Advice needed on 1873

[Bitterroot Jake, SASS #9532]

A brief history about my self first. I started in CAS in 1991 with the Bluegrass Rangers in Glasgow, Ky.  My first guns were a Rossi hammered DB,a Uberti 1860 Henry and a pair of Colt SAA  in 44-40.

 

I used those for several years (I still have them all ) but have added my guns along the way, mostly on 44-40.  I have dabbled on a little in 45 Colt.  I began shooting due list around 1993 or 1994, and shooting  BP occasionally, switched to FCD ON 1998  haven't shot any smokeless in a match since, except a couple Wild Bunch  matches.  I dabbled a bit in Frontiersmen until about 2018, and shoot it exclusively now.

 

I recently purchased a Uberti 1873 rifle from a friend (non cowboy shooter) in 357Mag.  There's the rub, I haven't loaded a 357 or 38 round  for at least 20 years.  

 

I know most shooters now shoot 38 special n their hand guns and rifles.  My question is what OAL do you load 38 special to for reliable feeding?  Would it be better to use 357 brass in a rifle instead of 38 special?  I'm going to have to buy brass anyway so which  would  you recommend?

 

I will continue shooting frontiersmen, load data suggestions are unnecessary.  Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

 

[Griff]

I believe your rifle will tell you which brass sit will like.   If you have a "short" ramp at the front of the carrier, the rifle will be happiest with the longer .357 brass.  Older guns are the ones I've see with a longer ramp at the front of the carrier, and won't need .357 brass or .38 loaded to a longer OAL.  When that change occurred I have no idea as the age difference between my two 1873s are 1986 and 2014.  But the difference in that ramp is clearly distinguishable by the Mk I eyeball.

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

A usual starting point is to run an OAL of 1.500" - it usually works in most factory Uberti toggle link guns.    By modifying the cartridge return ramp on the front of the carrier, usually the gun can run down to as short as about 1.420"

 

I see no need to buy the more expensive .357 brass!  Used .38 spl brass is usually pretty easy to find.  

 

All 73s that I have had to load for would run 1.500" OAL and a 125 grain bullet.

 

good luck, GJ

Edited January 20 by Garrison Joe, SASS #60708

[Captain Bill Burt]

7 hours ago, Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 said:

A usual starting point is to run an OAL of 1.500" - it usually works in most factory Uberti toggle link guns.    By modifying the cartridge return ramp on the front of the carrier, usually the gun can run down to as short as about 1.420"

 

I seen no need to buy the more expensive .357 brass!  Used .38 spl brass is usually pretty easy to find.  

 

All 73s that I have had to load for would run 1.500" OAL and a 125 grain bullet.

 

good luck, GJ

Pretty much my experience.

[Abilene, SASS # 27489]

Most of my .38 ammo is 1.44" but I have to load some to 1.42" to fit in a Kirst cylinder, and they feed fine in a '73 carbine made in 1997.

[Todd Hayseed]

I have a Rossi 16" carbine I had before I started doing this.  In order to get ten rounds in it I would need it to fire .38 Long Colt if there is any way I can make that to work.  But apparently there really isn't.

 

As it only holds 9 regardless, I use .357 to avoid the "Crud Ring" you get when firing .38's.   With my starter kit, Mernicle sent me a belt loop holder for TWO rounds of .38.  For me, this is great as my rifle only holds 9, but they send that to everybody, so what is it supposed to be for?

 

I also shoot F and as nobody else in my club does I'm not competing with anybody so having to manually load one round in the rifle isn't costing me anything.

[Cowtown Scout, SASS #53540 L]

14 minutes ago, Todd Hayseed said:

As it only holds 9 regardless, I use .357 to avoid the "Crud Ring" you get when firing .38's.   With my starter kit, Mernicle sent me a belt loop holder for TWO rounds of .38.  For me, this is great as my rifle only holds 9, but they send that to everybody, so what is it supposed to be for?

The loops are so you will have rounds incase you jack out a live round and need to reload on the clock.

[Texas Maverick]

I have used OAL of 1.45 on my 73 when it was new and never had any issues. Then I got a Codymatic rifle and they still worked in it. Now I shoot a Boogie rifle and it eats them like candy.

 

TM

Edited January 20 by Texas Maverick

[Colorado Coffinmaker]

My own personal??  There are two (maybe now three) most popular bullets for 38/357 rifles.  105Gr Truncated Cone and 125Gr Truncated Cone.  Loading is simple, with either .38 Special cases or 357 Cases, just crimp into the crimp groove.  They'll run just fine in a toggle link rifle.

[Rattlesnake Slim]

The benefit of loading at a 1.50" minimum is that your Rossi should perform well, although you can't load 10. Also the Browning and Miroku Winchester 92's that I have will feed those (a little longer for the best performance), as will my new Ruger/Marlin 1894. The only problem I have is with my .38 special conversions, but since you shoot cap guns it is not a problem.

 

Finally, I have never experienced a "crud ring" with any BP or substitute when shooting shorter lengths in a .357, it all washes away. Just another reason to avoid that heathen smokeless powder.

 

Come on down south next month and shoot EOT. Watch the Plainsmen go at it with the BIG rifles. Who knows, you might find a reason to buy another gun!

[Abilene, SASS # 27489]

54 minutes ago, Rattlesnake Slim said:

...Finally, I have never experienced a "crud ring" with any BP or substitute when shooting shorter lengths in a .357, it all washes away. Just another reason to avoid that heathen smokeless powder...

Right, BP not only leaves no cylinder ring it will eliminate previous rings and leading in the bore.  

 

B-Jake, your rifle's action will get dirty quicker than you are used to with the 44wcf but no problem, just more cleaning.  The Frontier Cartridge winners circle mostly shoot .38's.

[Colorado Coffinmaker]

Since the OP is mostly interested in BP, I can also relate to my being the Poster Kid for APP.  Loading "shorter" cartridges is also no issue with APP.  No chamber ring (Rifle) and no Cylinder Ring.  The OP may experience a mite more "Blow By" with OEM .38 cases, however, that is usually not bad enough to be a real show stopper.  I personally shoot .45s as my caliber of choice.  I run annealed 45 Schofield cases in my rifles and have NO blow-by.  The annealed cases shoot squeaky clean.  I also run Cowboy 45 Special cases in my hand guns with Barnstormer bullets with no problems.  YMMV

[Bitterroot Jake, SASS #9532]

Thanks guys for all the info.   I don't know if I will ever use this rifle in a match, I bought it just to help a friend who had run into a little financial difficulty after a shoulder injured that prevented him from working for awhile.  May just sit in the safe until he's back  on his feet and sell it back to him.

 

But I hate having a gun I don't shoot. I'll have to dig through my reloading stuff, I think I may have a few 38 special brass somewhere in there.