Hat sizes.

[Forty Rod SASS 3935]

I'm looking for a new felt hat and want a five or six inch crown and a three and a half or four inch brim, and I need a 7 5/8  or 7  3/4size.  Hard to find one in those sizes and so many places on the web don't show any crown and / or brim dimensions.  

 

Also, I prefer an open crown so I can shape it myself.

 

And I'd like a plug top hat like Mississippi wore in El Dorado.

 

A felt "working man's" sombrero would be welcome, too.  I can find all kinds of sombreros, mostly straw and almost universally way to hell and  gone over decorated

 

This  isn't an urgent thing because I've been looking for several years, and I frankly need another hat like I need the mumps 

 

It  seems though that no one, or very few, sell hats in "mens' sizes".

Edited April 8 by Forty Rod SASS 3935

[Texas Joker]

Most Sombrero are straw cause it's HOT where they get worn. If you want a really wide brim in frlt try looking for a wool blanket for a tricorn hat.

[Sedalia Dave]

Any custom Hatter can make you exactly what you want.

[Forty Rod SASS 3935]

And I can buy a car for what that would cost me.

[Stump Water]

https://www.facebook.com/DBarJHats/posts/this-flair-top-hat-is-just-like-the-hat-mississippi-james-caan-wears-in-the-movi/2603430159680946/

 

Yeah, I don't do faceplant either, but you should be able to see the page.

[Forty Rod SASS 3935]

1 hour ago, Stump Water said:

https://www.facebook.com/DBarJHats/posts/this-flair-top-hat-is-just-like-the-hat-mississippi-james-caan-wears-in-the-movi/2603430159680946/

 

Yeah, I don't do faceplant either, but you should be able to see the page.

I want  to buy a hat, not the whole company!

[Alpo]

They are kind of proud of them, ain't they?

 

 

You know this how a 50x hat cost more than a 20x hat, but they don't say what the difference is. Except that it's a bigger number.

 

Is a 20x hat 20% beaver and a 50x hat 50% beaver? It does not say on the website. It just says 20x hat and 50x hat and 70x hat.

[Stump Water]

Yeah.  Everyone has their own version of what "X" is.

[Sgt. C.J. Sabre, SASS #46770]

37 minutes ago, Alpo said:

Is a 20x hat 20% beaver and a 50x hat 50% beaver? It does not say on the website. It just says 20x hat and 50x hat and 70x hat.

Back in the '80s, Stetson and Resistol pretty much set the standard for the X count. Each X stood for 3% beaver with the wool felt. A common, relatively inexpensive hat, (under $150 or so), was a 3X, or 9% beaver felt hat. A 5X would be 15%, and Alpo's 20X would be 60% beaver. I don't think that they went much higher than that, because beaver on its own didn't make as good a hat as a mix of beaver and wool. I believe that it wouldn't be stiff enough to take shaping.

[Alpo]

I have three hats. They are all advertised as fur felt.

 

The Bailey is 100% South American hare. The Stetson and the Colorado Mountain are 50% beaver. I presume the other 50% is South American hare.

 

But there is not supposed to be any wool in any of them.

[J-BAR #18287]

My Stetson Stratoliner is the most comfortable, shapeable hat I own.  A classic Fedora.  Years ago I paid $150 for it in a local men's store.  I see them advertised online.  Deal with a merchant you can talk to.

Edited April 7 by J-BAR #18287

[Blackwater 53393]

4 hours ago, Sgt. C.J. Sabre, SASS #46770 said:

Back in the '80s, Stetson and Resistol pretty much set the standard for the X count. Each X stood for 3% beaver with the wool felt. A common, relatively inexpensive hat, (under $150 or so), was a 3X, or 9% beaver felt hat. A 5X would be 15%, and Alpo's 20X would be 60% beaver. I don't think that they went much higher than that, because beaver on its own didn't make as good a hat as a mix of beaver and wool. I believe that it wouldn't be stiff enough to take shaping.

As my cousin, Stump Water said, there’s no “X standard”! Different brands use all sorts of “X” designations.

 

Contrary to the above quote, a pure beaver fur felt hat is as good as it gets, quality wise!  It will hold shape better, repell water better, stand more abuse, and just plain last longer than any other combination of furs or wools!

 

Wool and wool blend hats require chemical stiffeners to retain their shape.  If a wool hat gets soaked, it’ll require reblocking and retreating with a stiffening agent.

 

Winchester Hat Co. in Winchester, TN is the premier hat body manufacturer in the U.S., providing raw hat bodies for hat shapers and finishers around the world.  They offer tours at times.

 

They make three blends of fur felt hat bodies: Standard - 10% beaver and 90% rabbit.

-Mid range: A 50/50 blend of beaver and rabbit.

-Pure beaver: 100% beaver fur.

Beaver fur can be “felted” tighter than any of the blends, making a 100% beaver felt hat lighter and stronger than the blends.

 

They don’t make wool, straw, palm leaf, or other material for hat bodies.

 

There are several makers of hat bodies around the world, some of whom also make quality hat blanks and some who produce hats of less quality, like wool and wool blend and other materials.

 

There are also manufacturers who use the fur of the Nutria, a rodent that like the beaver, lives in wetlands and swamps. I’m told by other hat makers that this fur is very close to the quality and durability of beaver fur, but I have no experience with it.

 

I shaped, styled, trimmed, cleaned, and repaired cowboy hats for several years and from my perspective, the 100% beaver fur felt hat has shown to withstand more weather, use, and abuse, coming out in better shape than all the other blends and materials by far!  I cleaned and reshaped or repaired several pure beaver hats that were worn by the grandchildren of the original purchasers. One in particular was several decades old.

 

The more beaver fur in the blend, the better!

 

 

[Sgt. C.J. Sabre, SASS #46770]

I stand corrected. I was going off 40 year old memories.  

[Trailrider #896]

Used to be a custom hat maker in Durango, Colorado. Don't know if they are still in business or what they would charge.

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

Might take a look at River Junction Trading.  I bought my last hat there, the "Outlaw Josey Wales" hat. They have all kinds.

https://www.riverjunction.com/Hat-Styles_c_419.html

 

Horace

[Alpo]

Would you have multiple hats of the same style but different colors?

 

A Gus, for example. A tan one and a black one and maybe a bone one. All the same hat, just different colors.

[Doc Shapiro]

9 hours ago, Stump Water said:

https://www.facebook.com/DBarJHats/posts/this-flair-top-hat-is-just-like-the-hat-mississippi-james-caan-wears-in-the-movi/2603430159680946/

 

Yeah, I don't do faceplant either, but you should be able to see the page.

I concur on this vendor.  I've bought several hats from them and they are well worth it.

[Blackwater 53393]

The last few hat bodies I bought for customers were from Greeley Hat Works in Colorado. They’re reliable and can provide most sizes and styles.

 

The “Mississippi” or “Johnny Diamond” hat is basically a slightly lower “top hat” crown with a “Hamburg” brim.  That crown is produced by use of a special “block” that has several elements. It is very similar to the “Pale Rider” hat from the movie with the same title. That’s why it’s hard to find and usually more expensive.

 

I shaped a couple of them for customers, years ago, by hand. It took several hours and some creative use of “tools” to get the shape right.

 

 

Edited April 7 by Blackwater 53393

[watab kid]

i hope you get what you want , im happy with my second hand store find of almost three decades ago , i like it , it fits me and my personality well , im more apt to wear a ball cap to keep my head war [i have a bald spot] but i just want to stay warm , 

[Stump Water]

12 hours ago, Alpo said:

Would you have multiple hats of the same style but different colors?

 

Yes.  The hat in the pic is the first "real" hat I got.  50/50 beaver/hare from Optimo Hatworks in Bisbee, AZ.  Grant sized me while we were there in 2003 and I ordered it six months later.

 

I liked it so well I ordered another just like it in tan/beige a couple of years later.

 

Edited April 7 by Stump Water

[J-BAR #18287]

 

When words do not suffice.

[watab kid]

gotta wear what you like , 

[DeaconKC]

13 hours ago, J-BAR #18287 said:

 

When words do not suffice.

Fine looking topper!

[Forty Rod SASS 3935]

14 hours ago, watab kid said:

gotta wear what you like , 

I would  if I could find what I want.  All these responses and none have solved my problem.

[Texas Lizard]

On 4/6/2026 at 8:03 PM, Sgt. C.J. Sabre, SASS #46770 said:

I stand corrected. I was going off 40 year old memories.  

Can you remember that far back???

 

Texas Lizard

[Sgt. C.J. Sabre, SASS #46770]

2 hours ago, Texas Lizard said:

Can you remember that far back???

 

Texas Lizard

How far back?

[watab kid]

6 hours ago, Forty Rod SASS 3935 said:

I would  if I could find what I want.  All these responses and none have solved my problem.

sorry , i bought mine in the second hand store but sometimes you gotta go custom made - i know it costs a lot but how many are you buying ?

[Forty Rod SASS 3935]

I  have over a dozen hats of all shapes and descriptions, and that  doesn't even include watch caps, a beret, some news boy caps, two helmets, and a beaver free trader's hat, a couple of attached hoods on a capote and a ski jacket, and  bunch of other head gear.

 

I really need another hat about as much as Custer needed more Indians.

 

I want a good every day hat like the one that blew off and vanished in Zion Canyon many years ago...or the Roy Roger and Dale Evans autographed hat that was stolen at one of the first End Of Trails I went to...or the one chewed up by an angry mule that my  boss let me ride, who just got ticked off and chewed  it up...or one that left in a fire in the woods in Oregon when I tried my hand at being "a timber beast" (lumber jack) for the Frazer River Lumber Company,..or a  really fine and quite  expensive Panama Trader style hat that didn't survive a rain storm...plus a whole rack of other hats  that went by the boards long ago.

 

I'm hard on hats so I don't want to spend the rent for something that might not last a week.

Edited April 9 by Forty Rod SASS 3935

[watab kid]

2 hours ago, Forty Rod SASS 3935 said:

I  have over a dozen hats of all shapes and descriptions, and that  doesn't even include watch caps, a beret, some news boy caps, two helmets, and a beaver free trader's hat, a couple of attached hoods on a capote and a ski jacket, and  bunch of other head gear.

 

I really need another hat about as much as Custer needed more Indians.

 

I want a good every day hat like the one that blew off and vanished in Zion Canyon many years ago...or the Roy Roger and Dale Evans autographed hat that was stolen at one of the first End Of Trails I went to...or the one chewed up by an angry mule that my  boss let me ride, who just got ticked off and chewed  it up...or one that left in a fire in the woods in Oregon when I tried my hand at being "a timber beast" (lumber jack) for the Frazer River Lumber Company,..or a  really fine and quite  expensive Panama Trader style hat that didn't survive a rain storm...plus a whole rack of other hats  that went by the boards long ago.

 

I'm hard on hats so I don't want to spend the rent for something that might not last a week.

sounds to me like your seeking a reason to get another , i too have a lot of hats including most you mentioned , some i inherited from my father and my father-in-law , im starting to wear them all a little as im getting old and i dont know anyone in the family that will care as much as me about them 

 

i dont wear my FILs ist crew hat from the nautilus ....it is a display my wife needs to keep when im gone , i do wear another he gave me when he was alive - its navy but not associated with a ship , i do wear the one i got for FIFI as my father was a gunner on a B-29 its got his wings on it that he gave me as well as the tail number of his plane ,i had them embroidered on it years ago , i was disappointed the confederate air force did not resurrect another but i get the cost is outof their budget ,    ive used that as my moniker on the web forever , 

i have a lot of gun mfgrs hats some i wear some i dont because i know a lot of their people through a close friend in the industry , i also have multiple hats for the gun range i work for , i still have hats from places i worked before i retired , i might have on one occasion bought a hat - i dont recall it - most of the 30+ hats i have were given to me 

 

but i did buy my first cowboy hat that i wear to this day at a second hand shop in a town i was doing work in a long time ago , over 20 years ago , i made it mine and its been my one and only - not a lot to look at but its me and mine and im happy with it ,  ill keep wearing it till one of us dies - i suspect it will be me , the hat will live on