PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted August 27, 2024 Share Posted August 27, 2024 When asked what "Don't be a hardass" means, I tell them it means "Enforce the rules...but don't take joy in assessing earned penalties". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyliefoxEsquire Posted August 27, 2024 Share Posted August 27, 2024 Everyone who holds the "clock" should read this thread, then choose to hold the clock or NOT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowtown Scout, SASS #53540 L Posted August 27, 2024 Share Posted August 27, 2024 1 hour ago, watab kid said: ill second this , witnessed recently the TO didnt even look at the spotters every time before calling the misses , When I am spotting and the TO does that more than once I call them out on it and they usually stop doing that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted August 27, 2024 Share Posted August 27, 2024 36 minutes ago, PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L said: When asked what "Don't be a hardass" means, I tell them it means "Enforce the rules...but don't take joy in assessing earned penalties". I tell "them" basically the same thing. Assess penalty but don't be a damn Drill Sargent about it. If you only know who the RO Instructor that I referenced was...you'd probably laugh. Phantom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watab kid Posted August 28, 2024 Share Posted August 28, 2024 23 hours ago, Cowtown Scout, SASS #53540 L said: When I am spotting and the TO does that more than once I call them out on it and they usually stop doing that. visiting at a club and TO was obviously a regular , shooting with regulars that seem t0 look up to him , felt a little awkward doing that ....but i wasnt the only one noticed it , Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Jack Black Posted August 28, 2024 Share Posted August 28, 2024 Nothing new been this way for ever. But, most know this. Best Wishes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Bill Burt Posted August 28, 2024 Share Posted August 28, 2024 I really appreciate what our black pins do for us. It can be a thankless job and one that costs you relationships. I know several shooters who to this day hold a grudge against me for calls I made that I really wished at the time I hadn’t had to make. Calling 10 misses rather than a P for shooting the wrong targets. That was a state match and everyone on the posse argued the call should be a P, but no, I’m the hardass for sticking with 10 misses. Telling a shooter he couldn’t stage his rifle with the entire trigger guard hanging off the table. That got me the middle finger at a state match. Telling a shooter that just because the instructions said to start with one hand pointing at the targets didn’t mean he could put the other hand on his gun got me into a ‘debate’ with plenty of unpleasantness that ended with him telling me how much better a shooter he was than me. I’ve seen 3 spotters all call a miss and yet the shooter wants to appeal the call to the MD. Shotgun bras are everywhere and plenty of perfectly healthy shooters routinely wear sneakers. Shooters need to RTM, follow the rules and take their earned penalties with dignity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shepherd Book Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 I'll bite...what is a "shotgun bra/shotgun bra violation?" SB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 Posted August 29, 2024 Author Share Posted August 29, 2024 The general rule is: Ammunition belts must be worn so all ammo is positioned at or below the belly button. A lot of guys, and it is mostly guys, like to put their shotgun belt up in the middle of the chest. So, they are wearing it like a bra. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 37 minutes ago, Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 said: The general rule is: Ammunition belts must be worn so all ammo is positioned at or below the belly button. A lot of guys, and it is mostly guys, like to put their shotgun belt up in the middle of the chest. So, they are wearing it like a bra. You forgot to mention that it looks stoopid. ☺️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 Posted August 29, 2024 Author Share Posted August 29, 2024 Oh, and it looks stoopid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyesa Horg Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 Oy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Idaho Gunslinger Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 11 hours ago, Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 said: The general rule is: Ammunition belts must be worn so all ammo is positioned at or below the belly button. A lot of guys, and it is mostly guys, like to put their shotgun belt up in the middle of the chest. So, they are wearing it like a bra. Out of curiosity, how many of these guys are obese? As in they got so obese the belt no longer fits in the correct location but they found a skinnier location higher up to wear it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Bill Burt Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 8 minutes ago, Idaho Gunslinger said: Out of curiosity, how many of these guys are obese? As in they got so obese the belt no longer fits in the correct location but they found a skinnier location higher up to wear it? Just a guess on my part since I'm kinda skinny, but I suspect some wear them up high because they have trouble accessing them when they're where they're supposed to be due to dunlap syndrome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackalope Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 Also out of curiosity, how many of them consider obesity a reasonable justification to disregard rules? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Equanimous Phil Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 8 minutes ago, Jackalope said: Also out of curiosity, how many of them consider obesity a reasonable justification to disregard rules? I second that, a shooter should at least ask the MD for clearance (same as for special footwear etc). In an other shooting sports' rule book you'll find the following, which I find a very good phrasing: "The Range Master may make allowances for variations in these requirements due to anatomical considerations. Some competitors may not be able to fully comply." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Equanimous Phil Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 29 minutes ago, Idaho Gunslinger said: As in they got so obese the belt no longer fits in the correct location but they found a skinnier location higher up to wear it? Just add a belt extender with a matching buckle. Or maybe consider switching to a bandoleer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyesa Horg Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 51 minutes ago, Idaho Gunslinger said: Out of curiosity, how many of these guys are obese? As in they got so obese the belt no longer fits in the correct location but they found a skinnier location higher up to wear it? They don't wear their guns in a gun bra! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Idaho Gunslinger Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 3 minutes ago, Eyesa Horg said: They don't wear their guns in a gun bra! One belt went down to the skinny part and one went up to the other skinny part. I'm not saying it's a good excuse, but I was just wondering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 There's zero excuses for wearing their shotgun belt above the allowed area. My friend Taggart (RIP), was as big as about anyone I knew when I first started. He had no problem following the rules on SG belt placement. Phantom PS: Taggart was a Top Shooter...incredible talent and all around nice guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 Posted August 29, 2024 Author Share Posted August 29, 2024 My shotgun belt. Two buckles and a replacable section with longer and shorter inserts. (Kinda like the idea suggested by Phil.) With this insert it accomodates my bowling pin shape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackalope Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 2 hours ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said: Taggart (RIP), was as big as about anyone And he could move like a cat. Oops, almost hijacked the thread. Back on topic... Doesn't overlooking/ignoring rule violations pretty much indicate your own approval of violating the rules? Just wondering... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Bill Burt Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 I think for many it's simply conflict avoidance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickamauga Charlie, SASS #47963 Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 On 8/26/2024 at 12:24 PM, Jim Brown said: At least one Cross draw that was way closer to 45 degrees vice 20 45 degrees of what?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Bill Burt Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 8 minutes ago, Chickamauga Charlie, SASS #47963 said: 45 degrees of what?? Angle? He may have meant to say closer to 45 vice '30'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Brown Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 2 hours ago, Chickamauga Charlie, SASS #47963 said: 45 degrees of what?? Take your pick Horizontal or vertical. Rules are 20 30 degrees. Knew I should have looked up the rule before posting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Idaho Gunslinger Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 1 hour ago, Chickamauga Charlie, SASS #47963 said: 45 degrees of what?? Cant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 11 minutes ago, Jim Brown said: Take your pick Horizontal or vertical. Rules are 20 degrees Quote Holsters may not depart from the vertical by more than 30º when worn. SHB p.3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three Foot Johnson Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 On 8/28/2024 at 4:48 AM, Captain Bill Burt said: I’ve seen 3 spotters all call a miss and yet the shooter wants to appeal the call to the MD. There used to be a shooter around here who did this on virtually every call against him. Shotgun bras are everywhere and plenty of perfectly healthy shooters routinely wear sneakers. I see both of these regularly, especially the sneakers/"hiking boots" - Danner, Oboz, Keen, etc. If a shooter says they have "bad feet" and have to wear their Danners, what do you do? Make them bring a doctor's note? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Bill Burt Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 1 hour ago, Three Foot Johnson said: If a shooter says they have "bad feet" and have to wear their Danners, what do you do? Make them bring a doctor's note? I've never asked a shooter for a doctor's note, even when I was an MD and an RO Instructor. If a shooter tells me they have a foot problem their word is good enough for me. If they're willing to lie to gain an advantage then they have to live with that. When I broke a bone in my right foot and had to skip the boots for a while nobody asked me for a note, but the limp probably made that unnecessary. Having said that, if a shooter is out there wearing sneakers and sprinting around from station to station significantly faster than I am (and for 61 I'm pretty light on my feet) I will probably conclude that they aren't having any significant issues with their feet, they're just cheating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 2 hours ago, Idaho Gunslinger said: Cant Why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted August 29, 2024 Share Posted August 29, 2024 35 minutes ago, Captain Bill Burt said: If a shooter tells me they have a foot problem their word is good enough for me. If they're willing to lie to gain an advantage then they have to live with that. It may be good enough for you...but what about everyone else? Here's a simple fact: Cowboy shooters can be liars and cheats...period! Phantom 1 hour ago, Three Foot Johnson said: If a shooter says they have "bad feet" and have to wear their Danners, what do you do? Make them bring a doctor's note? Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Idaho Gunslinger Posted August 30, 2024 Share Posted August 30, 2024 2 hours ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said: Why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted August 30, 2024 Share Posted August 30, 2024 7 minutes ago, Idaho Gunslinger said: ...perhaps...because folks will laugh at you behind your back...You WON'T be invited to the cool kids party either. Phantom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Idaho Gunslinger Posted August 30, 2024 Share Posted August 30, 2024 17 minutes ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said: ...perhaps...because folks will laugh at you behind your back...You WON'T be invited to the cool kids party either. Phantom Wait you mean I have a chance at being invited to the cool kids party?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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