Cholla Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 I was told by a well-known cowboy gunsmith that an older Uberti 73 is not made the same as a new 73, so parts will not interchange, and making it run smoothly and fast would cost a great deal more than I would want to spend. What is the dividing line between old and new, serial number-wise? How can a person know the difference without taking it apart? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
July Smith Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 (edited) I don't know dates exactly, but I am pretty sure if you have a Uberti 1866 or 73 that has a serial number beginning with a "W" it is considered a newer one. Edited July 2 by July Smith 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paradiddle Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 Is there merit to the claim that parts are different? Which parts have been changed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dilli GaHoot Galoot Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 From what I have read one of the easiest ways is to check the firing pin diameter, the old ones were 10 mm and the new ones are 8 mm. Simple test for this is to take an empty 38 or 357 case and if it will slip over the hammer side of the firing pin, it’s 8 mm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Barleycorn, SASS #76982 Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 The latest 73’s start with an H 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
largo casey #19191 Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 I have a 73 carbine that does not have the firing pin follower retracter Largo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dilli GaHoot Galoot Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 This list says it's for revolvers, but I believe they use the same code on rifles, look right in front of the lifter on the bottom of the receiver for two letters with a box around them https://www.sackpeterson.com/models/italdates.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tex Jones, SASS 2263 Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 It can be difficult to tell. I had an older model '66 that was easy to short stroke while a newer one (by a couple of years) wasn't. Can't remember the dates, but it was at least 15 years or so ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griff Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 (edited) As far as I know the firing pin extension retainer pin is the only difference. I have a '73 made in 1985 (ser # 508xx) and one from 2014 (ser # W568xx). The short stroke kits I bought both fit either model. The same short stroke kit also fits my 2007 Uberti 1860, (ser # 279xx). but I haven't checked its FPE pin to compare. I got the PGW "Super Short Stroke Kit". ISTR that the earlier bolt can be drilled to accept the new, larger diameter pin. Edited July 2 by Griff 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster Ron Wayne Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 None of it is really rocket science. It just takes a little more fitting of the new parts in a old rifle. The new rifles are more standardized and most parts will drop in and run . The old rifles the parts need to be fitted to your rifle . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Coffinmaker Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 I find that opening statement attributed to "A Well Know Cowboy Gunsmith" to be somewhat suspect. There have been some changes to the '73, none of which pertain to its geometry. The "older" Uberti toggle link rifles had the Firing Pin Extension Rod retained by a small cross pin, which was prone to fail at an Out Of Battery discharge. Uberti changed to a bit larger pin. Subsequently. Uberti dropped the cross pins and went to a retaining plate similar to the Retractor of a Winchester. Uberti DOES NOT support obsolete parts. The New Breach Block (Bolt) cannot be interchanged with the old one. It takes a "kit, including the Breach Block, the little rocker plate and a new Extension Rod. I am unfamiliar with a Change to the Firing Pin itself?? Uberti also changed the Cartridge Guide Tab to be replaceable in the new Breach Blocks. If you have a rifle built in the last 10 - 15 years, ALL of the After-Market Go Fast parts will work nicely. It ALWAYS take some judicious rubbin-n-buffin and a change of the springs. You will only run into a Hic-Up if an older Breach Block needs replaced. The old cross pin breach blocks are unavailable. It is possible to go back far enough to get into the really old guns with "short" Carrier Blocks and "short" Breach Blocks but we should be talking REALLY old guns. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griff Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Colorado Coffinmaker said: It is possible to go back far enough to get into the really old guns with "short" Carrier Blocks and "short" Breach Blocks but we should be talking REALLY old guns. CC, IIRC, that was only on the '66s, the '73 were always built to accept the .44-40. Yer right about the FPE retention method, None of mine have the new style, just the newest has the larger pin. . Edited July 2 by Griff 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abilene, SASS # 27489 Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 (edited) I recall some past posts from @Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 indicating that at some point the size of the groove in the bottom of the frame opening that the bolt rides in changed. So to fit a newer bolt in one of these older frames, that groove needs to be milled wider. Or something like that? Edited July 3 by Abilene, SASS # 27489 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 37 minutes ago, Abilene, SASS # 27489 said: I recall some past posts from @Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 indicating that at some point the size of the groove in the bottom of the frame opening that the bolt rides in changed. So to fit a newer bolt in one of these older frames, that groove needs to be milled wider. Or something like that? This was in a post about carriers. The newer bolts have wider guides on the bottom and this requires a carrier with a wider bottom slot. Old carriers need the groove to be milled wider to accept the newer bolts. Don't recall if I measured the groove in the frame but logic would dictate that also needs to be larger. 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boggus Deal #64218 Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 My guess is that they meant the ones imported by Navy Arms many years ago where there are some major differences. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cholla Posted July 3 Author Share Posted July 3 I believe this is what he was talking about: "The "older" Uberti toggle link rifles had the Firing Pin Extension Rod retained by a small cross pin, which was prone to fail at an Out Of Battery discharge. Uberti changed to a bit larger pin. Subsequently. Uberti dropped the cross pins and went to a retaining plate similar to the Retractor of a Winchester. Uberti DOES NOT support obsolete parts. " Both of my Uberti 73 rifles have that little cross pin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 Uberti only sells the new style retaining plate bolt parts. For the old guns the bolt, firing pin extension and retainer plate come as a kit. The old style cross pins are super simple to replace. Piano wire or a drill bit are as good as the original pins. Not an issue that would have anything to do with "making it run smoothly and fast would cost a great deal more than I would want to spend." He was more likely talking about the old Navy Arms 66s. They are different and there are no replacement parts. 73s were never made with the old 66 short style carrier. (And links and other parts.) At any rate without "him" being here to explain what he meant the guesses have been pretty well exhausted. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Rich Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 Hmmm. No one has mentioned the earlier 66's with the larger diameter firing pin extension. I know those are not made any longer. A new bolt can be fitted very easily with the smaller diameter hole. kR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snakebite Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 (edited) Well I've been tuning these guns since the early 90's. I use to do the old Cut, Bend and Weld method but stopped that when the aftermarket parts became available. IMO the differences don't make tuning up a new gun any different that an old one. If you need a new bolt and can't fix your old one, then yeah... you will have to buy the new bolt assembly. For the most part they are a drop in. I have a carrier from one of my early 66 38 special only rifles. As far as I know that was the only gun that was available as 38 special only. Still, no big deal. I think that my early Navy Arms 73 has had every set of after market toggles ever made put in it at some point, That included the 4th Gen kits. They all worked. the gun is still in use and set up with a 3rd gen C/I. Just a after thought comment. I did prefer some of the earlier after market toggles to some I've gotten more recently. Snakebite Edited July 3 by Snakebite Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT. ELI 35882 GUNFIGHTER Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 The old Navy Arms guns are completely different, and I have ran into a 66 that had some newer style parts, and older style parts. My main match 73 does not have the W in serial number, and I have used all factory and aftermarket parts for it with the exception of an aluminum carrier which was too tight in the window, and the lower tang is not interchangeable with W and newer H guns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Go West Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 I bought a new '73 at Winter Range years ago that broke the small cross pin the first day and stage of the match. A quick trip to Jim Bowie fixed it with a piece of piano wire and has worked ever since. He indicated the soft wire was more forgiving while the original was kinda brittle. Thank you Jim for your service to me and others. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimble Fingers SASS# 25439 Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 I have seen in other posts here that there are certain Navy Arms rifles even though made by Uberti, cannot use the newer Uberti rifle parts. I am sure that this will be elaborated on by people more knowledgeable than I as to the dates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster Ron Wayne Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 I have a old Navy Arms Uberti 66 . The rifle runs great . The only thing that is really different from my point of view is the shooter is a hell of a lot older then he used to be . And have parts fitted to him cost a hell of a lot more then the rifle ! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Coffinmaker Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 DISCLAMER!! I've been retired six or eight years now and can't really speak for the "newest" iterations. It is quite possible a change to the "new" replaceable cartridge guide tab Breach Block (bolt) may also require a new Carrier Block?? Pettifoggers Tin Types would indicate that may be the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimble Fingers SASS# 25439 Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 17 hours ago, Rooster Ron Wayne said: I have a old Navy Arms Uberti 66 . The rifle runs great . The only thing that is really different from my point of view is the shooter is a hell of a lot older then he used to be . And have parts fitted to him cost a hell of a lot more then the rifle ! Haven’t had any replaced yet, but had a few removed battling cancer. Did get some stints put in from a couple of heart attacks. I remembered a post a while ago that was saying your Navy has no replacement parts for it. If I am wrong my bad. Enjoy your 66, and that Remington you beat me out of! I had wanted it as a souvenir relating to my Great Grandfather being kidnapped y the James gang and taking a bullet out of Frank James! Have to keep looking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster Ron Wayne Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 2 hours ago, Nimble Fingers SASS# 25439 said: Haven’t had any replaced yet, but had a few removed battling cancer. Did get some stints put in from a couple of heart attacks. I remembered a post a while ago that was saying your Navy has no replacement parts for it. If I am wrong my bad. Enjoy your 66, and that Remington you beat me out of! I had wanted it as a souvenir relating to my Great Grandfather being kidnapped y the James gang and taking a bullet out of Frank James! Have to keep looking You are right there are No Drop in replacement parts for the older rifles. But that don't mean with a little elbow grease and some flat stones you can't make thing still work . Just Sayin. Sorry about the Remington. If I ever decide to let it go I will let you know . Don't be in a hurry they do come around. God bless. Rooster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimble Fingers SASS# 25439 Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 Thanks, I will, I believe I need a .44-40, saw Frank’s in a collection that Bill Koch had on exhibition once in West Palm Beach, but can’t remember for sure if it was a .44-40. You are right as well in doing an action job, I was talking about replacement parts. I don’t understand why your parts don’t match current Uberti parts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lassy LaRock Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 On 7/2/2024 at 7:36 PM, John Barleycorn, SASS #76982 said: The latest 73’s start with an H "H" is probably the newest series. All other serial numbers are older models. Here in Germany we hear about the same problems. Does anyone here have a rifle from the "H" series that has a "race-ready" tuning and can report on it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 8 hours ago, Lassy LaRock said: "H" is probably the newest series. All other serial numbers are older models. Here in Germany we hear about the same problems. Does anyone here have a rifle from the "H" series that has a "race-ready" tuning and can report on it? Lassy shoot Shotgun Boogie an email. His website is https://sbgwllc.com He had Uberti run off a batch of rifles with all of his speed parts installed in them. They are easily recognizable as they have gold plated hammers, triggers and loading gates. Several local shooters are using guns from this special batch. Some of his parts on his website are labelled for "W" and "H" series guns only. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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