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Black Angus McPherson

Replacing 1878 sear spring

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OK, so I got the replacement spring for my Cimarron 1878 shotgun (From Numrich Arms).  Now I could use some advice on getting the darn thing installed.  I can't get it compressed enough to get the tab (A) on the spring into the slot (B) on the side plate.  I looked on youtube for a video showing the replacement with no luck.

 

I also bought one for the right sear thinking I would replace them both.  However, if it's going to be this tough I may just wait until it breaks.

 

FWIW the tail(?) of the spring appears to be about twice as long as the one that broke off the cheap sheet metal stamped one that broke.  Does that need to be shortened?

 

Thanks,

 

Angus

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Any chance they sent you a generic spring instead of one specific for your gun?   If you key in the part number in the search function,  does it show up on only the Colt 1878 list?

 

I've had a lot of these locks apart and back together and had no real problems.  But they were parts that came off the lock.  

 

Are you coming to the Owl Creek Raiders match this weekend?  If you are,  bring your shotgun or just the lock and I'll take a look at it.  Also,  Snicklefritz is planning to be there Saturday. 

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Well, this is what I ordered:  https://www.gunpartscorp.com/products/182110   Manufacturer:  Colt     Model: 1878 Hammer Double Barrel Shotgun

 

If that's different than the spring for the TTN/Cimarron shotgun then that could be the problem.  It sure looks like it should fit.

 

I can't make it this Saturday, but I may be able to make it Sunday.  If so I'll bring it.

 

Angus

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Yeah, bring it and we'll look and see if we can fix it.  Snicklefrits can't make on Sunday but maybe Jackson Rose will be there.  

 

I'll bring my Cimarron 1878 and we can pull the locks to compare. 

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It says Colt in the Numrich description and if it is really a Colt part your Chinese 1878 most assuredly is not a Colt.  Even on the Chinese models they have varied a bit over the years.  I had to replace some mainsprings on an older Chinese 1878 with some from the current models and it took several hours to get them to fit.  How does the new spring compare with the one that came from your gun?

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1 hour ago, Black Angus McPherson said:

Well, this is what I ordered:  https://www.gunpartscorp.com/products/182110   Manufacturer:  Colt     Model: 1878 Hammer Double Barrel Shotgun

 

If that's different than the spring for the TTN/Cimarron shotgun then that could be the problem.  It sure looks like it should fit.

 

I can't make it this Saturday, but I may be able to make it Sunday.  If so I'll bring it.

 

Angus

 

It is different. The 1st gen TTN's were almost identical to the original colt. The Cim/TTN has some changes. Also, there were some changes with the original Colt as well. I know this because I have actually repaires some originals with the TTN parts. Unlike Chevy's we hardly ever know what year model we are hunting parts for. 

As a gunsmith the best you can hope for is a part that is too big. you can always whittle it down. Hard to do if it's too small.

 

If you will email me here I'll tell you how to get that thing fixed.

 

steve@stevesgunz.com

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19 hours ago, Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 said:

.....  How does the new spring compare with the one that came from your gun?

 

The broken spring was made from stamped sheet metal and was very rough to the touch.  (cheap/poorly finished)  The replacement spring appears to be cast(?) steel and nicely finished.  The picture on the Numrich Arms website is a good representation of the spring I received.  The tail of the spring looks to be about twice as long as the one from the broken spring.  The longer tail does look as though it should fit well along the part it contacts the name of which I cannot recall.  :unsure:  (i.e. not too long to fit in place or impact other parts.)   One of the reasons I bought this particular replacement was because it looked to be of much higher quality than the one that broke.  The other was because I thought it would drop right in without modification.  HA!  :D  Oh, well.

 

Nate,  Thank you for your kind offer.  Email sent.

 

Thanks,

 

Angus

 

 

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Quote

cast(?) steel 

 

Almost no springs are made from cast steel.   Slightly rough surface you might be seeing is from hot-forging thick spring steel into a V shape and putting correct shape on it.   Then it gets a final set of heat treating steps to impart the right hardness and springy-ness.  And if it was not polished afterward, it will have a little bit of rough surface.

 

The original spring was most likely also spring steel, not "sheet metal," but probably thinner stock and could have been roughly finished.   Stamping out the rough part shape would be common for small leaf springs, regardless of the quality.  Leaf springs will fail if they are too thin or poorly heat treated.  Your original may have suffered both problems.

 

Good luck, GJ

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 said:

 

Almost no springs are made from cast steel.   Slightly rough surface you might be seeing is from hot-forging thick spring steel into a V shape and putting correct shape on it.   Then it gets a final set of heat treating steps to impart the right hardness and springy-ness.  And if it was not polished afterward, it will have a little bit of rough surface.

 

The original spring was most likely also spring steel, not "sheet metal," but probably thinner stock and could have been roughly finished.   Stamping out the rough part shape would be common for small leaf springs, regardless of the quality.  Leaf springs will fail if they are too thin or poorly heat treated.  Your original may have suffered both problems.

 

Good luck, GJ

 

 

 

 

 

I didn't know how to describe the spring metal of the new spring.  All I could think of at the time was "cast".  I knew that was wrong but my brain couldn't come up with forged.

BTW, the new part is nicely polished.  Not shiney polished, but I don't feel any rough edges.

 

As for the other.  The only way I could think of to describe it's look properly was to call it sheet metal.  I figured it started out as a spring steel sheet, or ribbon, cut or stamped out to rough shape then bent to final shape.   If it had been polished at all I could not tell.  The old part was very rough to the touch.

 

FWIW, I've had the gun about two years and used it in, maybe, 6-8 matches.  Yeah, I need to shoot more.

 

Thanks,

 

Angus

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