helping cowboy by moving long guns to firing line WTC

[Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L]

background:  we have a member who needs his fellow posse members to move his rifle and shotgun to and from the shooting positions.  He can shoot them but he's not steady enough to carry the long guns and step up and down with them.  

 

A fellow posse member takes his rifle from him at the loading table and carries it to its shooting position and sets it down.

 

turns out the hammer was cocked and not noticed till RO pointed it out to the helper and everyone else in earshot.

 

Here is the question:  who gets the SDQ?  for 

 

My guess is the helper

 

thoughts??

 

 

[Lawdog Dago Dom]

My understanding is that if the rifle is fired into the berm, without a round going off, it's a "No call."

 

 

[Lawdog Dago Dom]

Ok. My interpretation of the OP was that in the beginning of the stage, before a round being fired, the rifle hammer was cocked.

In that instance, I thought the rifle trigger being pulled wit no round going off was a "no call."

[ORNERY OAF]

Palewolf, I'm interested,  who would you tag with it, the helper who sat it down? That's what inwould think but the shooter I imagine should be responsible for his guns he handed off from the loading table? Glad I'm not a T/O or match director, tough one...

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

9 minutes ago, Lawdog Dago Dom said:

My understanding is that if the rifle is fired into the berm, without a round going off, it's a "No call."

 

3 minutes ago, Lawdog Dago Dom said:

Ok. My interpretation of the OP was that in the beginning of the stage, before a round being fired, the rifle hammer was cocked.

In that instance, I thought the rifle trigger being pulled wit no round going off was a "no call."

 

That only applies during movement from the LT to the stage before the rifle is staged (i.e. leaves the shooter's hands). SHB pp.11-12

 

- Initially staging a long gun with the hammer cocked/action closed (once it leaves the shooter’s hands).

...

- Changing location with a long gun with the action closed and the hammer cocked (exception for rifle from the loading table to the stage with no round chambered).

SHB p.22 (SDQ)

 

[Lawdog Dago Dom]

Very good, sir.

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

13 minutes ago, ORNERY OAF said:

Palewolf, I'm interested,  who would you tag with it, the helper who sat it down? That's what inwould think but the shooter I imagine should be responsible for his guns he handed off from the loading table? Glad I'm not a T/O or match director, tough one...

 

STAGE DISQUALIFICATION PENALTY (SDQ) 

 A Stage Disqualification (SDQ or “Stage DQ”) is generally a safety violation of a more serious nature and means the competitor’s time and performance on the course of fire is disqualified as a result of the violating action by the shooter.

SHB p.22

 

Previous rulings have established that expeditors and Range Officers are not subject to penalties (e.g. dropping a loaded malfunctioned revolver during a "hand off" or accidentally knocking an empty/staged long gun off of a prop while changing location).

 

[ORNERY OAF]

Thank you

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

Bottom line (IMO...without taking this to the ROC for a consensus):

 

This should be handled the same as movement from the LT prior to staging (as Lawdog Dago Dom suggested).
If the rifle left the LT with a live round under the cocked hammer, I would assess the SDQ on the shooter for

"failure to adhere to loading and unloading procedures".

 

Otherwise I would "NO CALL" it.

 

IMO

 

 

 

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

This has been presented to the ROC for a consensus opinion.

 

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

The ROC is in unanimous agreement with the previously posted answer.

 

Additional commentary was sent to the Committee for consideration:

 

Since the OP didn't mention it, the assumption is that the shooter loaded his own firearms.
The situation was a result of inattention at multiple levels:

The shooter apparently left the rifle hammer cocked after closing the lever to load it.

The LTO (or other "observer" at the LT) failed to notice the cocked hammer (SHB p.21/RO1 p.28)

The helper failed to notice the cocked hammer.

The TO failed to "watch the gun staging process" (RO1 p.25)

 

BUT...
REMEMBER: 

The primary responsibility always rests with the competitor. Shooters should always know the condition of their firearms and should never depend upon the Loading and Unloading Officers to ensure their firearms are correctly loaded or unloaded. 

 - The Loading & Unloading Officers are an added measure of safety. 

 - The competitor may never blame the Loading officer for an incorrectly loaded firearm 

    – or an Unloading officer for a firearm not unloaded. 

 *At no time will this claim be grounds for dismissal of penalties.

RO1 p.29

 

This is what I based the SDQ call on the shooter if a live round had been under the cocked hammer.

If NOT...it's a NO CALL.