Rye Miles #13621 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 Nicholas Maduro and his wife have been captured. https://www.cbsnews.com/atlanta/live-updates/venezuela-us-military-strikes-maduro-trump/ MODS: If this is too political I understand but it is pretty big news! Quote
Cypress Sun Posted January 3 Posted January 3 I wonder if anyone gets to collect the $50,000,000 bounty on him. First thing I thought of when I saw this on Fox this morning was the capture of Noriega which, by pure coincidence of course, was 35 years ago...to the day. 5 Quote
Subdeacon Joe Posted January 3 Posted January 3 I'm not quite sure what I think about it. Especially the charges of possession of machine guns and destructive devices. How would those AMERICAN laws apply to a foreign leader in his own country. Quote The specific charges are: Possession of machine guns and destructive devices. Conspiracy to possess machine guns and destructive devices against the United States. These weapons charges are ancillary to the primary allegations that Maduro and his associates used their positions of power in Venezuela to provide political and military protection for rampant cocaine trafficking. The indictment alleges that this operation involved using "machineguns that were capable of automatically shooting more than one shot, without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger, as well as destructive devices" to facilitate the movement of large amounts of cocaine into the U.S.. U.S. authorities contend that Maduro and his top lieutenants were operating a vast drug-trafficking enterprise (known as the "Cartel de Los Soles" or "Cartel of the Suns" within Venezuela) that intended to flood the U.S. with cocaine. The weapons charges stem from the use of heavy weaponry to support these criminal activities. The U.S. Department of Justice announced the indictment in March 2020, during the Trump administration, and does not recognize Maduro as the legitimate head of state, which it argues invalidates any claim to head-of-state immunity from prosecution. 1 3 Quote
John Kloehr Posted January 3 Posted January 3 15 minutes ago, Subdeacon Joe said: I'm not quite sure what I think about it. Especially the charges of possession of machine guns and destructive devices. How would those AMERICAN laws apply to a foreign leader in his own country. If these weapons were smuggled into the US and traceable to Maduro, I can see the charge. 2 Quote
Subdeacon Joe Posted January 3 Posted January 3 1 minute ago, John Kloehr said: If these weapons were smuggled into the US and traceable to Maduro, I can see the charge. I can see a gun smuggling charge if that's what happened, but from what I've seen, the charge is possession. Quote
Lawdog Dago Dom Posted January 3 Posted January 3 13 minutes ago, Subdeacon Joe said: I can see a gun smuggling charge if that's what happened, but from what I've seen, the charge is possession. From what I have read, a federal gun charge can be based on actual or constructive possession. Actual possession is actually having the gun in your hand. Constructive possession is you don't have it on you, but you know where it is and have control over it. Not a lawyer and not trying to be. Just what I have read. 2 Quote
Calamity Kris Posted January 3 Posted January 3 I'm going to sit back and watch this one play out. There are all kinds of dynamics going on here that I think most of us aren't privy to. 12 Quote
Rip Snorter Posted January 3 Posted January 3 (edited) Did it before, Noriega! Edited January 3 by Rip Snorter 2 Quote
Texas Joker Posted January 3 Posted January 3 22 minutes ago, Colorado Coffinmaker said: So. We have stooped, not only to Piracy on the High Seas but Kidnapping of Forign Leaders. It would seam we are falling into the same areas as some Third World Scummies. Shameful. Interdiction of a sanctioned shipper flying a false flag is not piracy 7 1 Quote
Chantry Posted January 3 Posted January 3 This should make the news and the internet interesting for the next several days. And this thread is going to get yanked at some point. 1 1 Quote
Rye Miles #13621 Posted January 3 Author Posted January 3 The people in Venezuela are celebrating! Maduro was a bad man! He stole oil fields from US Companies over there. He overtook the presidency. We did not declare war so this is perfectly legal from what I’m hearing and reading. I’m glad we did it! 5 Quote
John Kloehr Posted January 3 Posted January 3 11 minutes ago, Chantry said: And this thread is going to get yanked at some point. Only if it goes sideways. I see no problems at this point. 2 Quote
Rye Miles #13621 Posted January 3 Author Posted January 3 Keep in mind that even the Biden administration didn’t recognize Maduro as president. Neither does most of the free world. Lock him up for a long time and his wife too! 4 Quote
Cypress Sun Posted January 3 Posted January 3 15 minutes ago, Rye Miles #13621 said: The people in Venezuela are celebrating! Maduro was a bad man! He stole oil fields from US Companies over there. He overtook the presidency. We did not declare war so this is perfectly legal from what I’m hearing and reading. I’m glad we did it! Oil...huh, who'd have thought.... 1 Quote
Rye Miles #13621 Posted January 3 Author Posted January 3 17 minutes ago, Cypress Sun said: Oil...huh, who'd have thought.... It’s not just about oil but that is a huge part of it. Maduro was also shipping fentanyl here and he wouldn’t stop! He’s a scumbag! Quote
Cypress Sun Posted January 3 Posted January 3 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Rye Miles #13621 said: It’s not just about oil but that is a huge part of it. Maduro was also shipping fentanyl here and he wouldn’t stop! He’s a scumbag! Not so sure about the fentanyl, large quantities of cocaine for sure. I guess going after the distributors is cheaper and easier than going for the manufactures...particularly if they're on the "approved" ***t list. Edit - And there's no doubt that he's a scumbag. Edited January 3 by Cypress Sun 1 Quote
Rye Miles #13621 Posted January 3 Author Posted January 3 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Cypress Sun said: Not so sure about the fentanyl, large quantities of cocaine for sure. I guess going after the distributors is cheaper and easier than going for the manufactures...particularly if they're on the "approved" ***t list. Edit - And there's no doubt that he's a scumbag. Supposedly fentanyl laced cocaine, but we won’t know for sure since we blew up the boats! 🤣 Edited January 3 by Rye Miles #13621 1 Quote
Trailrider #896 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 The Venezuelan people will benefit when our oil companies move back in because they generally hire a lot of local workers to work the oil industry. I think it also sends some messages to various other places like Columbia about the drug cartels. Trump also has said we will not tolerate the Iranian regime killing protesters (although they have already shot and killed some demonstrators.). Not sure what we might do, but bombing the nuclear facilities was one thing. I would think a possibility might be going after the Iranian Revolutionary Guard forces. One person from Iran stated on Fox that nobody knows exactly where the Ayatollah is at, as he apparently moves from place -to-place. He is also old and not in good shape physically. The Iranian people generally don't like the regime's ruling. Current events remind me of that old Kingston Trio song, "They're rioting in Africa., there's strife in Iran. What nature doesn't do to us will be done by our fellow man!" (boing!) 1 Quote
Texas Maverick Posted January 3 Posted January 3 2 hours ago, Cypress Sun said: I'm not sure what to think about it either. Trump pardons a convicted drug smuggler/dealer of large amounts of cocaine (Hernandez) and a month later abducts/captured Maduro...over drug smuggling? I don't think and have never thought that this was about drugs. It isn't, it is about the oil resources. TM 1 Quote
Rye Miles #13621 Posted January 3 Author Posted January 3 31 minutes ago, Texas Maverick said: It isn't, it is about the oil resources. TM I beg to differ, yes the oil reserves are a HUGE part of it but it was ALSO removing a criminal from leadership and stopping the drugs. We’ve been blowing up drug boats for months. Like I said the Venezuelan people are thrilled!🤩 2 1 Quote
Texas Maverick Posted January 3 Posted January 3 14 minutes ago, Rye Miles #13621 said: I beg to differ, yes the oil reserves are a HUGE part of it but it was ALSO removing a criminal from leadership and stopping the drugs. We’ve been blowing up drug boats for months. Like I said the Venezuelan people are thrilled!🤩 No argument on this but the oil was a huge part as you agreed to. Hopefully the people will get back to be prosperous as they were about 5 years ago. This country was in the top 5 for being a great country to live in. Now the people are starving and can't even get a bottle of water when they want. TM 1 Quote
Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 Now, if suddenly Maduro gets a pardon, … 1 2 Quote
Subdeacon Joe Posted January 3 Posted January 3 I saw a comment on another forum, "Maduro said he would meet President Trump any time, any place...so we sent an Uber." On a more serious note, President Barack Obama did not seek or receive a specific, new congressional authorization for the operation that killed Osama bin Laden. Instead, his administration relied on the existing... Authorization for Use of Military Force (AUMF) passed by Congress in 2001. Legal Basis for the Operation The legal justification for Operation Neptune Spear was based on several factors: 2001 AUMF: This authorization, passed after the 9-11 attacks, allowed the president to use force against those involved in or supporting the attacks, a category that included Osama bin Laden. International Law: The administration viewed the action as a lawful act of self-defense within an ongoing conflict with al-Qaeda, citing Article 51 of the UN Charter and arguing that bin Laden remained a threat and a legitimate military target. Executive Authority: The President's constitutional role as Commander-in-Chief was also cited as providing inherent authority for the use of force in defense of the nation, distinguishing the operation from a prohibited assassination. The operation proceeded without Pakistan's advance knowledge, with the U.S. asserting the right to act in self-defense if a nation is "unwilling or unable" to address a terrorist threat within its borders. 4 2 Quote
Chantry Posted January 3 Posted January 3 (edited) First, Maduro was indicted in the US in 2020 for narco-terrorism and it's been reported that he was arrested, by US law enforcement, not the militar who provided transport. Second, it generally considered that Maduro did not win the 2024 (and perhaps prior) elections fairly. Maduro's VP has apparently left the country and gone to Russia. Thirdly, why are so many people allowing their hatred of Trump to prevent them from seeing that removing a dictator, who was working with drug cartels and countries unfriendly to the US and making the lives of the average Venezuelan worse, was a good thing to do? On edit: Jonathan Turley: Why capture of Maduro didn't require approval from Congress: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/jonathan-turley-why-capture-of-maduro-didnt-require-approval-from-congress/ar-AA1TvakM Edited January 4 by Chantry 5 4 Quote
Hardpan Curmudgeon SASS #8967 Posted January 4 Posted January 4 A simple AI analysis of Venezuela's Standard of Living changes since the turn of the century. This is called "History": Major Political & Economic Events Affecting Living Standards in Venezuela 1999–2003 Chávez presidency begins → Introduction of currency and price controls. These policies temporarily masked underlying problems but increasingly distorted markets and incentives. 2007–2008 Oil revenue peak → Living standards briefly crest, driven largely by high oil prices and heavy state spending, increasing dependence on oil income. 2013 Death of Chávez / Maduro assumes power → Loss of political legitimacy and deterioration in economic management and institutional capacity. 2014–2015 Global oil price collapse → Severe revenue shock strikes an economy already weakened by controls and reduced productive capacity. 2016 Widespread food and medicine shortages → Breakdown of supply chains and purchasing power becomes visible to the population. 2017 Hyperinflation begins → Rapid collapse in real wages and savings, accelerating poverty. 2018–2019 Mass emigration crisis → Millions leave the country, reflecting a sharp decline in living conditions and economic opportunity. 2020 Renewal of international sanctions & political standoff Sanctions by the EU and other bodies were extended in response to Venezuela’s ongoing political polarization and human-rights concerns, reinforcing economic pressure. Consilium 2021 Opposition talks with the government continue The U.S. offered to begin lifting sanctions if the government and opposition formed an interim government without Maduro—a proposal that didn’t resolve political stasis. Reuters 2022 Opposition leader Maria Corina Machado barred from office Maduro’s government banned a leading opposition figure from holding public office for 15 years, drawing international condemnation and undermining political pluralism. Reuters Barbados Agreement & partial sanctions relief A deal with the U.S. eased some sanctions on oil and bonds to help improve economic conditions, though many political barriers remained. Reuters 2023–2024 Controversial 2024 Presidential Election Nicolás Maduro was elected to a contested third term amid widespread reports of fraud and exclusion of opposition figures—intensifying political polarization and challenging legitimacy. Global Centre for R2P Nationwide Blackouts Venezuela suffered widespread power outages in 2024 due to infrastructure failures, reflecting ongoing economic and utilities deterioration. Wikipedia 2025 Maduro sworn in amid protests and international rebuke On January 10, 2025, Maduro began his third term in an election widely seen as lacking transparency, sparking protests and sanctions from abroad. AP News Economic strain deepens Venezuela raised taxes on the private sector as oil revenues fell due to sanctions and the exit of foreign oil firms, worsening economic hardship and inflation. Reuters 3 2 Quote
Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984 Posted January 4 Posted January 4 Zelenskyy was asked about it and had his biggest smile. 1 Quote
Rye Miles #13621 Posted January 4 Author Posted January 4 The Venezuelan people are thrilled and celebrating!👍🎆 https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/last-venezuelans-abroad-celebrate-maduro-202403358.html 1 Quote
Matthew Duncan Posted January 4 Posted January 4 Interesting how the America Communist organizations are now protesting “rights violations”. 4 Quote
Cypress Sun Posted January 4 Posted January 4 48 minutes ago, Matthew Duncan said: Interesting how the America Communist organizations are now protesting “rights violations”. There was already a small group of them over in Tampa yesterday. They came crawling out of the woodwork like roaches. 3 Quote
Calamity Kris Posted January 4 Posted January 4 1 hour ago, Matthew Duncan said: Interesting how the America Communist organizations are now protesting “rights violations”. Fox has a really interesting article about that. https://www.foxnews.com/politics/second-front-how-socialist-cell-us-mobilized-pro-maduro-foot-soldiers-within-12-hours 1 1 Quote
Rye Miles #13621 Posted January 4 Author Posted January 4 45 minutes ago, Cypress Sun said: There was already a small group of them over in Tampa yesterday. They came crawling out of the woodwork like roaches. Yep, there was a small group downtown yesterday, about 12 of them! 🙄🤪🤪 Quote
Tell Sackett SASS 18436 Posted January 4 Posted January 4 56 minutes ago, Cypress Sun said: There was already a small group of them over in Tampa yesterday. They came crawling out of the woodwork like roaches. An appropriate comparison!! 1 Quote
Chicken Rustler, SASS #26680 Posted January 4 Posted January 4 It's pretty discouraging how many people are willing to rationalize invading a country to force them into a business deal that benefits us. 1 Quote
Rye Miles #13621 Posted January 4 Author Posted January 4 22 minutes ago, Chicken Rustler, SASS #26680 said: It's pretty discouraging how many people are willing to rationalize invading a country to force them into a business deal that benefits us. It also benefits the Venezuelan people big time! Maduro was evil and corrupt! 4 Quote
Nickle Posted January 4 Posted January 4 19 hours ago, Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984 said: Now, if suddenly Maduro gets a pardon, … No pun intended but who was pardoned south of equator is the elephant in the room. Quote
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