Casting bullets; advice for a first timer

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

There's a possibility that I may dabble in some bullet casting.  Not that I would have to, but for certain odd calibers, I might.  Some kits come with a free mould from LEE.  One question that I have is knowing that this process involves considerable heat, where do you do your casting ?  What kind of table or surroundings to preclude possibility of problems with that molten lead etc.  Also, what other suggestions for a first timer would you offer ?

Horace

[Leroy Luck]

I do my casting on top of a roll around toolbox from Harbor Freight. I keep the lead pot on a baking sheet and an ingot mold underneath the bottom pour spout. I’ve been casting in my garage with every door open for awhile, but as of recently I’m outside under a canopy for more ventilation. 
 

Unless you have a source for lead that’s the exact hardness as what you need, I would recommend buying ingots ready to cast. I’ve purchased mine from Missouri Bullet company in the past and use them for my long range bullets. 
 

A good lead thermometer is a necessity. Some even use a PID controller to better regulate the temperature; I’ve been meaning to get one, but have had other things to worry about. 

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

Thanks !  I have a Harbor Freight near me.

Horace

[Jack Spade]

 A copy of the Lyman Cast Bullet handbook is worth every penny.  If you can't find one for sale check ebay. 

[Silver Creek Jack]

Horace, do yourself a huge favor and buy a lead casting book, Lyman cast bullet Handbook is a good one, you can pick it up from Track of the Wolf an excellent source for all things cast bullets. Don’t ever cast in an enclosed space without excellent ventilation and protective gear. Casting is a great hobby and can have very rewarding results but not without expert guidance and the proper equipment. I don’t consider myself an expert, but I have been casting for 45 years and have made every mistake that probably can be made but you don’t have to, if I can help PM me anytime.  SCJ

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

Buy a good thermometer and cast at 775-800*

Skim and flux often.

Ladle pour is best.

[Sedalia Dave]

Don't buy anything till you read the below books.

 

From Ingot to Target: A Cast Bullet Guide for Handgunners

 

NRA cast bullet manual

Buy a copy of Paul Mathews book Casting Premium Bullets for the BPCR.

 

Read both manuals cover to cover and then read them again.

 

Sign up and become a member of the following forums, 

the Art and Science of Bullet Casting

Cast Bullet assoc.

 

Be sure to read through their older posts. It'll take a while but the knowledge you'll acquire is priceless.

 

At a minimum you need a good DIGITAL thermometer. Analog thermometers are inaccurate to say the least and a total waste of money.

Edited July 18 by Sedalia Dave

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

All great information !  Thanks !

Horace

[watab kid]

your in the south , i expect all your casting would be out doors - that means you are in the best conditions , we here in the north find ourselves in heate=d garages in the winter , thats not good as its a closed space , 

[Lazy Eeyour]

Preheat the molds by casting a few returns. I always use two molds to maintain proper temperature without overheating. Don't sweat, as water in the casting pot is explosive. I wear welder's gloves. Bullet lube works as a fluxing agent. I use an old spoon to skim. Spoon has a wooden handle. Be aware that wheel weights these days are seldom made of lead.

[Jeb Stuart #65654]

A huge caution, don't ever let any moisture come in contact with the molten lead. One drop of water or sweat hitting the molten lead will have explosive results.

A friend had one drop of water from a gutter above his garage door hit the Lee pot with 10 lbs. of lead in it.  The lead exploded out of the pot, completely emptied  the whole pot instantly.  Luckily it exploded in a fan pattern away from my friend 

[Smokin Gator SASS #29736]

The only casting I have done is for 44-40 and 45 Colt blackpowder loads. I really can't imagine casting for my modern smokeless reloading. I had lead sheets and various lead I'd bought. Buying bullet alloys from producers didn't seem that much cheaper then buying ready to go cast bullets.

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

I have one mould on the way.  It is a .760 round ball.  That should cause concern 

Horace

[Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L]

so where are you in The Republic?

 

I'm down in Cypress, just NW of Houston and would be honored to show you around the casting process.  

 

something not mentioned is protective clothing especially eye protection,that The best,Something

 

I also PC (powder coat) if you want to see how that works.,

 

Over on Cast Boolits is a vendor who sells clean ingots for $85 for 50 lbs.  She's my go-to lead supplier.  Lead Ingots For Sale - Buyer's Choice

 

Best part of the entire process is your rejects go back into the pot so no one will ever know

 

cr

[Leroy Luck]

2 hours ago, Smokin Gator SASS #29736 said:

Buying bullet alloys from producers didn't seem that much cheaper then buying ready to go cast bullets.

Depends on what you’re casting with it… some of mine can’t be purchased and the only option is to cast. 

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

59 minutes ago, Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L said:

so where are you in The Republic?

 

I'm down in Cypress, just NW of Houston and would be honored to show you around the casting process.  

 

something not mentioned is protective clothing especially eye protection,that The best,Something

 

I also PC (powder coat) if you want to see how that works.,

 

Over on Cast Boolits is a vendor who sells clean ingots for $85 for 50 lbs.  She's my go-to lead supplier.  Lead Ingots For Sale - Buyer's Choice

 

Best part of the entire process is your rejects go back into the pot so no one will ever know

 

cr

I'm just north of Fort Worth.  Obviously eye protection and certainly protective clothing would be necessary.  I appreciate the offer of assistance also.  I used to occasionally used to go to Houston when my brother lived there.  He's in Colorado now.

Horace

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

47 minutes ago, Leroy Luck said:

Depends on what you’re casting with it… some of mine can’t be purchased and the only option is to cast. 

I'm sure there are some elusive ones.  I have been able to buy bullets for .43 Spanish and for 50-140 from Buffalo Arms.  Also loaded ammo for 8mm Nambu from them.

Horace

[Smokin Gator SASS #29736]

4 hours ago, Leroy Luck said:

Depends on what you’re casting with it… some of mine can’t be purchased and the only option is to cast. 

 

That was true for me with casting my own black powder bullets. I had enough lead I'd picked up reasonably along the way for them. But I would need much more alloy for the amount of smokeless ammo I've loaded over the years. For 9mm, 45acp bullets there wasn't a huge savings if I bought bullet alloy from manufacturers especially with them being made now with the hi tek coating that I like.

[Rooster Ron Wayne]

Cast out side or in a very well vented area .

Many ways of doing  things. 

Smoke your Molds .

Flux with sawdust .

Pre-heat your molds .

Water quench your dropped bullets. 

Ask 7 different people and get 9 different ways to do it .

Welcome to the dance .

Enjoying the process. 

Rooster 

[watab kid]

all of my friends that cast or casted in the past always had two or three molds depending on number of cavities = preheats are are a good way to go for best results , all this said we were always casting in 80s or 90s above in F here , except one friend that liked to cast in his garage in the winter - i think my lead levels were elevated on those occasions 

[Three Foot Johnson]

I do my bullet casting outside the basement door on an old govt surplus metal desk. The glued-on top came off and blew away about the second time it rained.  Tools and furnace are inside when not being used, of course. If you need to "coax" the bullet(s) out of the mold, DON'T tap on the mold with your sprue cutter mallet/stick - tap on the mold handle hinge bolt. As above, WEAR EYE PROTECTION. If you're going to be doing much casting, have your blood lead level periodically tested too.

I worked at a lead smelter from 1978 - 2001, so casting my own bullets just made sense. After the plant shut down, and I used up what I had, I've scrounged it up from other sources, and even bought it once - a fellow Cowboy shooter who worked at a scrap yard offered me 2000 pounds five years ago for $1000, and another old friend gave me about 300+ pounds of linotype just last week.  

 

Edited July 20 by Three Foot Johnson

[Matthew Duncan]

Before you start casting have your blood tested for lead.  Now you have a baseline.  After you have casted for a year or two restest your blood.  Blood lead content go up or remained the same?

 

I’d melt lead wheel weights into ingots outside under my shop roof overhang.  Cast bullets in my basement during the winter with the.nearby 3’x4’ window open.  When my blood tested in the eyebrow raising range.I concluded my ventilation was inadequate.  Quit casting, lead wheel weights were getting harder to find anyways. 

Edited July 20 by Matthew Duncan

[Tall John]

Horace,

 

I’m here in DFW too and shoot with LFSC on a regular basis.  I cast and powder coat for 9mm, 38/357, .45 and will add .44 cal on my next session.  
 

I typically only cast/PC outside of my garage on bluebird days in late fall, winter and early spring due to outside temps (wearing long sleeve shirts, gloves and PPE gets hot). Plus rain and hot lead are not a good combination! I would likewise be happy to walk you through my process.

 

I would suggest that you read the suggested books on the topic before investing. Lyman’s cast Bullet manual would be my first recommendation.

 

 I have aluminum, brass and steel moulds from Lee, MP, Accurate, NOE and Lyman.  My choice of moulds is based on 1) bullet profile, 2) capacity-I prefer large capacity moulds, 3) price and the fact that I’m casting strictly for Cowboy and plinking vs for high accuracy Like any other hobby, you can spend as little or as much as you want depending on your goals and requirements.

 

 I can cast about 800-1000 bullets in a full day casting session with my set up.  I cast with pairs of moulds to maximize production during the pour-cure-drop process.  Then I’ll spend another 2-4 hours on a separate day to powder coat the same with much of the time spent setting up and cleaning up.  As you will see in the pics, I use 4’ adjustable height lifetime tables, with my pots on firebrick and large aluminum & steel baking pans.
 

 I have an hand-me-down antique tip-up hot pot to pre-melt ingots,  an RCBS PROMELT bottom pour pot with an eBay shelf upgrade.  While not absolutely necessary it minimizes down time caused by putting cold ingots into your production pot and waiting for the alloy to come back up to temp.

 

On the right, you will see that I have a large griddle to preheat and keep my moulds hot throughout the day.  I recently replaced the griddle with a small toaster oven.  I have an assortment of tongs, spoons, and other tools for managing the process.  You will want a good analog thermometer, buy the one from Rotometals.com rather than RCBS’ which is way overpriced.

 

You will also see that I only cast outside of my garage with fans at my back.  Working with lead requires a lot of respect for safety protocol.  I also suggest getting a baseline heavy metals blood test during your next annual physical regardless of what the naysayers say.  (Ask me why later) 

 

I got into this because 1) I could get all the indoor range scrap lead I wanted for free, 2) wanted bullet specific bullet profiles, and 3) wanted to be self sustaining ‘cause I lived in a navy-blue state at the time.

 

i have an entirely different set up for melting down scrap range lead and pewter and casting ingots.

 

happy to discuss further…..
 

 

 

my powder coating set up that I used to do in my garage with the doors and windows open.  I now do it outside of my garage.👇👇👇

 

 

 

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

7 minutes ago, Tall John said:

Horace,

 

I’m here in DFW too and shoot with LFSC on a regular basis.  I cast and powder coat for 9mm, 38/357, .45 and will add .44 cal on my next session.  
 

I typically only cast/PC outside of my garage on bluebird days in late fall, winter and early spring due to outside temps (wearing long sleeve shirts, gloves and PPE gets hot). Plus rain and hot lead are not a good combination! I would likewise be happy to walk you through my process.

 

I would suggest that you read the suggested books on the topic before investing. Lyman’s cast Bullet manual would be my first recommendation.

 

 I have aluminum, brass and steel moulds from Lee, MP, Accurate, NOE and Lyman.  My choice of moulds is based on 1) bullet profile, 2) capacity-I prefer large capacity moulds, 3) price and the fact that I’m casting strictly for Cowboy and plinking vs for high accuracy Like any other hobby, you can spend as little or as much as you want depending on your goals and requirements.

 

 I can cast about 800-1000 bullets in a full day casting session with my set up.  I cast with pairs of moulds to maximize production during the pour-cure-drop process.  Then I’ll spend another 2-4 hours on a separate day to powder coat the same with much of the time spent setting up and cleaning up.  As you will see in the pics, I use 4’ adjustable height lifetime tables, with my pots on firebrick and large aluminum & steel baking pans.
 

 I have an hand-me-down antique tip-up hot pot to pre-melt ingots,  an RCBS PROMELT bottom pour pot with an eBay shelf upgrade.  While not absolutely necessary it minimizes down time caused by putting cold ingots into your production pot and waiting for the alloy to come back up to temp.

 

On the right, you will see that I have a large griddle to preheat and keep my moulds hot throughout the day.  I recently replaced the griddle with a small toaster oven.  I have an assortment of tongs, spoons, and other tools for managing the process.  You will want a good analog thermometer, buy the one from Rotometals.com rather than RCBS’ which is way overpriced.

 

You will also see that I only cast outside of my garage with fans at my back.  Working with lead requires a lot of respect for safety protocol.  I also suggest getting a baseline heavy metals blood test during your next annual physical regardless of what the naysayers say.  (Ask me why later) 

 

I got into this because 1) I could get all the indoor range scrap lead I wanted for free, 2) wanted bullet specific bullet profiles, and 3) wanted to be self sustaining ‘cause I lived in a navy-blue state at the time.

 

i have an entirely different set up for melting down scrap range lead and pewter and casting ingots.

 

happy to discuss further…..
 

 

 

my powder coating set up that I used to do in my garage with the doors and windows open.  I now do it outside of my garage.👇👇👇

 

 

 

Lots of excellent information !  Thanks John !

Horace

[Griff]

I've been casting since 1978 when I bought my first muzzleloader.  I now mainly cast for my BP cartridge loads, rifle & pistol.  Although I do cast a LOT of .30-30 bullets for my SASS long range & hunting needs.  While I have single & double cavity molds, I prefer 3 or 4 cavity molds.  I have a couple of Lee 6-cavity molds, but, haven't ever consistently had them drop 6 good bullets, 5, yes, 4 usually.  The larger cavity molds speed up production time.

 

You've gotten good, and not so good advice on this thread... like Rooster said, ask 7 different people how to do it, and get 9 answers.  Sedalia Dave gave some excellent teaching tools... If you're already loading cast bullets and don't have a copy of Lyman's Cast Bullet Handbook, shame on ya!  A lead thermometer is good, digital version is better, and a PID Controller is BEST!  I have two pots, a 20 lb Lee with external PID controller for pure Pb and Lyman's Mag 25 with a built-in PID controller for my alloyed lead.  Like Tall John, I'm here in No TX, but cast indoors in my workshop at the front of my barn.  I mainly cast in the early spring or late fall into December, depending on temps, although running a pot in our relatively mild winter weather isn't as onerous as it would be further north.  The shop is an uninsulated, metal walled & roofed extension to the pole barn.  But, I have an sliding car sized door at one end of the shop and a man-door at the other.  I control the amount of breeze I get by adjusting the sliding door.  I generally run 2 molds, even if only one of them is what I need casting... I always, just cast and dump the first several drops from each mold, until they're warm enough to consistently drop good bullets.

 

I generally only wear one welding glove on the hand holding the mold, the other is non-gloved to switch between the knocker & stirring, skimming spoon, etc.   I'd also recommend wearing leather work boots, vs. tennis shoes or anything less protective from the accidental spilling of molten lead.  Once, as I was melting wheel weights, the handle of my pot broke and the entire contents, about 2 quarts of molten lead dropped from about 2 feet off the concrete floor of my shop.  Lead splatter cools rapidly, but somewhere I have a picture of my boots covered with a thin layer of lead... literally, a lead foot!  

 

No one mentioned the worst thing about casting your own bullets... lubing & sizing!  I don't have anything that accepts an "as-cast" bullet, besides, pan lubing is a messy business.  So... for me, it's the boring, tedious lubing & sizing step added.  

 

BTW, the admonishment about getting water, sweat, moisture in your lead is rather reserved...  IT'S FLAT (insert favored Naval expletive here) DANGEROUS!  Or as my friends south of the border would say... PELiGRO! PELIGRO! PELIGRO!

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

Thanks, Griff !  Lots of valuable info on this forum.  I appreciate it !

Horace

[Griff]

20 minutes ago, Horace Patootie, SASS #35798 said:

Thanks, Griff !  Lots of valuable info on this forum.  I appreciate it !

Horace

One idea that I haven't incorporated in my shop, that I'd like to, is installing a kitchen type (industrial version) exhaust hood over my casting area, that way lead vapors would be sucked up, and breeze control would be mostly for my comfort.   Even on a pleasant 70-75º day, it can get pretty hot in the shop.

[Eyesa Horg]

1 hour ago, Griff said:

I've been casting since 1978 when I bought my first muzzleloader.  I now mainly cast for my BP cartridge loads, rifle & pistol.  Although I do cast a LOT of .30-30 bullets for my SASS long range & hunting needs.  While I have single & double cavity molds, I prefer 3 or 4 cavity molds.  I have a couple of Lee 6-cavity molds, but, haven't ever consistently had them drop 6 good bullets, 5, yes, 4 usually.  The larger cavity molds speed up production time.

 

You've gotten good, and not so good advice on this thread... like Rooster said, ask 7 different people how to do it, and get 9 answers.  Sedalia Dave gave some excellent teaching tools... If you're already loading cast bullets and don't have a copy of Lyman's Cast Bullet Handbook, shame on ya!  A lead thermometer is good, digital version is better, and a PID Controller is BEST!  I have two pots, a 20 lb Lee with external PID controller for pure Pb and Lyman's Mag 25 with a built-in PID controller for my alloyed lead.  Like Tall John, I'm here in No TX, but cast indoors in my workshop at the front of my barn.  I mainly cast in the early spring or late fall into December, depending on temps, although running a pot in our relatively mild winter weather isn't as onerous as it would be further north.  The shop is an uninsulated, metal walled & roofed extension to the pole barn.  But, I have an sliding car sized door at one end of the shop and a man-door at the other.  I control the amount of breeze I get by adjusting the sliding door.  I generally run 2 molds, even if only one of them is what I need casting... I always, just cast and dump the first several drops from each mold, until they're warm enough to consistently drop good bullets.

 

I generally only wear one welding glove on the hand holding the mold, the other is non-gloved to switch between the knocker & stirring, skimming spoon, etc.   I'd also recommend wearing leather work boots, vs. tennis shoes or anything less protective from the accidental spilling of molten lead.  Once, as I was melting wheel weights, the handle of my pot broke and the entire contents, about 2 quarts of molten lead dropped from about 2 feet off the concrete floor of my shop.  Lead splatter cools rapidly, but somewhere I have a picture of my boots covered with a thin layer of lead... literally, a lead foot!  

 

No one mentioned the worst thing about casting your own bullets... lubing & sizing!  I don't have anything that accepts an "as-cast" bullet, besides, pan lubing is a messy business.  So... for me, it's the boring, tedious lubing & sizing step added.  

 

BTW, the admonishment about getting water, sweat, moisture in your lead is rather reserved...  IT'S FLAT (insert favored Naval expletive here) DANGEROUS!  Or as my friends south of the border would say... PELiGRO! PELIGRO! PELIGRO!

Griff,

What temp do you like your lead for round balls? The hole in the sprue plate on my Lee mold is small and I seem either get wrinkles or if I run hotter, frosty balls. I hate when my balls are frosty🤠, wrinkled is to be expected 🤠!

[Griff]

3 minutes ago, Eyesa Horg said:

Griff,

What temp do you like your lead for round balls? The hole in the sprue plate on my Lee mold is small and I seem either get wrinkles or if I run hotter, frosty balls. I hate when my balls are frosty🤠, wrinkled is to be expected 🤠!

Between 680-720ºF.  The only RBs I cast are the .520" & .526" for my 53 caliber Hawken, which I've never found available for purchase, unlike the .375"s I use for CAS.  

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

24 minutes ago, Griff said:

Between 680-720ºF.  The only RBs I cast are the .520" & .526" for my 53 caliber Hawken, which I've never found available for purchase, unlike the .375"s I use for CAS.  

I have a mould on the way now; it is .760" round ball.  However, I have also found a supplier for these precast round balls.  The mould comes from England.  Before shipping, I had to pay a tariff on it.

Horace

[Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971]

3 hours ago, Griff said:

No one mentioned the worst thing about casting your own bullets... lubing & sizing!  I don't have anything that accepts an "as-cast" bullet, besides, pan lubing is a messy business.  So... for me, it's the boring, tedious lubing & sizing step added.  

 

+1, I size and lube with an RCBS lube/sizer.  I lube Big Lube bullets with black powder lube.  These bullets are hard to buy commercially.  I prefer to buy cast bullets from commercial casters as this helps me manage my time.  However, I cast round balls for my ROAs as these are overpriced.  They need no sizing as they get sized when they are loaded into my revolvers.

["Big Boston"]

90% of casting good bullets is skill, the other 90% is more Zen than skill. 

 

With range lead or home blended scrap and COWW, you get better results casting hot, between 700ºF and 750ºF. 

 

You know the mold is at the right temperature when the bullets come out silver. Too cold and they come out looking chrome, too hot is frosty. Look at Tall Johns pictures, IMO his bullets are in the chrome zone. The top end of chrome is a good bullet, but that zone is too narrow for my patience. The silver zone is a bit more forgiving. 

 

I think it took me two years before I had bullets I could use, then just like that things clicked. But my biggest boost came when I asked what temperature that my bullet guy casts at. He said 750ºF. I'd never cast that hot, ever. So I tried it and I no longer weight sort, very few culls. 

 

IIRC lead gives off lead vapors in abundance at 900ºF, melts at 621ºF, 750ºF is midway, I'm not comfortable, nor have I seen the need to go higher than 750ºF. Theoretically, an alloy like lino or #2 should casts at a lower temp as its melting point is much lower. 

 

LEE 6 cavity mold were mentioned, and IMO they are very good. Properly prepped they cast well, and most of the time you get 6 good bullets. LEE 2 cavity molds are a nightmare, their only good feature is the free handles. The secret to the 6 cavity molds is the anodized sprue plate. 

 

BB

[Apache Gunsmoke Dan]

Even if it's already been mentioned, I don't mind being a little redundant.

EYE PRO!

I have a little speck mark on my eye pro from where a drop of lead splashed out of my pot and it landed EXACTLY in the middle of the lens. That would've been my eyeball if I wasn't wearing them. Great little reminder every single time I put them on, to keep them on.

[Sedalia Dave]

Absolute best flux is ordinary saw dust. I take a plastic grocery bag to the local lumber yard and get all I want for free.

 

Most if not all of the commercial fluxes will remove tin from the mix if you get the alloy too hot. Tin is what makes it easy for the alloy to properly fill out the mould. It's also expensive to replace. Sawdust will not do this. 

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

I did receive my .760 round ball mould on monday from the maker in England.            www.ballmoulds.com   

 

Horace

Edited July 29 by Horace Patootie, SASS #35798