1897 question

[Alpo]

Has anyone used a 97 with a sling on it? If so, have you had the sling drawn up tight? And lastly, if so, does the sling interfere with reloading the gun?

 

 

Here we have four men, three of whom are carrying 1897 riot guns.

 

William Holden, second from the right, has no sling on his.

 

Warren Oates, second from the left, has a sling but it is loose and hanging down.

 

But I just noticed that Ernest Borgnine, far right, has his sling drawn up tight. And that sort of makes sense for going into battle - you don't want the sling flopping around catching on something when you're trying to come up for a shot. But it seems like it would block the loading port, which would make reloading difficult.

 

Not for cowboy shooters of course, since they don't load the magazine, they load over the top. But for normal people, that load the magazine and then shoot from the loaded magazine like the gun was designed for.

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

Watch the first minute of this video...he doesn't have the sling drawn up so tight that he can't load the magazine.
It kinda looks like it in the photo, but it's resting in the crook of his arm.

(watch him top it off at 0:45)

 

 

 

Edited December 28, 2024 by PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L
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[Alpo]

Yeah I noticed at about 2 minutes it was dangling down just as far as Warren's was.

[Alpo]

Something else I noticed and wondered about was the bandolier that Ben Johnson is wearing.

 

According to IMDb guns, he's carrying a 92 Winchester. But those are definitely not cartridges for a 92 in that bandolier.

[Alpo]

And while I'm wondering, I wonder what Warren has tucked in the front of his belt? When I first saw it I thought he had another pistol there, but then there was a clearer picture and it looks to be something about 5 inches long by maybe 3 inches wide.

 

I suppose it could be a couple of 1911 magazines butted up tight against each other.

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

16 minutes ago, Alpo said:

Something else I noticed and wondered about was the bandolier that Ben Johnson is wearing.

 

According to IMDb guns, he's carrying a 92 Winchester. But those are definitely not cartridges for a 92 in that bandolier.

 

He tops off the rifle magazine from the bandolier after levering a round in...the ammo isn't jammed all the way into the loops (faster access)..IMO.

 

(beginning to think I shoulda gone to the range this AM) 

 

 

Edited December 28, 2024 by PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L
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[Stump Water]

16 minutes ago, Alpo said:

I suppose it could be a couple of 1911 magazines butted up tight against each other.

 

I think you're right.  At 23 seconds in PWs video he gets the mags out of the saddlebags and puts them behind his belt.  At 32 seconds he adjusts them, then he gets a SG shell out of the pouch on his right side and tops off the '97. 

[Alpo]

16 minutes ago, PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L said:

He tops off the rifle magazine from the bandolier after levering a round in...the ammo isn't jammed all the way into the loops (faster access)..IMO.

 

 

Most definitely rifle length cartridges.

 

Maybe he was carrying a 94 and IMDb guns got it wrong. Certainly would not be the first time.

[Alpo]

18 minutes ago, PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L said:

(beginning to think I shoulda gone to the range this AM) 

 

[Stump Water]

I wonder what happened to this project.

 

Mel Gibson To Co-Write & Direct A Remake Of Sam Peckinpah Classic ‘The Wild Bunch’

[Stump Water]

Looks like that prop got passed around.

 

There were 1903 Springfields in the movie.

 

"The M1903A3 Springfield rifle is widely used in the movie. Tector (Ben Johnson) uses one while dressed as an Army corporal and in some scenes after."

 

https://imfdb.org/wiki/The_Wild_Bunch#Springfield_M1903

 

.

Edited December 28, 2024 by Stump Water

[Sgt. C.J. Sabre, SASS #46770]

1 hour ago, Alpo said:

 

 

Most definitely rifle length cartridges.

 

Maybe he was carrying a 94 and IMDb guns got it wrong. Certainly would not be the first time.

Those not only look too long to be for a '94, but the bullets aren't round nose like one would use in a tube magazine. 

[Alpo]

3 hours ago, Stump Water said:

 

I think you're right.  At 23 seconds in PWs video he gets the mags out of the saddlebags and puts them behind his belt.  At 32 seconds he adjusts them, then he gets a SG shell out of the pouch on his right side and tops off the '97. 

In this black and white photo, it sort of looks like he's got a walkie-talkie in his belt. They'reTHERE on the left side of the rectangular dark thing there's this dark thingy sticking up about two or three inches, like an antenna.

But in this color picture you can see that what looks like the radio antenna in the black and white picture is actually his stomach peeking through where his shirt isn't completely closed just above his belt.

 

Also in this one you can clearly tell that there are two magazines in his belt.

Edited December 28, 2024 by Alpo
otto has problems with words that rhyme

[Eyesa Horg]

Looks like 2 mags, side by side on my phone 

[Cypress Sun]

4 hours ago, PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L said:

Watch the first minute of this video...he doesn't have the sling drawn up so tight that he can't load the magazine.
It kinda looks like it in the photo, but it's resting in the crook of his arm.

(watch him top it off at 0:45)

 

 

 

 

It's been a while since I saw the movie, but it seems some short parts were cut out of this version of the shootout.

[Stump Water]

1 hour ago, Alpo said:

But in this color picture you can see that what looks like the radio antenna in the black and white picture is actually his stomach peeking through where his shirt isn't completely closed just above his belt.

 

Go back to the very beginning of PWs video, when they come out of the adobe.  He is buttoning up his shirt.  If you go through the entire "march" and confrontation scene note that the shirt/belt/mags are in varying states of "buttoned up".

 

Many takes.