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H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619

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Everything posted by H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619

  1. Oh, I know it'll never happen. I just think it's an interesting what might have been kind of speculation.
  2. There was an article in the new American Rifleman about the Winchester 1890 pump action .22. I bet most of us are familiar with this rifle, and that many of us have one, one of it's "successor models" or the replica by Rossi. It's a great little rifle. But there was something in the article I did not know that caught my eye. There was an offhand comment about how the rifle was originally designed for the same cartridges that could be found in the 73, and 76 centerfire rifles, but they decided to make it a .22 only because they didn't want to be competing with themselves. Well, needless to say, I found this very intriguing. I found myself wondering about a great rifle that never was, but could have been. And that leads me to the following speculation. If someone, Uberti, Rossi, Chiappa, whoever, were to actually market a version of this rifle that could shoot "main match" calibers, would anyone be interested in it? I have to be honest and say that I would be, even if I never used it for SASS, I think it'd be a cool one to have in the collection. Anyone else have any thoughts on this very curious idea?
  3. This was never my intention... When it comes to the New Model 3 variants, I have the following in my collection. 1. S&W New Model 3 Target in .38/44 2. S&W New Model 3 in .44-40 3. S&W Model 3 DA in .44-40 4. S&W 3rd Model Schofield in .45 S&W. 5. Uberti Schofield in .45 Colt. 6. Uberti American in .45 Colt. Notice that both of my Italian replicas are in .45. I have learned that the Russian replica is also available in .45. And of course the Beretta Laramie, a kind of a hybrid between the standard and target New Model 3, is available in .45. I find myself contemplating getting these last two repros in this caliber so as to have all 4 replicas in the same cartridge.
  4. Getting back to the original question, I am more and more convinced that it all comes down to a matter of preference. It has been demonstrated that you can win with the 73, 66, Marlin, 92 and the Lightning. It's just that only a few pards want to give the pump gun a try. They prefer something else.
  5. The only Western I can recall, off the top of my head, that had a Lightning in it, was an episode of The Rifleman. One was hanging in the window of gunsmith's shop.
  6. More case strength would be a side effect, and allow for "stronger" loads. But the main purpose is using it as a low power alternative in those really big revolvers and large rifles. You can download a big .45-70 case "too much" but a shortened one already holds less powder. You can't load a .45 Colt into a Trapdoor Springfield, but you could load a shortened .45-70.
  7. Take a .45-70 case. Cut it back to the same length as a .45 Colt. Load it with 300 grain bullets. Would this be considered a pistol cartridge, and thus allow for the usage of some of those novelty huge revolvers, or even a Winchester 86 as main match guns? (Assuming that it could properly cycle through the action.) Even if it would not work in a repeating rifle, or be Main Match legal, it MIGHT make for a decent reduced power load in those big revolvers and single shot rifles. (In the planning stages for a long term project. Call it Cowboy Wildcatting.)
  8. Ah, a Taurus. Okay. Makes sense that it was problematic. Takes a lot of work to make them, well, work. I really would not pay more than $400 for one, and since I remember when the cost that new, I'd prolly be inclined to not pay that much for a used one.
  9. Interesting. My own AWA .44-40 works just fine. I guess this "verifies" my notion that AWA is hit or miss. You can hang it on my wall, if you want.
  10. Who made your Lightning? When you say scrapped, do you mean sold, traded or retired to the safe?
  11. Nope. I ordered 2 boxes of Magtechs, the proper wads, and the CH4D dies. Yes, I know those are expensive, but when you consider I basically got the gun for free, it's not a bad trade off.
  12. I suppose I should mention what I have. The first pump I ever used in a SASS side match was, at the time, the only .22 I had, was a Remington Model 12. It's a vert nice gun, and very accurate. It doesn't have an exposed hammer, and when I asked if that was okay, I was told that for a .22, it is. That being said, I only used it the one time before moving on to other things. For a while I used a Rossi Model 62 SAC, which is a replica the Winchester 62 that belonged to my brother. I really like this design. It's a very nice shooter, and a great plinker. But, the sights are not quite the same as on a real Winchester, being "wider" and thus for me, not as accurate. At big squre targets, that's nota problem, but at eggs way out there, it kinda was. But, one day I got a nice gift from my brother, a Stevens Model 14. This gun is super accurate, but the action is kinda finiky at times. I am not sure if it's a design flaw, or just old, but I have more or less "retired" this gun to an informal plinker. Now, if you recognize my alias, you can probably guess what my other pump .22 is, and which I will probably be using at the next chance I get; a small frame Colt Lightning. I've not yet used it in a side match, but it's fun to use as a plinker, and seems to be quite accurate. Now, as far as lever action .22's go, well, I have yet to use one in competition, but will eventually. The first SASS Legal .22 I got is the Uberti 66 .22. This is essentially a reproduction of the Winchester 73 in .22 LR, but with a brass frame, supposedly the same one they use for their full size Henrys, and they call it a 66. It's a nice shooter. My first ever .22 caliber rifle, which I got as a boy from my father, is a Winchester 9422 in .22WRFM, which of course, makes it not legal for SASS matches. But, about 2 years ago, I acquired another 9422 in .22LR. It is impossible to not sing this rifle's praises on every level, and I look forward to trying it in some context soon. And that's all I've currently got for .22s. Theoretically, if I can find a real Winchester 73, or even one of the Uberti replicas, I am inclined to obtain one, and, perhaps, a Marlin 39A or it's progenitors, but time will tell, Anyway... I am surprised by all the votes the Henry is getting. Or maybe not. By all accounts, their .22 is a fine rifle.
  13. Some comments in other threads have "inspired" me to start a discussion on this specific topic. In relation to an event that uses a .22 repeating rifle, be it a side match, a main match that is allowing them for some unusual reason, or by Buckaroos, what seems to be the most popular type of gun? I say type for a reason. It could be argued that the Winchester 73 is the most popular main match gun in our game. But there does not seem to be a correspondingly most popular .22 rifle. At the side matches I've seen and participated in, pump action, rather than lever action .22s seem to be much more common. And even then, I have seen a plethora of vintage, replica, and modern rifle of different makes and models. Thinking about it, I can't really recall seeing a .22 lever gun, but I've not been to a huge amount of these events. Is this what other people have observed? Assuming the general preference for pumps is a real one, why do people think this is so? Are decent lever .22s too hard to find or too expensive, or both? And finally, what do people actually use for such events when they participate them. (Be specific.) Just a for fun general discussion.
  14. Are there things "better" for our game than the Henry Big Boy? Absolutely. Are they at least usable? Yes. Are they well made, they seem to be. Do they have limitations, yeah, it seems that they do. But when all is said and done, if you wanna use one, use one. If you don't, don't. I'll speak as someone who will never shoot fast, but who respects greatly those who do. Most of my guns, especially my vintage ones, are pretty much as they left the factories in New Haven, Hartford, or wherever. Some of my modern replicas have had some minimal modification to make them more workable, but only what is needed. For example, when my Armi San Marco 92 had an action that too horrible to use, my instructions to the gunsmith were, "I don't want a race gun. I just want it to work like a real Winchester." And that's what I got and I've always been happy with it. I like shooting guns "as close as possible" to they way they were back in the day. But, I have nothing against those who do as much as possible within the existing rules to make their guns "better." It's all part of the game. I know I'l never win, but I will always have fun. And that's the most important thing. Now, with regard to the Henry Big Boy, I personally am not a fan of the rifle, for the reasons stated above in my previous post. But you know, even though the gun may not be ideal for our game, I think it's rather nifty that they've come out with one commemorate our sport. I doubt we'll ever see a whole bunch of them on the line, but I think it's rather cool that it exists. I just might get one for myself, just cuz they were nice enough to create it in the first place. With regard to the often stated criticism in how their marketing tries to imply a connection to the original Henry company, yeah, that's not cool. But after a lot of years pondering it, I don't think it's worth getting worked up over. We all know the truth, and they are not fooling anyone. I think it's far more impressive that someone has made a SASS branded gun. Nobody else does. At least Henry is trying to reach out to us. No reason to bite them.
  15. I will say that once, when my own gun had a problem, someone had one of these and loaned it to me. It worked just fine for me with no problems. Now, I am no where near a "fast" shooter, but the gun worked just fine for me. But I will also say that, as a left handed shooter, I did not like the hot gasses hitting my right wrist all the time. That more than anything is why I am not interested in the gun. It seems to be a well made, functional design. It's just not "right" for me personally. I'll also say, the one time I used a Marlin for similar reasons, it did not have this problem.
  16. Even though I am not crazy about the caliber, or the gun, this is a very interesting thing. It might make for a nice addition to the collection. Of course, if I DID get this, I'd have to get a .22, one of their things in .45-70 and their Mare's Leg to complete the collection... I'll have to think about this...
  17. I wonder how affects the C&R FFL. I have 2 pistols on my C&R that I plan to give to my nephews as soon as they get theirs. No profit involved.
  18. Hi, everyone. Let me plug this magazine... https://fmgpubs.com/product/old-west-history-guns-gear-2024-special-edition/ This caught my eye because that is an honest to goodness AWA Lightning Bolt pistol on the cover. I immediately ordered a hard copy, and then, being the impatient fellow that I am, I ordered a PDF copy as well. I am very glad I did. You see, the article has a very special couple of features. While the one pictured here on the cover isn't, inside, in the article itself, there is a picture of MY Lightning Bolt, and I am quoted in the article! This makes me feel very happy. But the article is not about me. It's about this very interesting and rather rare pistol, and I learned a lot from this well written article. My kudos to the author for an excellent write up. The author is billed as Alan Garbers, but we know him here by a different name. I will out of respect allow him to identify himself at his own discretion. Anyway, I really enjoyed the article in question for obvious reasons, and there's a lot of other interesting stuff in the issue as well. Thank you "Alan" for a well written and informative article. I am honored to have been able to contribute to it in some small way. So... Who has the third one? Maybe we Lighting Bolt owners could start a club or something....
  19. Interestingly enough, pump guns do seem to be dominate in the .22 areas of our game. Good reliable pumps can be had for a fraction of the cost of a .22 lever gun, when you can even find them. A Winchester 9422, Marlin 39A, or even an Uberti made replica of the .22 version of the Winchester 73 or their ersatz model 66 .22 will cost more used than many good quality pump action .22's cost brand new. Yes, there is the Henry .22 that is very reasonably priced, and by all counts, a good gun, but prices for some of these things are outright weird.
  20. Lightings? You mean these? From top to bottom... Colt Large Frame. .45-85. (Colt's proprietary version of .45-70 using a 285 grain bullet. You can load for it with unmodified .45-70 brass.) AWA Medium Frame. .45 colt. My first Lightning. I wanted to get one just to have one. It has become my favorite main match rifle, and the only one I've ever shot a clean match with. I am faster with it than any lever gun. (But I am a slow shooter.) Colt Medium Frame. .44-40. Costa Rican military surplus. Note the bayonet lug. (Anybody got a bayonet for it?) AWA Medium frame .44-40. My second Lightning. The .45 Colt version gives you a lot of blow back, and must be kept clean, or the firing pin channel will get clogged with gunk and make it not fire. (Gunscrubber is your friend if you have one in .45) One day I said, "If I ever find a .44-40 AWA, I'll buy it." I did, and I did. Never regretted it. Colt Medium Frame .32-20. Works flawlessly. Was sold as being "lovingly restored with an expert action job." The original magazine spring was weak with age, so I replaced it. No problems since. (Genuine antique.) Colt Small Frame .22 Long. A sweet little shooter. AWA Lightning Bolt pistol, .45 Colt. Exceedingly rare "Mare's Leg" type pistol based on the Lightning design. Not sure how many AWA made before they folded up their tents, but I have read less than a dozen. Very fun gun to shoot! Not pictured: Taurus being reconfigured to .44 Special by a gunsmith. Will say more about it when I finally have it on hand. Once the Lightning Bug bites you, you will become addicted. And once that happens, well, this picture happens. Here's a run down of what the general consensus on the Wire seems to be about this classic design. Original Colts. Hit or miss. On the one hand, Colt stopped making them for a reason. On the other, they made a lot of them before throwing in the towel. They seem to be hit or miss. Generally, later ones worked out a lot of the issues the early ones had, but the early ones can be made to work. All of my real Colts are antiques and work just fine. Work I've had to have done to them is minimal, and more due to age than lack of workability. Exception to this is the .22. It was made in 1899. Original Colts do slam fire. AWA. Some people love 'em. Some people hate 'em. My own experience has been very positive, and I would recommend one if you can find it on the used market. When I was trying to get my first one, I saw three in the same gun store. An AWA, a Taurus and a Beretta. The Taurus action felt like pulling two pieces of sandpaper against each other. The Beretta was smoother, but very clunky. The AWA was butter smooth, and just felt right. I bought the AWA and never looked back. It's a .45, and supplanted my beloved Winchesters as my favorite type of gun. Other people report nightmares with this gun, but that is not what happened to me. I'll be honest and say that it seems to be luck of the draw. They slam fire. Pedersoli. Has a reputation for being a very well made gun. Will work well out of the box, but some pards may feel some tuning is needed. I don't have one of these, so I can't comment beyond what I have read. I don't think they slam fire, but can be made to do so. The most expensive when new of all the replicas, but you get what you paid for, and they are the only ones still being made. Beretta. I believe these were made by Uberti. As described above, I felt it had a very clunky action, and did not buy it. No experience with how they actually work or if they slam fire. USFA. Rare as hen's teeth. They didn't make very many before the company imploded. Commentary on the wire has been mixed from so so to excellent. Don't have one, so I can't comment. Don't know if they slam fire. Taurus. Supposedly it makes a very good tomato stake. In the days when other new ones were selling for 6 to 9 hundred dollars, these were $400. That may tell you something. They CAN be made to work. The gunsmith who is creating me my .44 Special told to get a Taurus .45 as the base gun, so I did. IIRC, someone told me they don't slam fire, but can be made to. If you like these things, you'll wind up loving them. If you don't, no argument, no matter how reasonable, will change your mind. I suppose that is fair, given how it seems to be hard to get one that runs reliably. But as a wise person once said to me, why is it so bad that they need some work? Almost every one has their lever guns tuned at least a little bit for our game, so why is it a problem for the Lightning? Will I get more of these? Possibly. I have no pressing need/desire to do so. Nor do I wish to have one in every possible caliber. But the idea of having at least one of every manufacturer is an intriguing one. Beware the Lightning Bug! His bite causes an incurable fever! As others have said, Lassiter is the guy for these. I have had to have some repair work done to mine, and he has been able to fix 'em up perfect every time. As far as other pump guns go, Remington did come out with one in .44-40 the early 20th century, but that makes it outside of our time period, and it's hammerless, so it's not a viable alternative. Then there is the Marlin 27. These were in .32-20, and hammered, so even though they are a post 1900 design, it has been suggested that they may be okay. BUT, I have never seen one at a match for a very simple reason, they all have half magazines and won't hold 10 rounds. That makes them not really viable either, even if they are okay.
  21. I was thinking I'd use it for the mini-match. Got the pins BTW
  22. I got a used 66 in .44-40. It had clearly been worked on by someone. The hammer spring had been so lightened that you could see the hammer falling noticeably slower than on a stock Henry I have in the same caliber. Also, it had had it's lever safety removed. (The very early 66's imported by Navy Arms had a 73 style lever safety on them for some reason. Anyway, I took the gun to Happy Trails of The Smith Shop and asked him if he could return it to more or less factory specs. He was able to reinstall the lever safety, and the hammer now falls much faster and never fails to make the gun go bang. Based on how HEAVY a stock 66 hammer spring was when I got an unmodified one a few years later, I'll say that some changes are likely in order. If/when you want to get an action job done, just don't go "too far" with it. Buy the same token, you mentioned that yours is a .45. I will say that you get some blowback in that caliber, and once I went too long without cleaning, and it caused failure to fire like you described in my Lightning. After a good cleaning, and flushing out the firing pin with Gunscrubber solved that problem. So all I say in that regard is, with a .45, keep your rifle clean.
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