Bullet casting

[Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life]

On 1/31/2025 at 6:16 PM, Whitey James said:

Casting has been on my radar for several years but I have yet to take the plunge. 

I have a few questions for the casters out there.

1) Is it enough of a cost savings to have to buy the supplies (I have zero casting equipment) than just buy pre-cast bullets?

2) where do you get your lead?

3) Do you recommend starting with ladle pouring or jump right into the electric pots?

4) do you have a brand mold preference and why?

 

Thanks

I personally do NOT cast. I know many enjoy it as a second part of the shooting experience and more power to them. Many years ago I calculated the costs of equipment, materials, time and while not a priority for me the exposure risks. Couldn’t really see a lot of savings for the effort. Don’t know how much time it would take to cast the roughly 10k cowboy, 3k IDPA and now (expecting) 3k Wild bunch per year. Much easier to order from a vendor and have delivered. 
The only bullets I can see (for me) that would need to be cast are my 45-70 and 38-55. A friend who does cast uses those in BPCR and whenever he runs a batch for himself he calls and asks if I need some. He usually buys his lead from a supplier and charges me for weight of his finished product plus a lunch or dinner. 100 will last me at least a year. More cost effective for me than a new hobby. 
Regards

    
Gateway Kid

[Randy Saint Eagle, SASS # 64903]

14 hours ago, Whitey James said:

I have been buying unsized/unlubed bullets from Missouri Bullet Co and powder coating them myself with Eastwood powder coat and then sizing them with Lee sizing dies for the last couple of years.

So, what I am hearing is that I should search out lead sources like wheel weights to make it significantly cheaper than buying them already cast. I shoot both 45's (Colt and ACP) and 38's. I try to get to 3 matches a month (1 cowboy and 2 WB).

I can check out some local tire shops and see about some wheel weights.

Picking up range lead is easier than searching tire shops and as stated a lot of wheel weights are zinc anymore. You can pick up a 5 gallon bucket of range bullets below the pistol targets pretty quickly. We used to have a shooter that would melt it down and pour it into about 2lb ingots for 1/4 of it but he has retired.

 

Randy

[Nickle]

Your location might be part of this. In Canada everything especially gun related is more expensive and harder to get.

All of my supplies and gear was bought many years ago so my situation is probably different than someone in a different location thinking about getting into casting. 

[Smokin Gator SASS #29736]

When I last checked prices on cast/ not lubed or sized bullets vs buying finished coated and sized bullets from the same manufacturer the price difference was practically nothing.

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

The producer selling non-sized or non-lubed slugs is providing that service to the 20% of folks who may want a non-standard size, a non-standard lube, or any more, may want to powder coat with their own plastic compound. It's not surprising there is no discount for a plain bullet - almost all the caster's cost is in the metal, the labor to run machines, and the cost to transport finished product.  Not in a sizing or lubing step on automated equipment.

 

good luck, GJ 

Edited February 3 by Garrison Joe, SASS #60708

[Dapper Dave]

20 hours ago, Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 said:

 

Nope, the original Lyman #2 alloy was 5% antimony, 5% tin.   That is pretty hard (Brinell 15), but also VERY expensive to make now due to the high cost of tin.

 

 

good luck, GJ

Yep you are right, I went back and checked my documents and I missed the word "hardball", my bad. 

[Dapper Dave]

8 hours ago, Nickle said:

I've never done car batteries or even looked into it.

But I can remember when I was a kid and reading about and learning about casting bullets  I can  remember in the books back then.  Linotype, wheelweights and car batteries was what they used to use.  But I'm  not arguing because you are probably right about car batteries. 

Alot of what I used to read about about casting wasn't right.  Always empty your pot into molds or when you turn on your pot and reheat it will explode haha 

Never preheat your molds. Heat them by casting bullets in them haha

A bead of sweat from your forehead could cause an explosion  haha 

Lead is toxic and dangerous  haha  if it was half as bad as they say I would be dead a long time ago.  When I buy mig welding wire it now comes with a warning on it that it will cause cancer. 

In Canada now apparently primers and powder are classified as explosives.  

Everything we eat is going to kill us. Hard to know who to believe anymore.

If you have lead with water in it that gets dropped into a molten pot, AND that water gets under the surface of the molton lead before evaporating...yes, superheated steam will give you a visit from the Tinfoil Fairy. So far I've avoided that. 
Lead IS toxic and dangerous, if you don't take precautions. AS I stated, I've only been casting for 15 years and handloading for 20 years, but I just had a lead stick done and came in at 2.7, which is much lower than the standard of 5 or less. 

Everything IS going to kill you - life is a sexually transmitted disease with no cure. 

["Big Boston"]

The replies so far pretty much sum it up, and i'll just add some of my own observations. 

 

Casting bullets, sizing and lubing bullets, powder coating bullets, selecting and alloying your own lead alloy, selecting molds, maintaining the molds, and finding good loads for the lead bullets you have made, all skills that are valuable, and all take a bit of work to learn. 

 

If you can source good bullets at a decent price, that is by far the easiest way to go. Use the time saved to practice. However, sometimes the supply dries up, or the right bullet isn't available. The caster that I use did not have the mold for the bullet I needed, so I sent him mine to use. That should tell you a bit about what is involved in casting your own. 

 

The art of casting a good bullet involves a bit of ZEN and some luck as well. it is not within everyone paygrade. 

 

Already mentioned, but one needs to be aware of the safety concerns. Before starting have your blood/lead levels tested, if you are high already, casting will raise them. Powder coating, if inhaled is a bit unhealthy, and the fumes from the oven aren't healthy either. Remember, commercial bullet casters use large automated machines that run with very little human interaction, as does commercial powder coating processes. 

 

But, when you need a special bullet, it is pretty satisfying to be able to grab some alloy, melt it and make your own. Recently I had a 45-70 with 0.462" grooves. I cast some, double powder coated to get them big enough, sized with a LEE sizer and shot some groups. Pretty satisfying.

 

BB

[Dapper Dave]

Cast outside, lowers lead risk. Wear proper safety equipment, gloves, face shield, long sleeved shirt, leather apron if you want, (leather really isn't necessary as lead cools VERY fast, I use an old t-shirt to protect my jeans), don't boil the lead, (there really aren't any vapors below the boiling point, from what I've been told), use a fan to blow over the pot to get rid of any vapors that MIGHT be there, use a lead thermometer to make sure the temps are right, and have ZERO DISTRACTIONS. None, zip, zero, nada, no phone, no TV, tell your family to stay away unless the house is burning down or Genghis Kahn just broke down the front door. 

[Waimea]

On 1/31/2025 at 9:23 PM, Jackalope said:

😁

Most recently, I managed to get a fairly good size chuck of boat keel in a trade.

 

Best trade I ever made.

Jackalope handmade the sheath below.

Hand stitched the beads.

It is a one of my highly prized possessions. 

I wear this one to every match.

It's too good to hide it in a drawer.

 

[Jackalope]

Aw, you're making me blush.  🤠

[Sgt. Hochbauer, SASS #64409]

I have been casting for my BP bullets which is mostly for 44wcf but also have big lube 6 cavity molds for .38spcl for 105/147 bullets. I rarely cast .38 as its lots easier for me to buy for my wife's  shooting. But when I run my .44 molds I will also on occasion cast some .38spcl just in case I want to shoot those guns with BP. Fortunately I was given a very large supply of sheet lead that I use for my conicals and rounds balls for my ROA's and 45-70. Plus I inherited thousands of bullets that get tossed into the melting pot and become 44wcf or .38. I use two melting pots one for my pure lead bullets and the other for .44 and .38 and use an old RCBS lubrisizer. As far as molds go I mostly have Lee molds which work well for me and a few Big Lube molds. 

I find it to be a relaxing way to spend time and satisfying. My bullets do not look like factory and would not win any beauty contests but they go down the barrels and go ding when I hit the target.

 

Sgt H

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

15 hours ago, Dapper Dave said:

Everything IS going to kill you -

 

If you really believe that someone is not capable of navigating life's hazards, you need to get them into protective care!

 

But in lead casting, trust and follow the same practices that work for experienced casters and in the lead industrial operations. 
Yeah, at one time I was in the secondary lead recovery industry, developing new ways to recycle car batteries.  It's not for DIY operators.

 

IMHO    GJ

Edited February 3 by Garrison Joe, SASS #60708

[Sedalia Dave]

5 minutes ago, Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 said:

 

If you really believe that someone is not capable of navigating life's hazards, you need to get them into protective care!

 

But in lead casting, trust and follow the same practices that work for experienced casters and in the lead industrial operations. 
Yeah, at one time I was in the secondary lead recovery industry, developing new ways to recycle car batteries.  It's not for DIY operators.

 

IMHO    GJ

 

Agree 1000%

 

As for car batteries, attempting to salvage lead from them can get you or someone else killed or injured for life.

 

Copied from the Cast Boollits forum.

 

<quote>

Why Car Batteries Are Dangerous

 

The warnings about smelting automotive batteries to recover the lead they contain needs a bit of explanation. Doing so really does have the potential to harm or even kill you and here is why.

 

Maintenance free/low maintenance batteries use calcium metal-doped lead to catalyze the hydrogen gas generated from water electrolysis back into water. That is what makes the batteries low maintenance or maintenance free, you don't need to add water to the cells as often like in the old days.

When the battery lead is melted down there is enough sulfuric acid from residual electrolyte trapped in the lead dioxide and lead framework of the battery plates to react with the small amount of calcium metal in the lead alloy. Normally when sulfuric acid (or water) gets in contact with calcium metal it undergoes a rather vigorous reaction that generates hydrogen gas. In and of itself this is no big deal, hydrogen is a simple non-toxic asphyxiant that is also flammable.

 

But the lead alloy used in batteries also contains a bit of antimony and even arsenic to help harden and strengthen the lead to withstand the vibration and general knocking-about batteries have to withstand in order to survive normal automotive use. When hydrogen comes in contact with arsenic and antimony, or compounds of these two elements, the hydrogen reacts to form ammonia analogues called arsine and stibine, AsH3 and SbH3. Both of these are heavy gases and both have the similar characteristic odors of rotting fish.

In World War One the Germans experimented with these, along with phosphine, another rotting-fish-smelling gaseous ammonia analogue with formula PH3, as war gases. As such they were highly effective since they are deadly in amounts too small to easily detect. In even smaller amounts that are too small to immediately kill they cause rather painful lung damage that often eventually leads to emphysema and lung cancer.

So, leave smelting car batteries or using lead smelted from them to professional recyclers. Many folks including myself have successfully smelted batteries and lived to tell about it, but the risk is just too great to mess with the stuff.

<end quote>

 

 

[Whitey James]

On 2/2/2025 at 1:10 PM, Randy Saint Eagle, SASS # 64903 said:

Picking up range lead is easier than searching tire shops and as stated a lot of wheel weights are zinc anymore. You can pick up a 5 gallon bucket of range bullets below the pistol targets pretty quickly. We used to have a shooter that would melt it down and pour it into about 2lb ingots for 1/4 of it but he has retired.

 

Randy

I'd be glad to take over that role Randy. I can come once or twice a month during the week and clean up the area for lead and brass.

[Nickle]

5 hours ago, Whitey James said:

I'd be glad to take over that role Randy. I can come once or twice a month during the week and clean up the area for lead and brass.

I use a Lyman mag 20. It's a thermostat controlled pot that holds 20 lbs of lead.

Cheap lee aluminum mold will get you started. Old spoon and some wax to Flux.

Ladle to pour. Gloves and glasses.  Cheap Chinese automotive painting mask probably more than you need.  I wear one when wind is blowing wrong direction. 

Old bucket filled with water to drop your bullets into.

Lubesizer or that new other way with the painted bullets.  Up 2 u.

I learned from reading a book years ago and just went at it. It's not rocket science and I'm sure you can learn this. Probably lots of utube videos to see how you how.

Tin added to your lead makes it easier.  Experience will help you. Lead round balls are extra easy to learn.  You just get a feel for temperature, for distance you pour your lead into your mold. 

I'm like an old woman who can knit Sox and watch TV and boss orders to others in the room and never miss a stitch on her knitting.  I can cast without thinking about it or looking at it and watch TV etc  at same time but I've spent quite a bit of time doing it.

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

Round balls for cap and ball NEED to be cast from pure lead.  Not range pickup (unless it's a .22 rimfire only range).  No tin, either, just run the pot hot (about 750-775 F on a thermometer).

 

Range lead is great for standard cowboy bullets, though.   Add 4 ounces of tin to every 10 pounds of melted and cleaned range scrap and it will make Brinell 10 hardness slugs that shoot perfect. 

 

good luck, GJ

[JackSlade]

If you're only shooting common bullet types for common calibers, it's really not worth it to get into unless you really want to develop a new skill. Even if you're loading for 1 or 2 types of bullets, it won't pay for itself for a very long time unless you're getting your lead for free and easy. 

It's very cool to cast your own bullets and play with alloys for hardness and it's satisfying to crank out hundreds of bullets once you're all set up, but it really only helps if you're shooting a LOT and you shoot a lot of types of bullets that you can't already buy cheap.

 

I think in hindsight, I might have refrained from getting into it and just looked harder for black powder (big lube groove) bullets for my different calibers.

Edited February 6 by JackSlade

[The Saturday Kid]

Whitey,

 

Long post warning! There can be a lot of savings by casting your own bullets. Depending on your source of lead you may yield 1 cent bullets, maybe even less. If you do enough shooting it will recoup the cost of your melt pot (I use a 20 lb Lee production pot with bottom spout) and your molds. 

 

There are several of us in my SASS club sharing a source of discarded wheel weights. Our price for alloy lead runs 50-70c a pound. That’s between 0.89 to 1.25 cents for a 125 grain bullet. Of course you have to account for your time and labor as well. Believe me if you don’t enjoy it it’s not worth it. But I do enjoy casting and the ability to cast for other calibers as well. I have a Model 1888 Trapdoor which has a well worn barrel but will shoot soft cast bullets (20/1 lead/tin no antimony, air cooled and unsized) as accurately as if it were new. Where would you be able to find that bullet? Factory and hard cast bullets  will tumble in it. Without the ability to cast, this otherwise clean rifle would be a wall hanger. You can also yield 5 cent cast rifle bullets (2c for the bullet plus 3c for a gas check) and load them light (as listed in the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook of course) and you will have nice, cheap, soft shooting plinker loads for your rifles that your non shooter friends will love. 

 

You will have to sort that pail of wheel weights though. For me this is the only part of the process I hate. Harder alloy weights won’t scratch with a thumbnail. But they will dent easily. Zinc and iron won’t. Lead and lead alloy weights will drop to the ground with a dull sound, the others will ring. You can also identify and separate pure lead (usually stick on strips) that you can cast for black powder balls. They will be the ones you can easily dent with a fingernail. Worst case - if you don’t set the temp too high on your pot - the zinc, iron and steel will float the top while the lead and alloy is melted. The clips will also separate from the lead weights. Then scoop them off with a kitchen spoon (wear heavy gloves!!). If it’s too hot and the zinc melts you turn the whole thing into useless lead oatmeal. It’s not difficult to prevent this from happening just use care.

 

I also powder coat. But not the trapdoor bullets. That would be sacrilege.

 

For us our source is a tire shop. They used to take their discarded wheel weights to the local scrapyard who would pay them. Of course this also requires them to have an employee on the clock to do this. Figure out the price your local scrap yard pays for wheel weights per pound and make an offer to the tire shop. They’ll probably be happy to sell them. There’s about 100-120 lbs of assorted weights in a 5 gal pail and in my area (KY) you will have about 50 lbs of lead in there. You can sell the non-lead weights to the same scrap yard the tire shop was going to use. (They may or may not care you picked the lead out YMMV.)

 

I HIGHLY recommend you take every precaution when melting,  casting and powder coating. Discarded wheel weights are full of road dirt, grease, oil and who knows what. This will all smoke up in a toxic stink. I melt outside and wear a lead filtering respirator. Also a heavy long sleeve cotton shirt, heavy leather gardening gloves and eye pro. 

 

As someone else said castboolits.gunloads.com is the best resource for casting. It’s an incredible wealth of knowledge with many helpful participants. There’s also good info on how to identify the lead weights from the rest. Also ask around in your CAS group chances are good someone there is casting and can show you how. That’s how I learned. I hope this is helpful for you and for any lurkers wondering about any of this. Best of luck!