIGHTER RULES re "HOLSTERED" vs "IN HAND"

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

A revolver is considered "out of leather" (for the purposes of determining whether there are "two loaded revolvers out at the same time") as soon as the muzzle(s) CLEAR the mouth of the holster; the opposite applies in regard to what is considered "holstered"

...as soon as the muzzle ENTERS the mouth of the holster, the revolver is no longer "in hand" and is now HOLSTERED as far as GF rules are concerned.

A scenario was presented to the ROC a week or so ago and the quotes below were taken into consideration in "making the call" that:

a GF is in violation of the following category-specific regulation whether the hands leave the grips or not:

...a gunfighter may not holster revolvers with the intent to engage another revolver sequence when shooting GF-style.

Penalty is a the "PROGRESSIVE" PROCEDURAL/SDQ/MDQ for "failure to adhere to the guidelines of the category". 

 

Quote

 

Revolver(s)

Safe for movement in hand, while holstering, and safe to leave the shooter’s hand.   

Hammer fully down on an empty chamber,  Hammer fully down on an expended round (may not be originally staged in this  condition but may be restaged in this condition).  
While the above restrictions apply, there are additional considerations for the Gunfighter.  When shooting "Gunfighter Style," a gunfighter may not holster revolvers with the intent to engage another revolver sequence.  Once cocked, all rounds are to be expended prior to holstering unless the revolvers were drawn at the wrong time or a revolver/ammunition malfunction has occurred.  Physical stage design may allow a competitor shooting "Gunfighter Style" to stage or restage revolvers between firearm sequences.

 

 

Quote

Definitions: "Gunfighter Style" is defined as having a loaded revolver in each hand at the same time.  There is no set pattern as to how the revolvers are to be fired, but alternating revolvers is clearly the most efficient. 

Quote

Revolver in hand – when the muzzle of the revolver clears the mouth of the holster, or breaks contact with a prop upon which it was staged.

***************************************************************************************************************************************************************************

ROC additional clarifications related to the application of the above clarified definition of "HOLSTERED":

"...as soon as the muzzle ENTERS the mouth of the holster, the revolver is no longer "in hand" and is now HOLSTERED as far as GF rules are concerned."

** A GUNFIGHTER is allowed to correct the situation with NO PENALTY as long as the revolvers are "out of leather" before changing location or firing another firearm during stage engagement if revolver(s) are "holstered" after firing the first 5 rounds.

 

The "HOLSTERED" definition also applies to the following STAGE DQ violations for ALL categories:

 Returning a revolver to leather with hammer not fully down on spent round or empty chamber.  

...

Holstering or staging a revolver with the hammer down on a live round.

** Any shooter (in any category) attempting to holster a cocked revolver is also allowed to "undo" any penalty for doing so by SAFELY drawing the revolver (before letting go of it), pointing it safely downrange, and either pulling the trigger to drop the hammer or de-cocking under the direct supervision of the T/O. 

[Widder, SASS #59054]

Allow me to be the first to THANK YOU PWB for posting this information.

 

You do great work to help us all.

 

..........Widder

 

[Wyatt]

Allow me to be the first second to THANK YOU PWB for posting this information.

 

You do great work to help us all.

 

..........Widder Wyatt  

 

 

....................and Thanks to the ROC

[Widder, SASS #59054]

2 hours ago, Widowmaker Hill SASS #59054 said:

Allow me to be the first to THANK YOU PWB for posting this information.

 

You do great work to help us all.

 

..........Widder

 

 

Well, it helps most of us..... 

I ain't sure it has helped Wyatt..... 

 

(Wyatt: leader of the Black Star posse)

 

 

..........Widder

 

[Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L]

Yeah, but ...   and what if ...? And are you sure?   

 

Thanks PWB.  I am sure this will put this subject to rest. 

 

CR

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

BTT:

BTW - There is still a SDQ penalty for "unsafe firearm handling" if a shooter is unable (or unwilling) to "undo" any of the listed potential penalties in a SAFE manner...

(e.g. pulling the trigger to de-cock with the muzzle pointed into the holster)

 

[Jasper Agate]

15 hours ago, PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L said:

(e.g. pulling the trigger to de-cock with the muzzle pointed into the holster)

That sent shivers down my spine!!

[Randy Saint Eagle, SASS # 64903]

17 hours ago, PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L said:

BTT:

BTW - There is still a SDQ penalty for "unsafe firearm handling" if a shooter is unable (or unwilling) to "undo" any of the listed potential penalties in a SAFE manner...

(e.g. pulling the trigger to de-cock with the muzzle pointed into the holster)

 

PaleWolf if shooter holsters cocked pistol and lets go of it (SDQ) then grabs it again and decocks it in the holster or pulls the trigger to drop the hammer with it still in the holster (2nd SDQ) has he now earned a MDQ?  

 

Thanks 

Randy

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

1 hour ago, Randy Saint Eagle, SASS # 64903 said:

PaleWolf if shooter holsters cocked pistol and lets go of it (SDQ) then grabs it again and decocks it in the holster or pulls the trigger to drop the hammer with it still in the holster (2nd SDQ) has he now earned a MDQ?  

 

Thanks 

Randy

 

YES...two separate actions, each of which is a SDQ violation = MDQ.

 

[Randy Saint Eagle, SASS # 64903]

37 minutes ago, PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L said:

 

YES...two separate actions, each of which is a SDQ violation = MDQ.

 

Thanks PaleWolf, that's what I thought.

 

Randy

[Blackey Cole]

Pen your the man hope all is well and I'll see you next month