10 gauge loads

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

Quite a while back, I bought a 10 gauge double barrel off the classifieds. I've shot it a couple of times at an indoor range with 3 1/2 " slug loads.  It's a lot of fun to shoot.  I have ordered some 10 gauge brass hulls and I'm going to order some .760 lead round balls.  For those of you that have used brass cases, once you get the projectile in the case, is there a crimp method to retain the projectile in the brass case ?  This is more of a fun project since I do have components and a MEC to load 10 gauge.  Any suggestions on this venture is welcome.

Thanks !

Horace

[Hoss]

My 10g brass recipe 

BP 

overpowder nitro card

Fiber wad

shot

1/3 of a fiber wad

overshot card 

Water glass glue. 
 

I load a square load. Same amount BP as shot. I generally load a fairly light load. 

 

Edited July 6 by Hoss

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

Thanks, Hoss !

Horace

[Blackwater 53393]

First, a couple of questions!

 

Do your brass shells use large pistol primers, 209s, or something else, (I have several dozen that use the old 57/157 primers)??

 

Are you planning on using the MEC to reload the brass shells?

 

What length brass shells do you plan to use?

 

The first question goes to what kind of priming system you’re going to need for that part of the operation. If you’re going to be using shells that take the large pistol primer, I would recommend the RCBS AutoPrime. It is made for installing pistol and rifle primers and there’s a shell holder made specifically for the brass shells. It won’t matter what length shell you use.

 

I’m not familiar with any MEC shotshell press that’s equipped for the pistol primer. I have tried to deprime my 10ga brass shells on my MEC 600 jr. MK5 and it didn’t like it. The 209 equipped shells and the 57/157 shells tried to stick in the decapping/sizing die and, of course the primer punch is too large to use for the pistol primed shell. For those, I have a set of CH4D dies for 10ga brass shells. They fit my RCBS Rock Chucker II and perform the depriming and full length resizing functions with one die and do a beautiful roll crimp and seat the over shot card with the other. No glue required!  I can take my finished shell out of the press and put in my shotgun and fire it immediately.

 

I do use the primer station on my 600 to install 209s and 57/157s if it’s on the stand on my bench. I can also use my Lee Load All II for that operation. The primer station on the Load All handles the 10ga shells with no problem, although I’m not sure if it can handle 3 1/2” brass shells, (mine are all 2 7/8” or shorter) without some sort of modification.

 

Most reloaders don’t roll crimp their brass shells because the die that does it is pretty expensive. The set is around $400.00, but if you are going to use those .760 round balls you’re going to have to be careful about securing them properly and a roll crimp over a good over shot card is the best way to do it.  For shot, you can use any of a number of different glues to do the job.

 

 
For plastic shells for the 10ga I highly recommend the MEC 600 jr.!  The only modification that I would recommend is to get the Balistic Products eight point  crimp starter die. Most modern shells are eight point crimp and MEC doesn’t offer one.

 

Back to brass shells. You can actually do all of the reloading procedures with simple hand tools. I even know of guys who have made resizing tools from pipe or metal tubing.  I started out with a flat steel plate, a long thin punch, a piece of hardwood dowel, a hammer, and a block of wood with a hole in it for the spent primers to fall through.

 

😜Be careful!! Brass shells are a deep rabit hole that you can wander around in for a long while!😜

[Blackwater 53393]

I’m going to add that if you roll crimp your brass shells, it would be a good idea to look into anealing them every few reloading cycles.  It’ll extend the life of the brass.

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

Thanks, Blackwater !  Lots of great info there. I'll be using 2 7/8" shells, large pistol primers and I was not planning on using the MEC.  I think you're right about the rabbit hole, but I'm going to jump in and give it a try.

Horace

[Blackwater 53393]

33 minutes ago, Horace Patootie, SASS #35798 said:

Thanks, Blackwater !  Lots of great info there. I'll be using 2 7/8" shells, large pistol primers and I was not planning on using the MEC.  I think you're right about the rabbit hole, but I'm going to jump in and give it a try.

Horace

Enjoy the ride! Let me know if I can help. 😎

[Sedalia Dave]

The round balls are likely going to be a loose fit in your brass hulls as the inside diameter of the hull should be .775" at a minimum. I suspect it'll be a bit larger as the brass will be thinner than a paper or plastic hull.

 

To take up the space I would patch the ball like you would for a muzzleloader. Patch material comes in different thicknesses. You can buy it from Track of the Wolf in varying thicknesses. Measure the inside diameter of the hull so that you'll know how thick the patch needs to be.

 

Debur the mouth of the hull so that it doesn't snag the patch.

 

The patch may be enough to secure the ball. If not after seating the ball, add some water glass or glue where it touches the hull.

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

Thanks, Dave !  Excellent ideas.

Horace

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

So today I bought an antique do it all 10 gauge loading apparatus.  Brass cases are on the way.  Purchasing .760 round balls today.  This should be exciting.  Not sure what the recoil will be like.  I'm used to shooting 10 gauge although I don't do it often.  I'm a little fascinated by big calibers.  I load for and shoot a 50-140 using a 650 grain bullet.  Any additional suggestions are welcome.  One person (not on this forum) suggested a slower powder.  I am currently using Longshot powder for 10 gauge. He suggested that the heavy round ball might work better with slower powder.

Horace

[Sedalia Dave]

While there are exceptions, Smokeless powder doesn't perform well in brass hulls.  For smokeless powder to properly ignite it needs to build up pressure.  In modern shells the crimp provides enough resistance to generate the necessary pressures.  With brass hulls there is no crimp to generate the necessary pressure for proper combustion. Brass hulls have a larger inside diameter so standard plastic wads will not seal properly as they are too small in diameter.

 

The other issue is that brass hulls have thin heads and lack the strength of plastic hulls with their thick base wad means they stand a good chance of failing if you get the load wrong.

 

AFAIK no manufacturer publishes smokeless load data for brass hulls. So you are way into uncharted territory.

 

Stick with Black Powder or a sub. Lots safer and the Smoke, Flames and BOOM will make you smile.

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

That sounds like a good idea.  I don't have BP anymore but I'm close to Bass Pro.  I suppose they sell some of the subs.

Horace

[Blackwater 53393]

I too will suggest a slower powder!! If you’re not using Black Powder or a suitable substitute, go with the minimum 10ga load recipe for the 2 7/8” plastic shells using something like Clean Shot, Perfect Pattern, or W231.  I’ve used all three and they work well.
The shells you’re going to receive are most likely Track of the Wolf unless you spent your pension for Rocky Mountain Cartridge shells. The TW shells are capable of handling light smokeless loads. The RMCC shells will handle anything that your shotgun will and probably more!

I don’t like to use smokeless powder in the MagTech shells, but they aren’t available in 10ga.

 

I would recommend using lead shot rather than the .760 round ball. The idea of a slug doesn’t bother me, but your round ball is smaller than the inside diameter, (0.775” id.) of your brass shell and the barrels of your gun too. Like Sedalia Dave said, you’re going to want to patch those round balls.

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

Still a work in progress.  Thanks for all of the information all of you have given.  I'm learning a lot.  I'll keep you posted as I go along.  I want to enjoy this but first of all to be safe while doing this.  Thanks to all of you !

Horace

[Three Foot Johnson]

My 10g reloading kit.

If sizing is required, I lay the pipe reducer fixture thingie over the jaws of a vice (the inside is turned to size on the ol' Jet lathe and polished), then tap the brass hull in with the rawhide mallet, turn it over and tap it out with the dowel with the pipe cap on the end. Decapping pins for 209's and pistol primers, powder measures, priming tool, brass anvil to bump-seat powder, wad, and cards with the palm of my hand using the other dowel seater thingie with the shotshell on one end and knob on the other. The 20g plastic hulls are shot measures, and an arch punch to punch card wads out of cardboard if I ran out and forgot to order any. 

 

I have never crimped a brass hull, just seat everything snug with the shotshell/knob/dowel seater thingie, and put a bead of glue around the overshot card.

 

 

 

Edited July 8 by Three Foot Johnson

[Blackwater 53393]

I ended up with my first set of CH4D dies, (12ga) when the wife of a cowboy friend who had passed offered me his entire inventory of brass shells and related items for a good price.  Mortimer Smith was a unique cowboy! He shot cap ‘n’ ball revolvers, a Spencer carbine, and a hammer double using brass shells exclusively. I wound up with a LOT of brass shells, some MagTech and some of several other brands and most were of same design as the MagTechs. Some, on the other hand, were original Winchester and others were Remington. Those last had come from the factory loaded with smokeless powder.

 

When I got my first 10ga shotgun, a genuine 1901 Winchester lever action 10ga, I bought a batch of 100 Federal shells that were cut down to 2 7/8” and since I was shooting Frontiersman almost exclusively, they got loaded with big doses of FFg or FFFg.

Along the way, I picked up a partial box, (18) of 10ga Winchester brass shells brand new in the box and I discovered Track of the Wolf had brass shells as well, so I bought seven more to make a full box of 25.

 

Doing a couple dozen brass shells at a time by hand is relaxing and fun, but I had acquired nearly 300 of the 12ga shells and my box of brass 10ga shells was now more than 75 and more on the way, so I bit the bullet and bought the CH4D 10ga dies because I was impressed with the finished brass 12ga product and it reduced my reloading time and eliminated the need for gluing the over shot cards into the shells, something that I had not been satisfied with. I resize and deprime in one motion on the Rock Chucker. I have the RCBS Autoprime to install the new primer. I can load powder, nitro card, wad, and shot on my MEC 600 and then set my over shot card and put a nice crimp on the shell with a single stroke on the Rock Chucker.  It still lets me carefully examine every shell throughout the process.

 

My dissatisfaction was caused, in part, by my system of using my shells. I generally used the oldest shells on the shelf first and if there was a long delay between the making and the shooting, I would sometimes have a card or two that dislodged when I loaded them, particularly when I used them in my 1901 or in my ‘97 when I’d shoot the brass shells out of it. I have used every recommended adhesive to secure the cards and ALL of them have produced the occasional experience of listening to my lead shot rolling down the barrel when I slammed the action closed at one time or another.

 

As I’ve said before, I can reload my brass shells and go from the press to the gun immediately. No waiting for the glue to dry and I never have to worry about those pellets escaping.

 

Not for everybody, but just right for me.

 

 

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

Well, I've given up on the idea of using smokeless powder in these 10 gauge brass shells if I wind up using the .760 round balls.  There is a Bass Pro/Cabelas just about 10 minutes from me and they have both Pyrodex RS and Triple 7 in stock.  May wander up there tomorrow and check it out.  I did search for the CH4D 10 gauge dies but can't find any available so far.  If anyone knows of any for sale, please let me know.

Thanks !

Horace

Edited July 8 by Horace Patootie, SASS #35798

[Cowtown Scout, SASS #53540 L]

2 hours ago, Horace Patootie, SASS #35798 said:

Well, I've given up on the idea of using smokeless powder in these 10 gauge brass shells if I wind up using the .760 round balls.  There is a Bass Pro/Cabelas just about 10 minutes from me and they have both Pyrodex RS and Triple 7 in stock.  May wander up there tomorrow and check it out.  I did search for the CH4D 10 gauge dies but can't find any available so far.  If anyone knows of any for sale, please let me know.

Thanks !

Horace

Everyone says Pyrodex RS is more corrosive than Black Powder.  Triple 7 makes for a hotter load.  When ever I shot .38 smokie rounds in my rifle I loaded with triple 7.  I have used Pyrodex RS loading for smokie shotgun (because I had some) but clean pretty well after using and when it is all gone will never use any again.  APP is the BP Substitute of choice and what you should really look for if you don't use real Black Powder.  I use APP in my 38-40 smokie rounds.  I now have some real BP that I will switch to for shotgun once the small amount of Pyrodex RS I have runs out (which will be soon).

Edited July 8 by Cowtown Scout, SASS #53540 L

[Colorado Coffinmaker]

 

OK, My Turn!! My Turn!!  Your chosen BIG LEAD BALL is going to rattle around on the 10Ga Brass hull and will also rattle around going down the barrel, and any cloth patch you use will most likely strip away really quick.  So my suggestion is to source a plastic 10ga wad from Ballistic Products that will accept your Big D@%&N Ball in the hull and also stay with it thru the bore.  That is exactly what I do loading All Brass MagTech 12Ga.  The plastic wad will also act as a "Cushion Wad" and with an ounce and a half to ounce and three quarter pay load, your gonna want a Cushion.

 

Now.  Pyrodex is a Rusting Agent that just happens to Burn.  I cannot, in good conscience recommend it for anything other than fertilizer.  And only then, if you want rusty plants.   I am also the Poster Kid for APP.  I load everything I shoot with APP.  Easy to get, cleans up really easily.  For shot shells I load with 2F.  In a 10Ga, with that Big D@$%n pay load, I'd probably start at 50Gr (by weight) and then play around.  For my 12Ga I load 40Gr (by weight), a BP Spitfire wad for a 1 ounce payload.  Nice mild load for a recoil wimp lie me.  Just my take.  Oh, and did I mention, Pyrodex is just a rusting agent that Burns??

 

I have never loaded Triple Seven and am no help there.  Oh well.

[El Chapo]

I would love a 10 gauge.  More room for (real) black powder.

[Griff]

38 minutes ago, Colorado Coffinmaker said:

Now.  Pyrodex is a Rusting Agent that just happens to Burn.  I cannot, in good conscience recommend it for anything other than fertilizer.  And only then, if you want rusty plants.   I am also the Poster Kid for APP.  I load everything I shoot with APP.  Easy to get, cleans up really easily.  For shot shells I load with 2F.  In a 10Ga, with that Big D@$%n pay load, I'd probably start at 50Gr (by weight) and then play around.  For my 12Ga I load 40Gr (by weight), a BP Spitfire wad for a 1 ounce payload.  Nice mild load for a recoil wimp lie me.  Just my take.  Oh, and did I mention, Pyrodex is just a rusting agent that Burns??

↑↑↑  If you ever get the chance, read the MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet) for Pyrodex. Hodgdon downplays its toxicity, and doesn't disclose some additives as "trade secrets".   It provides data for firefighters &, EMS personal for their protection when it's encountered.  Not something that you want to breathe... nor if you're the least bit caring about others, not something you want your friends breathing.  One of its by products is sodium dioxide., which is a class 4 toxic substance.  Its rusting capabilities are enhanced due to containing approximately 60% by volume of Potassium Nitrate and Perchlorate.  It is not recommended to dispose of it by dumping it on the ground, and do not wash it down the drain.  

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

I will look for Triple 7 at Bass Pro.  They say that they have it.  From what I've read, it is preferred over Pyrodex.  Where would I source APP ?  I will check on the 10 gauge plastic wads.  Probably available at Ballistic Products.  Thanks to all for the information !

Horace

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

Ordered the 10 gauge wads and a book on brass shotshell loading from Ballistic Products.

Horace

[Sedalia Dave]

Just now, Horace Patootie, SASS #35798 said:

Ordered the 10 gauge wads and a book on brass shotshell loading from Ballistic Products.

Horace

 

Because brass hulls have thinner walls than paper or plastic you need 9 ga wads.

[Sedalia Dave]

1 minute ago, Sedalia Dave said:

 

Because brass hulls have thinner walls than paper or plastic you need 9 ga wads.

 

You can buy them from Track of the Wolf

[Leroy Luck]

7 hours ago, Horace Patootie, SASS #35798 said:

Where would I source APP ?

Bullets by Scarlett, but you’d have to order a case unless you see her at a match. 

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

4 hours ago, Leroy Luck said:

Bullets by Scarlett, but you’d have to order a case unless you see her at a match. 

Thanks !

Horace

[Colorado Coffinmaker]

PLUS ONE fer Griff!! Fer Sure!!  Based on the information kindly supplied by Griff, I respectfully withdraw my suggestion to use Pyrodex as fertilizer.  Since dumping the stuff onna ground is not advisable, I find there is no acceptable "good" use for Pyrodex.

 

Apologizing for my Gnat like memory, but there is another source for APP, it just isn't called APP.  It's marketed under another supplier's banner.  I'll probably remember the name about three in the morning.

Edited July 9 by Colorado Coffinmaker
Include added information

[Griff]

1 hour ago, Colorado Coffinmaker said:

Apologizing for my Gnat like memory, but there is another source for APP, it just isn't called APP.  It's marketed under another supplier's banner.  I'll probably remember the name about three in the morning.

American Pioneer Powder (APP) is an ascorbic acid-based black powder substitute. It is frequently referred to or sold under the names Jim Shockey’s Gold and Shooters World Multi-Purpose Black FFF Sulfurless Powder.

 

If I'm not mistaken, Graf's & Midsouth carry it.

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

Today, I went to Bass Pro.  Had to look at all of the guns, of course.  Bought a bottle of Triple 7.  Other stuff has been shipped so won't be long now.  Also ordered some 9 gauge wads.

Horace

Edited July 9 by Horace Patootie, SASS #35798

[Colorado Coffinmaker]

 

All righty dighty!!  Thanks a bundle Griff.  "Shooters World Multi-Purpose Black" is/was the specific Subb I was trying to remember.  I suppose I should write it down, but then I'd just forget where I put the note.

[Chantry]

Since you are going to use BP or BP subs, I'll chime in.   I've used Triple 777 for shotgun and it's definitely hotter than the equivalent amount of BP and I recommend getting the 2F Triple 777 if you have a choice.   Triple 777 is easy to clean up and I've never had issues with it in my shotgun, revolvers or rifle.   Talk to some of the BP shooters you know who are using black powder and see if you can piggy back on their next black powder order.   

 

I currently use 1F or 2F black powder in my Spanish 10 gauge.   In the past I have used reenactors powder, which looks like left over powder with different sizes (1F, 2, F, 3F) all mixed together.  I've tried cannon powder, which is coarser than 1F, lots of smoke, no, flame and not much recoil.  I found it boring

 

I prefer 1F. more flame, less recoil and my match load is 120 grs of powder and 1 1/2 oz of shot.  I get about 55 shells per pound of powder.  It's great fun shooting it in enclosed spaces, the concussion just bounces around and sometime makes things shake.  It's even more fun when I pull both triggers in the enclosed space.  

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

4 minutes ago, Chantry said:

Since you are going to use BP or BP subs, I'll chime in.   I've used Triple 777 for shotgun and it's definitely hotter than the equivalent amount of BP and I recommend getting the 2F Triple 777 if you have a choice.   Triple 777 is easy to clean up and I've never had issues with it in my shotgun, revolvers or rifle.   Talk to some of the BP shooters you know who are using black powder and see if you can piggy back on their next black powder order.   

 

I currently use 1F or 2F black powder in my Spanish 10 gauge.   In the past I have used reenactors powder, which looks like left over powder with different sizes (1F, 2, F, 3F) all mixed together.  I've tried cannon powder, which is coarser than 1F, lots of smoke, no, flame and not much recoil.  I found it boring

 

I prefer 1F. more flame, less recoil and my match load is 120 grs of powder and 1 1/2 oz of shot.  I get about 55 shells per pound of powder.  It's great fun shooting it in enclosed spaces, the concussion just bounces around and sometime makes things shake.  It's even more fun when I pull both triggers in the enclosed space.  

I have already bought 2F Triple 7,  received my brass 2 7/8" hulls, still awaiting some antique 10 gauge loading tools, wads and etcetera.  I think it will be an interesting experiment.

Horace

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

On 7/12/2026 at 1:34 PM, Chantry said:

Since you are going to use BP or BP subs, I'll chime in.   I've used Triple 777 for shotgun and it's definitely hotter than the equivalent amount of BP and I recommend getting the 2F Triple 777 if you have a choice.   Triple 777 is easy to clean up and I've never had issues with it in my shotgun, revolvers or rifle.   Talk to some of the BP shooters you know who are using black powder and see if you can piggy back on their next black powder order.   

 

I currently use 1F or 2F black powder in my Spanish 10 gauge.   In the past I have used reenactors powder, which looks like left over powder with different sizes (1F, 2, F, 3F) all mixed together.  I've tried cannon powder, which is coarser than 1F, lots of smoke, no, flame and not much recoil.  I found it boring

 

I prefer 1F. more flame, less recoil and my match load is 120 grs of powder and 1 1/2 oz of shot.  I get about 55 shells per pound of powder.  It's great fun shooting it in enclosed spaces, the concussion just bounces around and sometime makes things shake.  It's even more fun when I pull both triggers in the enclosed space.  

On 7/12/2026 at 1:34 PM, Chantry said:

Since you are going to use BP or BP subs, I'll chime in.   I've used Triple 777 for shotgun and it's definitely hotter than the equivalent amount of BP and I recommend getting the 2F Triple 777 if you have a choice.   Triple 777 is easy to clean up and I've never had issues with it in my shotgun, revolvers or rifle.   Talk to some of the BP shooters you know who are using black powder and see if you can piggy back on their next black powder order.   

 

I currently use 1F or 2F black powder in my Spanish 10 gauge.   In the past I have used reenactors powder, which looks like left over powder with different sizes (1F, 2, F, 3F) all mixed together.  I've tried cannon powder, which is coarser than 1F, lots of smoke, no, flame and not much recoil.  I found it boring

 

I prefer 1F. more flame, less recoil and my match load is 120 grs of powder and 1 1/2 oz of shot.  I get about 55 shells per pound of powder.  It's great fun shooting it in enclosed spaces, the concussion just bounces around and sometime makes things shake.  It's even more fun when I pull both triggers in the enclosed space.  

I have already bought 2F Triple 7,  received my brass 2 7/8" hulls, still awaiting some antique 10 gauge loading tools, wads and etcetera.  I think it will be an interesting experiment.

Horace

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

So I emailed Hodgdon about Triple 7 and they like some of you mention that it's about 15% hotter than BP.  They sent me lots of info on loads.  How much 2F BP are y'all using in 10 gauge ?  I would reduce such a load by 15% using Triple 7 as I understand it.

Horace