Crooked River Pete, SASS 43485 Posted July 11 Posted July 11 Ran across this video on YouTube, on it they claim the cox .049 engine was held to tolerances of 25 millionths of an inch. I find that hard to believe, I found it hard to work to 50 mil in a climate controlled shop. How could that keep running once it got hot? 3 5 Quote
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted July 11 Posted July 11 Bringing back a truck load of memories, TNX! 👍 3 Quote
El Sobrante Kid Posted July 11 Posted July 11 Interesting video. They don't claim that manufacturing tolerances were 25 millionths of an inch, though that is inferred several times. The actual claim is that a cylinder was paired with a piston and the maximum gap allowed was 25 millionths of an inch. So while the manufacturing tolerances were probably pretty tight, there was probably a range of a few thousandths. The real trick was to measure each cylinder and each piston and then match them together to get the desired 25 millionths of an inch. 4 Quote
Subdeacon Joe Posted July 11 Posted July 11 (edited) Per AI 6 sites The famous Cox .049 model airplane engines were designed with piston and cylinder tolerances of roughly 25 millionths of an inch (0.0000025 inches). Because of this incredibly tight, "lapped" fit, they do not use piston rings. The fuel and oil mixture creates a liquid seal inside, and running it without proper lubrication will cause immediate damage. The Miniature Engineering Craftsmanship Museum +1 Why 25 Millionths Mattered Lapped Fit: The piston and cylinder were paired and machined together to within 25 millionths of an inch to each other. Facebook·Model Engines - Old and New Liquid Seal: This exceptionally close tolerance used the oil in the fuel to create a hydraulic seal, eliminating the need for metal piston rings. Facebook·Model Engines - Old and New High RPM: By eliminating the friction of piston rings, these engines were free to rev extremely high—often exceeding 15,000 RPM depending on the model (like the Tee Dee series). Specific Fuel Needs: Because of this hyper-precise fit, these engines heavily rely on high-lubrication fuel (typically 20% oil content, ideally featuring a healthy dose of castor oil) to prevent them from wearing out or seizing. If you are restoring, running, or researching one of these engines, the key is proper fuel and maintenance. If you are planning to run one, tell me: What specific model of Cox .049 do you have (e.g., Babe Bee, Tee Dee, Black Widow)? Do you already have glow fuel, or do you need recommendations on the right mix? I can provide exact startup tips and maintenance guides tailored to your setup. 5 sites The claim is absolutely true. Cox mass-produced millions of .049 engines with tolerances so remarkably precise that individual pistons and cylinders did not even need to be custom-matched at the factory; they were completely interchangeable straight off the line. MH-AeroTools.de +1 The reason they didn't seize when hot comes down to a clever combination of materials science, geometry, and a specialized lubricant. 1. Thermal Expansion Matching If the piston expanded faster than the cylinder, it would seize instantly. To prevent this, Cox carefully selected their metals: The Cylinder: Made of hardened, high-carbon steel. The Piston: Made of a softer steel or specific iron alloy. Because both parts are ferrous metals (iron/steel based), they possess nearly identical coefficients of thermal expansion. When the engine gets hot, the piston and the cylinder expand outward at virtually the exact same rate, maintaining that 25-millionths-of-an-inch gap. Quora 2. The Tapered Cylinder A Cox cylinder is not a perfect straight tube. It is engineered with a subtle taper—the top of the cylinder bore (where combustion happens and heat is highest) is slightly tighter than the bottom. Cold: The piston feels tightest right at the top of its stroke. Hot: The intense heat at the top of the engine causes the upper cylinder to expand slightly more than the cooler bottom. This thermal expansion actually "straightens out" the taper, giving the piston a perfectly uniform clearance while running. 3. Castor Oil (The Ultimate Shield) Glow plug fuel contains castor oil, which behaves entirely differently than modern synthetic oils. YouTube·Mark Robinson +1 Synthetic oils thin out and vaporize under extreme heat. Castor oil thrives on heat. When it reaches extreme temperatures inside the engine, it undergoes a process called polymerization. It forms a tough, slippery, liquid-varnish barrier that physically prevents the metal of the piston from ever touching the metal of the cylinder wall. Essentially, the engine rides on a microscopic cushion of liquid oil rather than actual metal-on-metal contact. Edited July 11 by Subdeacon Joe 2 5 Quote
Subdeacon Joe Posted July 11 Posted July 11 https://craftsmanshipmuseum.com/artisan/leroy-cox/ 1 2 Quote
Gracos Kid Posted July 11 Posted July 11 I got a gas powered airplane like that for Christmas when I was 10 years old. Took it to a neighbor's house and with a roll of tarpaper made a runway in a cow pasture. My Dad's friend wanted to fly it too, so let him have the control and he flew it straight into the ground. Needless to say, the pieces were still fun to play with..... 4 Quote
Eyesa Horg Posted July 11 Posted July 11 You can still see the scar on the end of my left thumb from one of those! 3 1 Quote
Seamus McGillicuddy Posted July 12 Posted July 12 When I was a kid there was a boy down the street who was rather odd and obnoxious. When a neighbor complained about the noise from him flying his Cox model airplane “Delphy” simply went outside holding the thing in his hand with the engine running just to be annoying. Seamus 1 2 Quote
Forty Rod SASS 3935 Posted July 12 Posted July 12 COX OH FOUR NINE. Words tattooed into my brain forever. Adapted to planes, boats, cars, and military vehicles. Everything but trains 3 Quote
Three Foot Johnson Posted July 12 Posted July 12 (edited) This dusty old Sperry Messenger was equipped with a Cox .010 and a single channel pulse radio - rudder only. Some 55 years later, it still sits in the dust of past glory on top of my gun safe. One elevator is missing, the rudder is gone, and I've got no idea what ever became of the engine or radio. When everything was properly trimmed, it climbed in straight flight, and altitude was controlled with turns. Hard to learn, difficult to fly, impossible to land, and flew at a scaled speed of around 2000 mph, I think. You flew over an alfalfa field or tall grass til it ran out of gas, then just let it crash and hoped for the best. Edited July 14 by Three Foot Johnson 5 3 Quote
Buckshot Bear Posted July 12 Posted July 12 I remember getting so dizzy with my PT trainer and the bleeding knuckes. Best of all I remember how the wings, fuselage, engine firewall etc would always break to save the 2 cent rubber bands from breaking!!!!! 3 1 Quote
Cheatin Charlie Posted July 12 Posted July 12 If you really wanted that .049 engine to scream you would buy Missile Mist fuel at the hobby store. It had higher percentage of Nitro in it. Quote
Crooked River Pete, SASS 43485 Posted July 12 Author Posted July 12 8 hours ago, Cheatin Charlie said: If you really wanted that .049 engine to scream you would buy Missile Mist fuel at the hobby store. It had higher percentage of Nitro in it. And if you wanted your go cart to scream you put the cox fuel in it. 2 Quote
watab kid Posted July 13 Posted July 13 i had one of those , it ran well , i have no idea where it went nor the three planes id hadit attached to ........very likely my mother thought them trash , rest her soul she had little interest in such things Quote
Oak Ridge Regulator Posted July 14 Posted July 14 I had one in a jeep and it had a little rip cord to start the engine with 2 Quote
Eyesa Horg Posted July 14 Posted July 14 12 hours ago, Oak Ridge Regulator said: I had one in a jeep and it had a little rip cord to start the engine with That musta been pretty cool. I've mounted them to Tonka toys! 1 Quote
Subdeacon Joe Posted July 14 Posted July 14 (edited) 56 minutes ago, Eyesa Horg said: That musta been pretty cool. I've mounted them to Tonka toys! My brothers and I tried mounting one on a Pinewood Derby car. It did not go well. I haven't watched but the first couple of minutes of this, but it looks interesting: Edited July 14 by Subdeacon Joe 1 1 Quote
Buckshot Bear Posted July 14 Posted July 14 I think these were the start of my loss of hearing. 2 Quote
Seamus McGillicuddy Posted July 17 Posted July 17 On 7/14/2026 at 6:58 AM, Subdeacon Joe said: My brothers and I tried mounting one on a Pinewood Derby car. It did not go well. I haven't watched but the first couple of minutes of this, but it looks interesting: No doubt the judge decided it was too dangerous to fly since the pilot clearly had his entire view forward blocked by the engine. Seamus 1 2 Quote
Subdeacon Joe Posted July 17 Posted July 17 5 minutes ago, Seamus McGillicuddy said: No doubt the judge decided it was too dangerous to fly since the pilot clearly had his entire view forward blocked by the engine. Seamus Mounted as a pusher. The axis of thrust was way too high. Started it down the street and it did an amazing tumbling act. 3 Quote
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