Garrison Joe, SASS #60708
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Posts posted by Garrison Joe, SASS #60708
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Mine is a Spartan variation of the mp-220. It only has the top and bottom (large) extractor rods. Not two small and the large bottom rod. So, perhaps that will make a difference in how the work gets done.
good luck, GJ
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Yes, that model responds well to the modification. I can't guarantee that a single rod supports the remainder without it twisting, not having done one of those jobs. So Lefty should take a close look at the main extractor rod to see how it resists rotation as it opens. A brief inspection of mine shows the extractor rod is round and not keyed in any manner. So it may be necessary to move the upper thin rod down to a convenient spot closer to the main rod.
My gun was modified by a smith years ago and all that he did was to whittle away the upper ears of the extractor so that the shell is only touched by extractor from mid point (between the barrels) down and around to straight down. 90 degrees of contact. Has worked wonderfully for me and a previous shooter too.
good luck, GJ
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5 hours ago, Sedalia Dave said:
shortage of Chinese cotton that they use to manufacture nitrocellulose
The chemistry of the process more correctly is that cotton (or wood pulp) fibers are nitrated to make nitrocellulose. The old name of NC was gun cotton, which is where someone may have confused the two. That nitration is done in China (major manufacturer), Russia and India, in large part. None of which are really wanting to ship the nitrocellulose to us currently. It's the powder maker who then buys bulk nitrocellulose to manufacture smokeless powder by adding extra ingredients then shaping and drying and packing.
So, it's not really a shortage of cotton. It's due to lack of the US having nitration facilities anymore - except for the Radford Army Ordinance plant. Which is being modernized and expanded by BAE Systems. You can read a brief on it here:
And the markets not wanting/able to ship us bulk nitrocellulose.
good luck, GJ
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Load the Bear Creek like you do your current bullets. Test fire the first 20 or so. If you like it, keep going. If you or wife THINK the recoil is higher now, drop 0.2 grains of powder and load some more. Differences in two bullets of same weight are hard to tell at the velocities and pressures we load!
OAL for revolver loads only worries me when I load stuff within 10% of a maximum load - cowboy is certainly not there. OAL for feeding function in a lever rifle - now that is a SERIOUS concern!
good luck, GJ
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I'm trying to help another shooter right now make light loads on his Dillon SL900 - it's a pain! I don't own one. I don't recommend one when there are easier machines to run for loaders who don't have much experience. Thanks, but I think its a tough machine that does not run on the same engineering principles as most other shotshell loaders, which really makes it tough for a shooter to move up to it.
What I give other shooters here is advice based on my experiences.....that is what it is. And my mileage does vary from yours.
good luck, GJ
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I've used a Bair HoneyBair, a Mec 600 Jr, an RCBS MiniGrand, a Mec Grabber, and now a Hornady 366. For what is needed for almost all pards shooting cowboy only, a Mec 600 Jr is hard to beat. Easy to set up, easy to learn, easy to adjust to a different load if you want to, reliable, light weight.
I'm using the 366 because I got it at a bargain price, rebuilt it, and now it's run like a tank for the last 15 years! But I ask it to make about 2500 shells a month for Sporting Clays, Wild Bunch and Cowboy. Buying a new one right now is like opening your wallet at the Audi dealership, though. Find one used if you want one.
If you are buying for a few shoots a month, 50 shots max each, then the MEC 600 Jr is plenty of loader. Reasonable price, especially if you find a lightly used one.
If shooting only 3/4 ounce loads in 12 gauge, the only major loader I would stay away from is the Dillon SL900. It just does not have enough range of adjustment in the wad seating operation to handle very light loads like cowboys use. And it's a complex machine.
And due to the amount of plastic parts on it, I would avoid an RCBS Grand (I hear they are close to or already discontinued at the factory, as well).
If you are heavier into shotgunning, then a high volume "progressive" press that runs more than one shell in the shell plate at a time is often worth it. But some may not be real adaptable to low noise low recoil type loads. If that is your type of shooting, generally better advise on the Spolars/Ponsness Warrens/ etc can be found on the competitive shotgunning forums like Shotgun World or Trap Shooters.
So, since SO much of the decision ought to hinge on your volume of shooting, your level of experience with reloading, and the variety of shells/loads you intend to make, and you have told us nothing about those items, can't recommend going to more expensive machines for most cowboys. Run a Mec 600 Jr like a lot of us do. If you run that one to death in a couple years, then you can reconsider your next choice then.
good luck, GJ
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Or the trigger tip may have broken off or chipped. That is even more fragile than the full-cock notch on the hammer. This can happen if you pull the trigger hard enough with the hammer at half-cock.
good luck, GJ
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The top groove is called a crimp groove, since it has a different shape of groove than a lube groove. But the ammo looks great. To hijack a publishers' slogan - "If it feeds, it leads."
You don't need our approval. Hope that's not what you were looking for when you asked for "help"
good luck, GJ
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Or one can place the hex locking ring of the die in the jaws of the vise and not have any contact on the threads of the die body by the vise jaws....
It takes a BIG vise to hold the die head of a Dillon press. And it's an expensive part made of aluminum - not something to beat on.
GJ
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Yeah, I take the die out of my Dillon 550 and chuck it up in my bench vise (with heavy brass jaws) where I can whale away as needed.
good luck, GJ
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Disassemble with the gun inside a cardboard box. Parts which try to escape are normally caught and dropped to the bottom of the box.
The more valuable or necessary the gun, the more important to "box it"
good luck, GJ
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But, sometimes you just need to give up on the real weak search that the forum software provides and use a search tool that is powerful.
To do this, open a browser window, and using a Google search page, enter:
site:sassnet.com stoeger choke tubes
This REALLY gives you the advantage of using one of the most powerful ways to search, and to focus the search just on one web site (like SASS's web site).
So this returns a bunch of threads that have asked the same question of "what tubes does a Stoeger use?"
https://forums.sassnet.com/index.php?/topic/164396-screw-in-chokes-for-stoeger/
https://forums.sassnet.com/index.php?/topic/240620-chokes-for-the-stoeger-supreme/ Hmmm - seems OP asked this same question almost 9 years ago.
https://forums.sassnet.com/index.php?/topic/256297-stoeger-supreme-coach-gun-choke-question/
https://forums.sassnet.com/index.php?/topic/295144-shotgun-chokes-for-cas-target-distances/
etc
I don't know if this works with other search tools, but it would be easy to try out, if you have a dislike of Google search.
good luck, GJ
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I searched in our forum, and quickly found a post from last December that has the same answer, too.
The search function takes a little practice to make it work for you. Since you want to see posts that talked about Stoeger choke tubes, I made my search terms in the search field (top of every forum frame) look for the terms "Stoeger + choke" Just a "Stoeger choke" search would require the two words to be found exactly next to each other to be shown as a match (not what most multi-word searches ought to do, but that is the way the Invision forum software has been programmed). So, you need a plus sign between terms that do not have to be exactly adjacent, but should be present somewhere in the same original post or any reply.
good luck, GJ
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19 minutes ago, Dusty Devil Dale said:
tried everything except concentrated Hydrochloric Acid, which would dissolve away the brass but not the steel die.
No! HCl will dissolve the steel almost as fast as the brass. Don't try that.
I've NEVER stuck ANY brass case (rifle cases are the toughest) that could not be removed by use of a stuck case remover. Never EVER really lean on a press handle if a case does not resize! Stop and find out what the problem is (usually lack of lubricant or filthy die or case).
And, OP, I reload every month of the year. I shoot every month of the year. I have time every month of the year. So I use it to reload.
good luck, GJ
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Searching this forum doesn't seem to yield any results.
But searching the various choke tube manufacturers sites QUICKLY shows you the correct answer:
Carlson's web site (choketubes.com) shows you what chokes install in most every shotgun.
Your Stoeger Coach Supreme takes:
Stoeger Coach Supreme Uplander (Side by Side) Shotguns
Interchanges with Carlson's Winchester, Browning Invector & Mossberg 500 style threads
Trulock Chokes says that for a Stoeger 12 gauge Coach gun:
interchanges with Trulock’s Win-Brn-Moss style. That is, the Winchester, Browning Invector or the Mossberg 500 style tubes.
SERIOUSLY doubt a Remington RemChoke style choke tube will fit.
good luck, GJ
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1 hour ago, Red Eye Jim said:
I managed to get a piece of .45 Colt brass stuck my Dillon Sizing/Depriming die. I mean really stuck
Well, all my Dillon carbide sizing dies have a threaded stem with the decapping pin on the end, and the stem unscrews easily. Then you can drive the case down and out with a hammer and a stout brass punch stuck through the top of the (now open) die. Why can't you accomplish that?
Any good stuck case remover will let you pull a case, but it takes a drill and ability to tap a thread (tools include proper drill bit and tap). A vise is very handy too. But it will take 5 times longer to pull the case with a case remover, and I've not had to do that on straight wall (pistol) cases.
Use some Kroil lubricant to soak the complete die overnight and that will often wick into the junction between case and die body. Makes most any removal effort a little easier.
good luck, GJ
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Well, if you think that is your only route forward, then that's what you think. Don't understand what you are asking us for if several experienced reloaders give you the same conclusions.
One load suggestion I saw in one of those citations is down right guaranteed to be dangerous......20 grains of "some shotgun powder" to load a pistol cartridge.......yikes!
Guess in this part of the world we're fortunate to have at least some options other than waiting for situation to get better.
good luck, GJ
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1 hour ago, Jeb Stuart #65654 said:
Any plates remaining after the second five handgun rounds may be shot with shotgun.
QuoteP for failure to clean the remaining targets on star with shotgun..
Because the word "MAY" is in the instructions, it is not required for the shooter to try to make up ANY Texas star misses! It's just an option offered to the shooter.
After first five rounds are fired, a different target type becomes "active" and the five stationary targets become "inactive". So, no P for hitting any of them with the second five shots.
So, 5 misses for TS plates not dislodged. Next.
good luck, GJ
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13 minutes ago, Quiet Burp said:
the comments are all "Do what everyone else is doing breakdown shotgun shells".
Some of the worse advice going. Because factories load with non-canister powder (stuff that is not available to reloaders) made cheaply and only to a particular performance specification, which they would not "tell their mother on their death bed."
If you were to use it in low pressure pistol cartridges, there's PROBABLY minimum risk. Because you can fairly well watch for pressure signs in cartridge loads. In shotshells, it would be a lot like playing Russian Roulette, since the max safe pressures are very low, and plastic hulls and shotshell primers do not let you see accurate pressure signs.
Probably lots better to switch to Black Powder or subs.
good luck, GJ
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First, check carefully for any "set screws" or pins that might be holding the sight on. Not common for Ubertis, but you can never tell what a smith might have done in the past.
Probably, if the gun has been in the wet often, it's rusted in place. I find Kroil and a heat gun is about the best technique to loosen that. Tap that lightly during the soak to add some vibration to increase penetration, and let the Kroil work for 12 to 24 hours. Most fastener locking liquids will also weaken up with heat gun heat.
I would NOT get a barrel hot with a torch to the point of showing a little red heat. Too much chance of oxidizing the rifling.
If all else fails, with a hack saw cut CAREFULLY across the sight until you get down to within a few tens of thousandths of an inch from the dovetail in the barrel. That will release any binding pressure from the sides of the dovetail and probably let you break it free.
good luck, GJ
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On 5/2/2024 at 7:26 AM, Captain Bill Burt said:
have experienced a few failures to feed with lead bullets. That may be attributable to my reloading, or to the gun.
Describe exactly how the feed failures sit in the action and we can make a real good guess. But failing to feed GOOD lead bullet loads when the gun feeds jacketed rounds, usually means the feed ramp and barrel entry ramp need to be fitted and smoothed. Take a couple of pictures of how rounds stop in the action when it won't feed, post 'em.
Post a couple pictures of the loaded rounds you are making, too. Seating too long and having rounds stick in the throat of the barrel is a VERY common problem for folks loading lead for 1911 for the first few months.
Factories do not usually worry at all about whether the gun feeds lead ammo, since 95% of .45 auto ammo shot is jacketed. Used to be Bullseye shooters who needed gunsmiths around. Now it's several action sports, but Wild Bunch may be the biggest users.
good luck, GJ
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Part availability and smiths to install them are very limited. Whereas a lever gun, even a 92, can be worked on by many.
good luck, GJ
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Yes, an OOB incident often will cause a 73 design to bend the lever. The bend is what keeps the lever from contacting the trigger safety plunger, as you picture shows. If you can find an undamaged lever to use as a pattern, it's easy to bend it back to good shape - I've done that to 2 guns and they still run fine. New parts for a Miroku 73 are HARD to buy.
If you were trying hard to close an action, slamming the lever, the spring loaded firing pin can fire the round even when the round is partially out of chamber.
If you bounce the case up off the channel in the carrier block so the primer gets "speared" by the extractor tip, same thing can happen.
If you stuck a slug in the throat of the barrel from a squib or a no-fire case, the next round does not fully chamber and the FP can be carried forward by inertia of loading next round into chamber.
A reload with lead shaved off the bullet base, a fat crimp or no crimp at all or very long seated bullet can fail to chamber fully, and FP slams forward if action is worked hard.
Your "long story" is going to be about the only clue you have to WHY the OOB happened. Almost all OOBs that I have been witness to (perhaps 10) have been when the shooter was trying to work the action real hard. This is not a gun design that fixes itself by applying more force. Any resistance to normal operation means you have to stop and find out what is wrong. This is not like a Remington 700 or an M1 rifle where you can beat on the bolt handle with a hammer.
good luck, GJ
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This just started during the last couple hundred rounds and I get 1 or 2 out of around 10 loads.
Ok, then your seater die probably picked up enough dirt and lube to make the seating "half a turn" too deep. Clean the stem of the seater die (and body if dirty in the bore), then adjust to seat to MIDDLE of the crimp groove, not touching the band at top.
Happens to all of us cast boolit loaders, eventually even to the folks loading poly coated slugs. GJ
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Gunsmith question: Baikal MP220 extractor mod?
in SASS Wire
Posted
From the pictures Willie took, I would think he installed TWO spring pins, one to help hold the top half in place, and one to act as a guide rod in the lower half. I see two spring pins in his.
I think the way the Russians built them was with just the extractor rod (bottom) and one guide rod at the top.
good luck, GJ