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.38 short Colt


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Anyone out there is SASS Land load for the 38 Short colt?    If so, would you mind sharing your data?

 

I'm making mine from .38 Specials trimmed to .775 and loaded with 1.5 grs of Titegroup under a 170 grain bullet(358429).

 

Haven't gone to the range yet with these loads but will tomorrow, I hope. 

Revolver use is a Colt Police Positive 38. 

Colt 38 Short Colt 001.JPG

Colt 38 Short Colt 002.JPG

Colt 38 Short Colt 003.JPG

Edited by Cat Cummings SASS #1870L
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Why on earth would you load a 170 grain bullet in a short Colt?

 

https://www.hodgdonreloading.com/reloading-data-center?rdc=true&type=53

 

Scroll down to .38 Short Colt.  You should also note what kind of gun you are using.  An old top break won't use the same loads as a .38 Short Colt loaded for IPSC.

Edited by Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933
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My load for the .38 Short Colt is as follows...

 

I use .38 Short Colt Brass.   Most of it is recycled from Remington factory ammo, but some is also from brass I've found at gun shows.   
1.2 grains of Trailboss, .358" 150 grain Round Nose Hollow Base bullet.  The bullets I get from Buffalo Arms.  They are kinda pricey, but I don't reload a lot for this cartridge.  It is also the same bullet I use in .38 Long Colt. 

 

It works well with "newer" guns with the .357 bore, as well as older guns with .375 tubes.   Depending on what you are reloading for, you might not need to do this.  If you're just using at as a "sub" round in a modern .38, ordinary bullets for the .38 Special would be fine.   If a cartridge conversion of a cap and ball, you'll prolly need the hollow base so it'll expand to engage the rifling.   But, yeah, a 170 grain bullet does seem kinda excessive for this cartridge.


 

 

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1 hour ago, Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 said:

Why on earth would you load a 170 grain bullet in a short Colt?

 

https://www.hodgdonreloading.com/reloading-data-center?rdc=true&type=53

 

Scroll down to .38 Short Colt.  You should also note what kind of gun you are using.  An old top break won't use the same loads as a .38 Short Colt loaded for IPSC.

Why not a 170?    Cause that's what I have....

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Sometimes what is on-hand is not a good choice.  If all I have on hand is IMR 4895 powder and I want to load for the .38 Short Colt that is not a good choice.  You still did not say what kind of gun this is for so I will give you a couple of loads for my CAS main match Ruger New Vaqueros.  Most of the published data for the .38 Short Colt is very mild in deference to some of the 19th Century guns that chambered this round.  If you want modern data you should search sites like Brian Enos website or others that cater to IPSC shooters as the .38 Short Colt is used in a lot of eight shot revolvers.  When I got a pair of Ruger Montados with 3 1/2" barrels .357s, .38 Specials and even .38 Long Colt cases would not fully eject from the cylinder because the ejector rod is so short.  Then I remembered I still had a couple of thousand .38 Short Colts in the closet left over from my IPSC days.  I decided to use the same bullet that works through my Lightning rifles, a one hundred grain coated bullet like what Ace suggested.  I wanted something about 70PF so I chrono'd loads until I had two that shoot at between 700 and 725 fps.  This is 2.5 grains of Bullseye and 2.6 grains of Clays.  Takes down plates with no problem.  I would NOT use these loads in an old pocket pistol.

DSC_0002.jpeg

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5 minutes ago, Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 said:

Sometimes what is on-hand is not a good choice.  If all I have on hand is IMR 4895 powder and I want to load for the .38 Short Colt that is not a good choice.  You still did not say what kind of gun this is for so I will give you a couple of loads for my CAS main match Ruger New Vaqueros.  Most of the published data for the .38 Short Colt is very mild in deference to some of the 19th Century guns that chambered this round.  If you want modern data you should search sites like Brian Enos website or others that cater to IPSC shooters as the .38 Short Colt is used in a lot of eight shot revolvers.  When I got a pair of Ruger Montados with 3 1/2" barrels .357s, .38 Specials and even .38 Long Colt cases would not fully eject from the cylinder because the ejector rod is so short.  Then I remembered I still had a couple of thousand .38 Short Colts in the closet left over from my IPSC days.  I decided to use the same bullet that works through my Lightning rifles, a one hundred grain coated bullet like what Ace suggested.  I wanted something about 70PF so I chrono'd loads until I had two that shoot at between 700 and 725 fps.  This is 2.5 grains of Bullseye and 2.6 grains of Clays.  Takes down plates with no problem.  I would NOT use these loads in an old pocket pistol.

DSC_0002.jpeg

Thanks for the info...

 

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Ah!   A Colt Police Positive!   Great gun!   I have a couple.   I notice the barrel says .38.  Based on the 1917 date on the side, I am assuming that the .38 stands for .38 Special  Why bother to trim down to the shorter round in the first place?

 

OR

Do .38 Specials not fit?   Do they seem to go in about the length of a Short Colt?  If that's the case, I'd almost be willing to bet that the gun is chambered for .38 S&W not .38 Short Colt.

 

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1 hour ago, H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 said:

Ah!   A Colt Police Positive!   Great gun!   I have a couple.   I notice the barrel says .38.  Based on the 1917 date on the side, I am assuming that the .38 stands for .38 Special  Why bother to trim down to the shorter round in the first place?

 

OR

Do .38 Specials not fit?   Do they seem to go in about the length of a Short Colt?  If that's the case, I'd almost be willing to bet that the gun is chambered for .38 S&W not .38 Short Colt.

 

Not .38 special.  Not .38 Long Colt.     .38 Short Colt fits nicely.

 

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Most of the Colts from that era that are marked just .38 are .38 Colt New Police AKA the .38 S&W.  A little larger in diameter than a .38 Short Colt and a slightly larger bore.

 

https://www.chuckhawks.com/38sw.htm

 

P.S.  I just went back and looked at the photos again.  If the 1917 date is correct then it is a .38 Colt New Police/ .38 S&W.  The police positive was never chambered in .38 Short Colt.

 

 

Edited by Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933
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Okay, based on all of the above, it's NOT a .38 Short Colt, it's a .38 S&W, which back in the day, Colt called ".38 Colt New Police."

Here's a good .38 S&W Load for you....

1.1 Grains of Trailboss, behind a .360" 158 Grain Round Nose bullet.

This is a light load, which I more or less developed to be safe in everything I own in the caliber that's not restricted to black powder only.

.38 S&W can be loaded to higher performance, in certain guns.   Best to research that for your own satisfaction.   

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38 S&W and 38 Short Colt (or shortened 38 Spec) do not have the same dimensions...   best get some 38 S&W brass IMO... 

 

In more general terms, if looking to use 38 Short colt brass for higher powered loads in modern guns (such as I do in a 627 for IPSC) ...start with moderate 9mm load data and work from there.  Case volume is virtually identical.  Its a relatively popular option in those guns.  (I jokingly call it "9x19 Rimmed")

 

EDIT: I see Larsen beat me to it! :D

Edited by Constable Nelson #11784
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