MEC Bushing for APP for 12 Gauge

[Texas Maverick]

@Scarlett Do you have a bushing number for the MEC 9000 for me to start with? I was told 35 grn / 3 cc was a good starting point and would like to know which bushing throws that so I can at least have a starting point. I have a 29 and 30 bushing and will need to buy others if these are not correct. I just don't want to buy a bunch just looking for the right one. Will be loading 7/8 oz shot and have a number of wads to use to find the right one.

 

Thanks

 

TM

Edited March 18 by Texas Maverick

[Leroy Luck]

I use a #36 bushing and drop between 32-35 grains by weight of APP.  With 7/8 oz of shot. If that helps. 

Edited March 18 by Leroy Luck

[Beartrap SASS#57175]

Depends on your shot load. How much shot are you using?

[Griff]

I don't load APP, but my #37 drops right at 40 grains of Goex Cartridge.  

[Sedalia Dave]

MEC bushing size to cc conversion can be found here.

 

 

[Texas Maverick]

23 minutes ago, Beartrap SASS#57175 said:

Depends on your shot load. How much shot are you using?

7/8 oz

 

TM

1 hour ago, Leroy Luck said:

I use a #36 bushing and drop between 32-35 grains by weight of APP.  With 7/8 oz of shot. If that helps. 

Thanks, give me a starting point.

 

TM

[Texas Maverick]

From the post above I will get a 36 bushing and start from there.

 

Thanks

 

TM

[Leroy Luck]

5 minutes ago, Texas Maverick said:

 

From the post above I will get a 36 bushing and start from there.

 

I should mention I’m also not using plastic wads. I’m using one nitro card, one 1/2” fiber wad, the 7/8 oz shot and one overshot card. Then finished off with a roll crimp. They work out really nice. 

[Eyesa Horg]

Keep your eyes open for an adjustable powder/shot bar. BPI is carrying one for single stage MECs now. Hopefully one for the progressives will be forthcoming. I've got one of the old originals and it's a real time saver if building different loads.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

Never trust a MEC powder or shot bushing to drop what the chart size it will.

Search E-bay for an adjustable powder/shot bar.

[Griff]

37 minutes ago, Griff said:

I don't load APP, but my #37 drops right at 40 grains of Goex Cartridge.  

I just double checked, 1 oz shot bushing in once fired WIN LNLR hulls and a Claybuster CB-1138-12 wad. Less shot gave me a slightly concave crimp.  

 

 

8 minutes ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

Never trust a MEC powder or shot bushing to drop what the chart size it will.

Search E-bay for an adjustable powder/shot bar.

Nothing volumetric drops exactly the same amount from one drop to another.  It might only differ by 100ths of a grain, or 10ths, but there is a difference.  

[Sedalia Dave]

1 hour ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

Never trust a MEC powder or shot bushing to drop what the chart size it will.

Search E-bay for an adjustable powder/shot bar.

 

This is true for every volumetric method of dispensing powder. 

 

People install a bushing in a press and pull the handle once to drop the charge. Weigh and then repeat. This is guaranteed to cause inconsistencies in the dropped charge when actually loading shells on a MEC or any other press that uses bushings.

 

For a single stage MEC press the handle should be cycled FIVE times before dropping the powder charge to check a particular bushing. The reason is this is how many times the press is cycled to completely load one shell. Each cycle of the press will cause the powder to settle. How much is dependant on how you cycle the press. Even with a powder baffle, settling will occur with every cycle of the press.

 

Same is true for adjustable charge bars.  

Edited March 18 by Sedalia Dave

[Blackwater 53393]

I’ve begun using the Chuckwalla powder measure vibrator on my RCBS powder measure. It’s made my powder drops way more consistent. 
 

I made an adapter for the one that fits my Dillon powder measure on the 750.

 

I have an old Detemyer 300 for my 2 3/3” 12ga shells and I have a MEC 600 jr in 10ga on the way.
 

 With the success I got from this vibrator, I intend to buy another one to use with the appropriate adapters to cover all the different reservoirs.

 

Can’t run two presses at once, so one to use on the larger reservoirs and another for the small ones will do all I need done.

 

For those of you who haven’t seen it, here it is, running!  It’s actually a lot quieter when there’s powder in the hopper!

 

Edited March 18 by Blackwater 53393

[Texas Maverick]

I looked an couldn't find the adj bar for the MEC 9000. I also checked to see what bushings and shot bars I have on hand and found this.

 

Qty Bushing Num   Qty Shot Ba 2 29   2  7/8 3 30   1 1    2 31   2 1 1/8 3 32       1 33       1 34       0 35       0 36       1 37       1 38       1 39       1 41

 

So I just ordered a 35 and a 36. So I should be able to find the right one when I start trying to setup my load.

 

Thanks

 

TM

[Too Tall Bob]

Empty your mail box!

[Texas Maverick]

22 minutes ago, Too Tall Bob said:

Empty your mail box!

Done

 

TM

[Krazy Kajun]

I've had BP substitutes to bridge (clump) while trying to load them through a bushing.  I found that out the hard way when I drove 5 hours to Valdosta GA to shoot an annual match and had "musical chairs" version of shotgun rounds....you'd never know what would go off.  Some with very little powder, some full loads and variations in between.  Since that day I've always used Lee dippers and load BP subs shotgun on my Mec Jr.  I use a 1.9cc dipper for 7/8 oz shot and 2.2cc dipper for 1 1/8oz shot.  I use either APP or Triple Seven.

 

I know that I could pour out a whole bottle of the BP sub in a container and break up all the clumps before putting it into the MEC powder bottle and that "should" work ok.  By using the dipper I ALWAYS know the powder charge is correct. As usual YMMV.

 

Kajun

[Scarlett]

Boy! I am sure glad all these fellas came through for you! I’ve been cleaning all of the Arizona DUST out of my Guncart! It’s been a chore but my cart looks like new! 
 

Thanks to everyone for your input and @Sedalia Dave for the bushing chart!!

 

Big SMOKY hugs!

 

Scarlett

[Abilene Slim SASS 81783]

Maverick, it’s the volume that counts.  Before you buy any bushings, load a shell with your #30 bushing and see what your stack height is. You could weigh the charge as well. 

[Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971]

I have no trouble with Triple Seven flowing through a bushing so long as I break up any clumps before starting a loading session.  My wife's SG shells for EOT were all light loads of Triple Seven that performed well.  However, APP and Shooters World BP sub have larger granules than Triple Seven, so I dip when loading those subs.  Should I ever load Pyrodex I would also dip it as Hodgdon says it is unsafe to meter it through an ordinary powder measure.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

4 hours ago, Griff said:

 

Nothing volumetric drops exactly the same amount from one drop to another.  It might only differ by 100ths of a grain, or 10ths, but there is a difference.  

They are off way more than you think!

Why I went with an adjustable bar on my 600jr. 

[Blackwater 53393]

After following this thread all day, I’ve decided that I will be adding an adjustable charge bar to my soon to arrive 10ga MEC 600 jr.   The one from Ballistic Products looks like a good choice!

 

Anyone else using this one??

[Leroy Luck]

I have one in my 600 jr that I play around with occasionally. Works out when I’m testing some new combination of powder or shot. 

[Bingo Montana]

Here is what has been worked for me:

Shotgun - APP: Loaded on a MEC Sizemaster 

12 gauge

1F (Once fired) Winchester AA HS Hull 2 3/4

Primer: Cheddite

Powder: APP 3F (purchased from @Scarlett <-shameless plug for her, awesome cowgirl and one heck of World Champion Ladies Frontier Cartridge Gunfighter!)

 

1 oz Load - This is my match load, stacks good, makes a good crimp, and knocks stuff down good.

#8 Shot (new or reclaimed). I use reclaimed shot for club level matches and new shot for state level matches, just because)

1 oz MEC Shot bar

#34 MEC Powder Bushing (probably about 3.0 cc, never measured)

Wad: CB1118-12

 

7/8 oz load - If you want to go a bit lighter on powder and shot

#8 Shot (new or reclaimed)

7/8 oz MEC Shot bar

~2.7 cc of APP as thrown from a Lee Deluxe Perfect Powder Measure

Wad: CB1100-12

[Blackwater 53393]

21 minutes ago, Leroy Luck said:

I have one in my 600 jr that I play around with occasionally. Works out when I’m testing some new combination of powder or shot. 

 

Will it work for day to day use?  I’m not interested in changing bars and bushings every time I go to a different load.  I have several different loads for 10ga to suit my mood, for purposes other than SASS, or to meet category requirements.

 

 If it’s dependable and durable, it’s what I’m looking for.

 

 

[Eyesa Horg]

4 minutes ago, Blackwater 53393 said:

 

Will it work for day to day use?  I’m not interested in changing bars and bushings every time I go to a different load.  I have several different loads for 10ga to suit my mood, for purposes other than SASS, or to meet category requirements.

 

 If it’s dependable and durable, it’s what I’m looking for.

 

 

It is like setting any measure per se. On the MEC it saves having to ever change bars or bushings. And makes it real handy for making stack height adjustments. I honestly can't think of a downside to one.

Mine is the vintage Multi-Scale, but I just got an email from BPI and they now have what looks pretty nice for the 600jr. Price looked decent too. $75 IIRC

[Burn Through]

I messed with a adjustable  bar on a mec one time .... I had bad luck with it I went back to bushings and never looked back  ,, but as long as sta ck is right id try 34 or 37 and weigh and see a round file cuts easily to open up the 34 to right weight

[Burn Through]

oh and a slice of a 20 gauge empty will bush a over sized bar or bushing down ..... don't  have to be a full circle either

[Leroy Luck]

17 minutes ago, Blackwater 53393 said:

Will it work for day to day use?  I’m not interested in changing bars and bushings every time I go to a different load.  I have several different loads for 10ga to suit my mood, for purposes other than SASS, or to meet category requirements.

 

 If it’s dependable and durable, it’s what I’m looking for.

I don’t use the BPI Adjustable-drop as my main charge bar, but I would say it would work for day to day use. I primarily use one of the old school adjustable bars for my progressive Mec press. 
 

One thing I recommend with any adjustable bar is to double check and make sure the set screws that hold the adjustment knobs are tight. I’ve had them move and change the powder or shot charge and cause issues. Also periodically check the adjustment markings as well. 

[Blackwater 53393]

19 minutes ago, Eyesa Horg said:

It is like setting any measure per se. On the MEC it saves having to ever change bars or bushings. And makes it real handy for making stack height adjustments. I honestly can't think of a downside to one.

Mine is the vintage Multi-Scale, but I just got an email from BPI and they now have what looks pretty nice for the 600jr. Price looked decent too. $75 IIRC

 
Good info!  That new one is what I’m looking at.

 

1 minute ago, Leroy Luck said:

I don’t use the BPI Adjustable-drop as my main charge bar, but I would say it would work for day to day use. I primarily use one of the old school adjustable bars for my progressive Mec press. 
 

One thing I recommend with any adjustable bar is to double check and make sure the set screws that hold the adjustment knobs are tight. I’ve had them move and change the powder or shot charge and cause issues. Also periodically check the adjustment markings as well. 

All the things I needed to know. Thank you!

[Griff]

An adjustable bar is also just a volumetric measuring device, same as a bushing, just allows adjusting the amount of drop.  But, it is just as prone to variations between drops as a bushing, as Sedalia Dave described.  But, you are correct in that while the MEC Chart is close to the amount of powder a particular bushing drops, it is not exact.  I typically take my desired powder charge, pick the bushing that drops just shy of that amount, check how much it actually drops, and if within "my tolerance" go about my business.

[Scarlett]

Boy! I am sure glad all these fellas came through for you! I’ve been cleaning all of the Arizona DUST out of my Guncart! It’s been a chore but my cart looks like new! 
 

Thanks to everyone for your input and @Sedalia Dave for the bushing chart!!

 

Big SMOKY hugs!

 

Scarlett

 

Oh And I use an adjustable charge bar ALL the time. Because I’m super ADD and cannot remember which way to turn the dial, I weighed out 42gr of powder (APP) and and ounce of shot (8s, too. @Bingo Montana) and placed it on table - very flat surface. Dialed the bar in until it “comfortably” held the powder. Weighed out an ounce of shot and did the same thing. Put the bar back in and checked it. Made minor adjustments. 
 

I use an ounce and #8s so that just in case I’m off just a smidge with my shotgun, more shot going down range increases the chances that some MIGHT catch the target enough to knock it down. 
 

HUGS!

[Abilene Slim SASS 81783]

Reloading on a Mec progressive press like a 650 or 9000 (Mav’s press) is way different with an adjustable charge bar than on a manual 600 Jr. I have one for my 650 and put it away after way too much fiddling and unreliable cycling. A total waste of time in my experience on my machine. 
 

I have 2 loads for cowboy shooting - black powder and smokeless. The only difference is the bushing for powder. I load enough at one time that changing the bushing is a tiny fraction of a loading session. I don’t mind making the switch for reliability and consistency. 
 

YMMV

 

Edited March 19 by Abilene Slim SASS 81783

[Texas Maverick]

16 hours ago, Blackwater 53393 said:

After following this thread all day, I’ve decided that I will be adding an adjustable charge bar to my soon to arrive 10ga MEC 600 jr.   The one from Ballistic Products looks like a good choice!

 

Anyone else using this one??

I have used the BPI unit and it worked very well. It is that they don't make one for the progressive reloaders.

 

TM

[Texas Maverick]

11 hours ago, Abilene Slim SASS 81783 said:

Reloading on a Mec progressive press like a 650 or 9000 (Mav’s press) is way different with an adjustable charge bar than on a manual 600 Jr. I have one for my 650 and put it away after way too much fiddling and unreliable cycling. A total waste of time in my experience on my machine. 
 

I have 2 loads for cowboy shooting - black powder and smokeless. The only difference is the bushing for powder. I load enough at one time that changing the bushing is a tiny fraction of a loading session. I don’t mind making the switch for reliability and consistency. 
 

YMMV

 

I have a MEC 9000E that I have used for years for my smokeless. I just got a good deal on a used MEC 9000GN so I bought it and plan on setting it up for my black powder loads. I don't shoot much black powder currently and manually loaded my shells on the 9000E by removing the powder bottle and pulling the shell out from that stage and manually dumping 3cc of APP into it and putting it back and cycling on through the stages dumping 7/8 oz of shot. I even used the same wad as I do with my smokeless loads. They came out nice and I used them in our state black powder match without any issues. Being able to load them easier I might shoot more black powder matches.

 

TM