Confederate Flag

[Subdeacon Joe]

 

[Cypress Sun]

One could fly that flag without worry of being called a racist, that's for sure! Wouldn't be called anything except for maybe an idiot for buying a flag that never was...until now.

[Dantankerous]

Not to worry. The woke crowd is happy to call any flag racist anymore. Put a picture of a jar of peanut butter on a flag and somehow you're racist. 

[Chas B. Wolfson, SASS #11104]

4 minutes ago, Dantankerous said:

Not to worry. The woke crowd is happy to call any flag racist anymore. Put a picture of a jar of peanut butter on a flag and somehow you're racist. 

 Very sad and pathetic but unfortunately very true.

[Cypress Sun]

8 minutes ago, Dantankerous said:

Not to worry. The woke crowd is happy to call any flag racist anymore. Put a picture of a jar of peanut butter on a flag and somehow you're racist. 

 

HEY!!!!

 

Where's the grape jelly?

Why isn't the grape jelly on the flag next to the peanut butter???

The grape jelly is being oppressed, that's Oppressed with a capital O!!!!

 

I'm calling GJLM!

[Subdeacon Joe]

8 minutes ago, Cypress Sun said:

 

HEY!!!!

 

Where's the grape jelly?

Why isn't the grape jelly on the flag next to the peanut butter???

The grape jelly is being oppressed, that's Oppressed with a capital O!!!!

 

I'm calling GJLM!

 

I knew it! You're a fruitophobe! A vinto supremacist! Discriminating against underrepresented fruits like apricot,  peach, and pomegranate +++! And you didn't mention all the types of berries! 

[Cypress Sun]

Just now, Subdeacon Joe said:

 

I knew it! You're a fruitophobe! A vinto supremacist! Discriminating against underrepresented fruits like apricot,  peach, and pomegranate +++! And you didn't mention all the types of berries! 

 

I make up for by loving guava jelly...talk about underrepresented!! Apricot and peach aren't bad. I'll take a pass on the pomegranate

 

Oh, I like blueberry, blackberry and Chuck Berry....but not Chuck Barris. Does that make me a bad person?

 

[Sedalia Dave]

 

What about us Bananas?  We go great with peanut butter.

[Subdeacon Joe]

2 minutes ago, Sedalia Dave said:

 

What about us Bananas?  We go great with peanut butter.

 

Ah! Our herbalist joins the conversation. 

[Sedalia Dave]

Why is it that everybody discriminates against Chocolate? 

[Stump Water]

At our previous house I flew the original stars and bars for years.  Nobody, and I mean nobody, knew what it was.  Those that did hazard a guess went with Betsy Ross.

[Subdeacon Joe]

I'm going out on a limb here, but I trust that everyone on this forum knows why I called ir a Confederate flag. 

[Blackwater 53393]

Ohhhh! I dunno!  Maybe it’s got something to do with the “Articles Of Confederation”?? 
 

That was , after all, our first constitution, wasn’t it??

[Injun Ryder, SASS #36201L]

Ask Abel Buell!

[Sedalia Dave]

1 hour ago, Subdeacon Joe said:

I'm going out on a limb here, but I trust that everyone on this forum knows why I called ir a Confederate flag. 

 

YEP

 

The 13 Stars gave it away

Edited July 1 by Sedalia Dave

[Subdeacon Joe]

I  had thought it a bit odd that nobody had mentioned it. 

[Black Angus McPherson]

2 hours ago, Subdeacon Joe said:

I'm going out on a limb here, but I trust that everyone on this forum knows why I called ir a Confederate flag. 

 

Careful, that limb's cracking!

I'm gonna guess Blackwater is right.  Otherwise, I have no idea.

 

Angus

[Subdeacon Joe]

1 hour ago, Injun Ryder, SASS #36201L said:

Ask Abel Buell!

 

A rather...colorful....fellow. Well-known for his engraving skills.

[Cypress Sun]

2 hours ago, Blackwater 53393 said:

Ohhhh! I dunno!  Maybe it’s got something to do with the “Articles Of Confederation”?? 
 

That was , after all, our first constitution, wasn’t it??

 

You mean this flag. The one shown at the top of this thread never existed.

 

[H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619]

Our nation, and the "Union" was created on July 4th, 1776 with the adoption of the Declaration of Independence.

Technically speaking, we did not actually have a national government until it was created in November 1777 when the "Articles of Confederation" were adopted.

The Articles refer to themself as, "Articles of Confederation and perpetual Union between the States of..." and then it lists the original 13 states.  

 

To also quote the document.

Article I. The Stile of this confederacy shall be, “The United States of America.”

So at that point, the nation existed in an unbreakable "Union." and it was a "Confederacy."

To also quote the document...

Article XIII. Every State shall abide by the determinations of the united states, in congress assembled, on all questions which by this confederation are submitted to them. And the Articles of this confederation shall be inviolably observed by every state, and the union shall be perpetual; nor shall any alteration at any time hereafter be made in any of them, unless such alteration be agreed to in a congress of the united states, and be afterwards con-firmed by the legislatures of every state.

Again, the Union is said to be perpetual, it can not be dissolved.

Now, the Flag was adopted on June 14, 1777, BEFORE the enactment of the Articles of Confederation.    It was simply an act of the Second Continental Congress.   BUT, since the 2nd stayed in session until well after the document was in force, you can indeed assert that it was the flag of the Confederacy.  Sort of.

By the way, when the Constitution was adopted in 1789, it did create a new government, but not a new nation, or a new Union.   Rather, it made the already existing union, "more perfect."

And finally, Article VI of the Constitution says...

All Debts contracted and Engagements entered into, before the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be as valid against the United States under this Constitution, as under the Confederation.

It has been interpreted that, among other things, the Union created in the Declaration and defined in the Articles is a prior Engagement, under the Confederation, and as such the Union is still perpetual and can not be dissolved.

This was one of the arguments that President Lincoln made to say the South had no right to secede.  

I think he was right.

Edited July 1 by H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619

[John Kloehr]

54 minutes ago, H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 said:

...the nation existed in an unbreakable "Union." and it was a "Confederacy."

By the way, when the Constitution was adopted in 1789, it did create a new government, but not a new nation, or a new Union.   Rather, it made the already existing union, "more perfect."

 

I still remember being delighted when I learned the origins of the "more perfect union" phrase a very few short years ago

. 
Without understanding the union origin in the original Articles of Confederation, the phrase just sort of hung there for most of my life as nothing but flowery speech.

 

Edited July 1 by John Kloehr

[Subdeacon Joe]

2 hours ago, H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 said:

This was one of the arguments that President Lincoln made to say the South had no right to secede.  

I think he was right.

 

Except that it wasn't explicitly prohibited.  See Amendment 10. 

Also, nobody had an issue with it the 3 times various New England states threatened secession. 

[Blackwater 53393]

29 minutes ago, Subdeacon Joe said:

 

Except that it wasn't explicitly prohibited.  See Amendment 10. 

Also, nobody had an issue with it the 3 times various New England states threatened secession. 

Exactly correct!  In nearly EVERY unbiased examination of the facts surrounding the secession of the southern states, it’s been acknowledged that they were actually within their legal rights to choose to leave the union.

 

Some of the reasons for the decision to leave were less than honorable in some people’s eyes, but they had every right to make the choice!

 

Confederacies have historically been the first stage of gaining separation from a government that is unacceptable to those who have chosen to leave! THERE IS STRENGTH IN NUMBERS 

[Utah Bob #35998]

6 hours ago, Sedalia Dave said:

Why is it that everybody discriminates against Chocolate? 

I destroy it immediately. And tastefully.

[Blackwater 53393]

OH! BY THE WAY!!

 

The Declaration Of Independence was signed on July the 2nd!!

 

Folks have been celebrating the day that the announcement was made for all these years!!

[Sedalia Dave]

3 hours ago, Cypress Sun said:

 

You mean this flag. The one shown at the top of this thread never existed.

 

 

 

https://www.loeser.us/flags/revolution.html

 

 

[Sedalia Dave]

 

https://www.loeser.us/flags/american_note_3.html#betsy

[Sedalia Dave]

Interesting read

 

Flags of the American Revolution Era

[watab kid]

12 hours ago, Cypress Sun said:

One could fly that flag without worry of being called a racist, that's for sure! Wouldn't be called anything except for maybe an idiot for buying a flag that never was...until now.

ill fly my stars and bars and ignore anyone that calls me a racist because they are communists - hopefully i didnt over step here , but all the rewriting of history and facts needs to come to a halt 

[WOLFY]

Wasnt this the C S A flag?

[Subdeacon Joe]

9 hours ago, Sedalia Dave said:

Interesting read

 

Flags of the American Revolution Era

 

Yep. Flags of the rebels.

 

I particularly like these 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 2 by Subdeacon Joe

[Cypress Sun]

3 hours ago, WOLFY said:

Wasnt this the C S A flag?

 

Yes, one of them.

[H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619]

1 hour ago, Subdeacon Joe said:

 

I particularly like these 

 

 

 

 

 

I particularly like this one.

This is the Bedford Flag.  It was the only flag carried into battle by the Americans on April 19th,1775.   It is recognized as America's first battle flag, and the one actually carried by the Bedford Minutemen to the Old North Bridge in Concord is on display at the Bedford Public Library.   There is something special about going into the room where it is located and actually looking at it.

 

Today, it is the official flag of the Town of Bedford, Massachusetts.

The inscription is Latin for "Conquer or Die."

A few years ago, when I was at an animation fan convention in Pittsburg, my friends and I looked out our hotel window, and could see that it was flying from the flagpole of the local Boyscout headquarters.   We were all surprised to see it, and my friends asked me to confirm that it was in fact, the Bedford Flag.   We never did find out why they were flying it.

In case you don't know or have not guessed, I am from Bedford, Massachusetts. 
 

 

[WOLFY]

i thought 13 stripes made them Union (not confederate) flags

 

also: some article mentions the bicentennial celebrations of 1989 (wasn’t our bicentennial 1976?)

Edited July 2 by WOLFY

[John Kloehr]

59 minutes ago, WOLFY said:

... some article mentions the bicentennial celebrations of 1989 (wasn’t our bicentennial 1976?)

 

From Google AI:

 

"

 

U.S. Presidency & Congress Bicentennials

 

Presidential Inauguration: On April 30, 1989, the U.S. marked 200 years since George Washington's first inauguration. President Bush delivered remarks at Federal Hall in New York City to commemorate the event.

 

Congress & Law Enforcement

 

The U.S. Congress commemorated 200 years since its own formation, which was marked by the minting of a special 1989-S commemorative silver half-dollar and dollar coin. It was also the bicentennial year of the United States Marshals Service.

 

"