H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 Posted December 22, 2024 Posted December 22, 2024 As we all know, the Winchester 86 and 92 basically have the same action. I have been experimenting with .45-70 brass cut back to the same length as a .45 Colt to create a "new" sub caliber that I call .45-45. I theoretically want to use this in single shot rifles and possible someday a custom made revolver. Why? Because. (All of the following done with cartridges with no powder or primers) Now, here's where it gets "interesting." On a whim, I tried running some .45-45's through my antique 86, and they worked! No double feed at all! You had to be slow, but they worked through the action and went into the chamber with no problem, most of the time. If I went to fast, I risked a stovepipe, but it was doable. I then tried it with a Chiappa 86, and while I think the Chiappa rifle is very good right out of the box, it's no where near as smooth as a vintage Winchester. There is some minor "clunkyness" in the action. While it is of negligible importance with .45-70 ammo, with the .45-45, this can cause the cartridge to "jump around" a bit as it is cycled, and that much harder to get the round into the chamber. It can be done, but you gotta be REALLY methodical about it. I have of course gotten to wondering about how how this "problem" can be solved. Something that occurred to me was how Chuck Connor's 92 on The Rifleman had a modification that I have heard described as a "plunger" on the bolt face that basically held onto the cartridge so it would not fly out of the action when spin cocking the rifle. For the record, I have exactly 0% interest in spin cocking an 86. (Or a 92 for that matter.) But, since the 86 is just a big 92, I wonder if the plunger mod would hold onto the cartridge properly to help get it into the chamber. I also plan to have an action job done to the Chiappa to smooth the action out, which will also help, but one can't help but wonder about other things to help. (By the way, both 86's run modern .45-60, which is just .45-70 shortened a little, just fine. But .45-45's double feed in a reproduction 76.) For that matter, could this mod help with a 92? My own 92's in .44 Magnum have a tendency to stovepipe .44 Specials, and I've never tried Russians. My brother's .357 Magnum has a similar issue with .38 Specials, and while it will feed a single Long Colt, it just jumbles around too much, kinda like the .45-45 does in my 86, to be an option. But with the plunger, or whatever it is to hold on to them, I wonder if the shorter cartridges would become viable options. (It does double feed Short Colts, so that's a non starter) Quote
Jackrabbit Joe #414 Posted December 23, 2024 Posted December 23, 2024 (edited) Sounds like the right side of that 92 may need a shim. That shim place is on right side of Cartridge Guide. Edited December 24, 2024 by Jackrabbit Joe #414 More info available & if you want copies. 1 Quote
Rooster Ron Wayne Posted December 23, 2024 Posted December 23, 2024 (edited) 92's & 86's are cartridge length sensitive. On my 92's in 44 I can run Special just as fast a Magnum's . But you have to load them long . So my 44 Specials run 200g RNFP and instead of crimping at the crimp groove. I crimp at the top first lube groove . Works just as well as 44 Mag cartridge. Can Not run 44 Russian at all in the 92. The cartridge is just way to short . I run the 44 Russian cartridges in my 73 with a Smith shop short carrier , and that works great . We always want to recreat the wheel . But there is limits on the size of what will work or not work . Rooster Edited December 23, 2024 by Rooster Ron Wayne Quote
H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 Posted December 23, 2024 Author Posted December 23, 2024 6 hours ago, Rooster Ron Wayne said: 92's & 86's are cartridge length sensitive. etc Sounds like it's a non starter with the 92. To be honest, I didn't expect the short cartridges to work in the 86, but when it did, I honestly began to think about ways that could make it work better. Interestingly, my Large Frame Lightning takes the short cartridge with no problems whatsoever. Quote
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