Uberti 1873 45 Colt Extractor

[Flanigan Flats]

All right here we go. Long story  to ask three questions. If you don’t want the story skip to the end. For roughly the last year likely longer my main match Uberti 1873 in 45 Colt has been eating extractors. It doesn’t matter which one I put in it. I might get a whole match out of it but probably not. 
 

The first time it failed I was running hard and bent the stock lever. For fun I replaced the extractor with the “claw” and went ahead and did the C&I short stroke kit that comes with a lever. 
 

Half a match and the extractor failed. I gave  it to a local shooter who has kept this rifle running for me for a decade or so and he did the same thing I did but used stuff from Pioneer gunworks. Rifle feels fantastic but yep, half a match in extractor failed. 
 

Between times I was running a Uberti 66 carbine 45 Colt (same ammo as 73) with Pioneer Gun Works guts. It runs good but it  doesn’t fit/feel as good as a 73 to me. But it was affordable when I was in need. 
 

So my local shooter Gunsmith guy takes the 73 home and pulls the barrel off and cleans up the extractor groove and of course replaces the extractor again. 

 

In amongst all of this partially because I’ve always wanted one and I was frustrated as all hell I ordered and bought a Uberti 1873 in Colt 45 from Pioneer Gunworks with all the bells and whistles. Not cheap. 
 

Fourth stage yesterday with the new rifle the extractor quit working.  
 

To be fair that was the 16th stage I’d used that rifle on. But only the four yesterday with the ammo I had been feeding my old rifle and the 66. 
 

So it is that ammo. It causing extractor issues in 2 different rifles. I am obviously slow in the head. I should have figured this out already. The ammo measure out at OAL 1.593. My research this morning has told me that is too long.
 

My question is why is it killing extractors but not causing feed issues? Why did the 66 not develop issues?

 

I started loading that last batch of ammo in the OAL 1.58 range and something shifted or changed in the seating die. 
 

Fortunately that batch of ammo is almost gone. My handguns can eat the rest. I have already started another batch and it is measuring at OAL 1.576. 
 

What OAL of 45 Colt are others running. 

 

 

Edited June 10 by PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L
edit title

[Choctaw Jack]

1.48-1.50 with a 200 grain RNFP.

Never a feeding problem in 15 years.

Choctaw

[Abilene, SASS # 27489]

Your OAL has nothing to do with extraction problems.  Anything between approximately 1.45 and 1.59 should be fine.  If it is too long or too short you will have feeding issues but not related to extraction.

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

First, what do you mean by "eating extractor" - it goes weak, it breaks (if so, show us a picture), or some other problem?

 

How much tension on the extractor hook are you setting (by thinning the spring arm on the extractor during installation}?

Can you slip a thin wire with a loop tied in both ends  - one end caught on the hook and the other end on a trigger pull gauge.  Then pull up until extractor comes up out of the groove like it's ready to snap over the rim of a cartridge.  4-5 pounds of pull to get to that point would be about right, lighter probably means you are thinning the new extractor arm too much.  Lots of pressure needed - probably means extractor tip can be stabbing into the back of the round you are chambering, rather than snapping up over the rim.  I can feel as I pull up on extractor tips - when they have enough tension they just start to hurt my fingertip as much as I can handle, that seems to be the right tension. 

 

I normally get 20,000 rounds of life before the extractor weakens from use enough to need to be replaced (and that's in 45 Colt or 44-40 rifles). And I've never really broken one.

 

Usually a real close visual observation of how the extractor is functioning during feed and extraction will let you find the problem.  Time to get a couple of dummy rounds and a cool drink and work the action until you spot problem.  Watch for collision of the nose with the base of the round, tight fit of the extractor nose into the relief cut in the barrel, tight fit over the rim of the cartridge resulting in extractor not snapping down in the extractor groove of the cartridge, etc.

 

I run 1.560 to 1.580" rounds all the time in my three .45 Colt 1873 rifles.  It's not the length causing problems.

 

good luck, GJ

Edited June 9 by Garrison Joe, SASS #60708

[Flanigan Flats]

When each of the extractors failed I can lift and wiggle the extractor with my finger. There is no tension at all and it just slips off the case.

 

i don’t know how much tension was on the extractor on the new rifle. Pioneer Gun works has a pretty good reputation so I would assume it to be good to go. The commonality between the two rifles was the ammunition. 

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

3 hours ago, Flanigan Flats said:

I can lift and wiggle the extractor with my finger. There is no tension at all

 

Perhaps the extractor is being permanently stretched out (up away from bolt) by some sort of collision or cartridge overpressure, so that it loses it's tension.

Light loads common to CAS would not damage the extractor.  Really heavy (over SAAMI pressure) could.

 

A "wild shot" here - Any chance of temps over 1000 F on the extractor - also would cause loss of spring tension. 

 

You are encountering something that normally does not happen.   If you do not have the experience to do the visual check of operation I mentioned above, then it's time for at least one gun and some of your (old) ammo to go to a good cowboy gunsmith.  If you suspect the old ammo did damage to several extractors, I sure would want to confirm WHAT about the ammo was damaging to your extractors.  Otherwise, it may continue to bite you. 

 

good luck, GJ

Edited June 10 by Garrison Joe, SASS #60708

[Flanigan Flats]

The ammo was loaded long. I can check extractor tension and every one of them that failed had good tension. But I am going to confirm that on the older one when I get home this week. I have fired just 10 rounds out of it since I got it back from having the extractor groove cleaned up and a new extractor installed. I used a small batch of ammo for that match that was at an OAL length of 1.57ish. The long ammo is the only coated ammunition that I have loaded. It got long by accident. I’m keeping an eye on that. But it is very easily identified. And I have less than 100 rounds of it left. 
 

that ammunition is the only commonality between the rifles and is far from hot. 5.5 grns of trailboss with a 200 Grn RNFP bullet 

[El Sobrante Kid]

56 minutes ago, Flanigan Flats said:

that ammunition is the only commonality between the rifles and is far from hot. 5.5 grns of trailboss with a 200 Grn RNFP bullet 

 

It might be well worth pulling apart one of those rounds to confirm the load. GL!

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

10 hours ago, Flanigan Flats said:

that ammunition is the only commonality between the rifles

You have a suspicion, but at this point not a PROVEN cause of the extractor failures.  You have not done some of the standard examinations and tests that could identify the root cause.  You are simply jumping on the first thing you could think of. 

 

Your "old" ammo load  sounds like it is not something most rifles would fail on.  If it chambers and fires and extracts for a while with a new extractor, but problems develop after a thousand or so rounds, think more along the lines of  double clutching the lever, jumping the trigger to fire just out of battery, or some other functional stress you are creating.  If you have disabled the trigger safety and shoot real fast, I'd re-enable the trigger safety. 

 

There's lots of possibilities.   If you want to improve your success running the gun without having lots more extractor problems than other shooters, dig deep enough to find the root cause.

 

good luck, GJ

Edited June 10 by Garrison Joe, SASS #60708

[Kid Rich]

With an empty rifle try holding the bolt to the left as you close it. It should not hit the edge of the cutout in the back of the barrel. Then try holding it to the right. If it hits either side when you do that you might try tapering the side of the extractor so it clears.

kR

[Flanigan Flats]

Define double clutching the lever. 
I have checked the extractor as much as I know how. When I get home this week I’ll check the extractor in the old rifle as you suggested. When I get the new one back from having a new extractor put in it I’ll. Check it as you suggested. 
The Lever Safeties are in place on both rifles. I am going to try to cycle some ammo through and watch how the extractor does its thing. 
 

It is beyond frustrating 

 

[Flanigan Flats]

I’ll pull one of the rounds a part and check the powder charge as well.
 

But if they were hot I would definitely have noticed the increased recoil from my hand guns. 

[Wrangler Bob]

Similar question, different caliber. '73 Uberti/Cimmeron, .38 special. Ammo: Promo powder, 125 Chey rnfp, Starline brass. OAL? Have had extractor replaced, but still have problems with ammo "jams". Crimp was an issue, but I think I have that resolved. Thanks in advance.

[Flanigan Flats]

Define Jams. Mine fails to extract then jams when next round moves toward the already occupied chamber. 

[The Rainmaker, SASS #11631]

How about the "tab" at the bottom of the bolt face? I had the failure-to-extract and jam fresh round against the empty in the chamber this past weekend. My extractor is "banana'd" the wrong direction, so the hook is not staying down on the rim AND the tab at the bottom of the bolt face is bent down at an angle so the empty casing is not held up against the extractor hook. Complete new bolt assembly installed now.

[El Sobrante Kid]

1 hour ago, Flanigan Flats said:

I’ll pull one of the rounds a part and check the powder charge as well.
 

But if they were hot I would definitely have noticed the increased recoil from my hand guns. 

 

Agreed that you likely would have noticed the increased recoil. But at this point, your best approach to finding the issue is to check one thing at a time, and eliminate it as a possibility, until you find the issue. It might be helpful to keep a list of each test you have done and the results. The results may or may not make any sense to the average shooter, but they may indicate a specific problem to a lever-action specialist... and we have a number of them here on the Wire.

[Badlands Bob #61228]

13 minutes ago, The Rainmaker, SASS #11631 said:

How about the "tab" at the bottom of the bolt face? I had the failure-to-extract and jam fresh round against the empty in the chamber this past weekend. My extractor is "banana'd" the wrong direction, so the hook is not staying down on the rim AND the tab at the bottom of the bolt face is bent down at an angle so the empty casing is not held up against the extractor hook. Complete new bolt assembly installed now.

I'd be looking at that tab on the bottom of the bolt face too.  Out of battery discharge or forcing the lever will bend something (lever) and get the action out of timing.  The carrier coming up too soon can break off the lower tab on the bolt face.  Hard to diagnose without looking at the rifle.   

[Shawnee Hills]

Not to be rude but the other commonality between the rifles is you.  Bending a lever while running suggests that you may be overly abusive to the action.  Another clue to this is how quickly you began having problems with a new rifle.  These rifles are capable of being ran hard and fast but do have a limit as to how much force they will tolerate. 

 

So long as they are installed and timed correctly, the brand of short stroke will not affect your extractor.  You either have timing issues that is bending your bottom tab, brass issues (too fat of a rim [very rare]), carbon buildup in the chamber (TB is dirty stuff), or headspace issues.  The first order of business is to make sure your chambers are free of buildup and inspect the tabs for damage.  If those are good then double check your headspace.  If you did not replace or repair the bent lever then that will cause all sorts of problems as well.  If all of that is good then you need to critique how you're running the rifles. 

 

One of our local shooters had the problem that you describe and it turned out to be a bent tab.

 

The ammo OAL is not the problem.

 

 

Edited June 10 by Shawnee Hills
typo

[Flanigan Flats]

I will look at the tab on the bottom of the bolt on the old rifle when I get home as well. I’ll point out that both bolts are new. The one in the old gun was replaced recently. In the last few months. The bottom tab was pushed down some on the old bolt and we thought we’d found the problem then. The old gun is 13 years old (new bolt assembly.) The new rifle is well Brand new.  

[Flanigan Flats]

I’ll check myself. Bent lever was replaced. I am going to slow way down with the rifle this weekend. 
 

I am still not positive that a slightly long OAL can’t cause the issue. If the gun can fire out of battery then in theory the slightly to long round can enter the chamber the bolt not completely be in battery and the trigger pulled and the round goes bang. 
 

yes my lever safety’s are there. I will check them for functionality to. 

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

6 minutes ago, Flanigan Flats said:

I am still not positive that a slightly long OAL can’t cause the issue. If the gun can fire out of battery then in theory the slightly to long round can enter the chamber t

No, a too-long cartridge OAL (long enough to not chamber fully) will never come up the carrier shaft inside the carrier.  The Uberti toggle action acts like a "too-long" cartridge gauge because the carrier shaft in the receiver is almost exactly 1.600" along the length of the opening.   Rounds will still feed through the carrier and lift to the chamber up to about 1.595" length (plus or minus for manufacturing tolerances).    Only manually dropping a round in the chamber over the top of the carrier (like some folks perform a reload on the line) will let a too-long cartridge get to the chamber.

 

Not sure where you got this "too long" cartridge length in your head, but you need to dismiss that!  good luck, GJ

[Abilene, SASS # 27489]

1 hour ago, Shawnee Hills said:

... or headspace issues...

My 32-20 '73 came from the factory with too much headspace, causing failures to extract.  Eventually a Cowboy and Indians SS kit with longer links solved that.  But in talking to Jim Bowie about it on the phone, he said a lot of Uberti rifles come new with excess headspace.  He said bending the lever usually can solve that, unless it bends to the point that it will no longer depress the trigger safety on the bottom tang. 

 

So, do check the headspace on both rifles.

[Flanigan Flats]

On 6/10/2025 at 4:49 AM, Kid Rich said:

With an empty rifle try holding the bolt to the left as you close it. It should not hit the edge of the cutout in the back of the barrel. Then try holding it to the right. If it hits either side when you do that you might try tapering the side of the extractor so it clears.

kR

This is possible with the older rifle. The extractor if pushed to the right will make contact with the right side of the extractor cut out. 
 

I can’t seem to make it do it while cycling dummy rounds at a slow controlled rate. 
 

The whole feeding and extraction cycle looks and feels butter smooth. While running the lever slow and easy. 

[Flanigan Flats]

The extractor pressure feels as described. Just starting to feel pain on my finger tip with it lifted enough to go rim of cartridge. I do not have a trigger pull gauge here at the house so the finger test is the best I can do. 

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

19 minutes ago, Flanigan Flats said:

with the older rifle. The extractor if pushed to the right will make contact with the right side of the extractor cut out. 

To ensure longer extractor life in that older rifle, I'd put enough bevel into the right side of the barrel slot and/or the right side of the leading edge of the extractor nose.   Enough that you don't get contact between the face of the barrel and the extractor.  GJ

[Flanigan Flats]

I can easily bevel the extractor nose. I’m also going to focus on being smooth and easy at this weekends match. 

[Kid Rich]

I've seen new rifles with not enough clearance.

kR