Johnny D Nitro Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 I’ve been shooting in SASS for about a year now, and I’m considering shooting bp occasionally. I used to use American Pioneer Powder or their Shockey’s Gold fffg in my muzzleloader, so I’m familiar with those products. But, it’s been years since I’ve shot anything bp and I’ve never loaded bp cartridges. Anyone using their stuff in 38 spl? Thoughts? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bingo Montana Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 (edited) Yes! I use APP 3FG purchased from @Scarlett Bullets by Scarlett in 38 and 12 gauge with great success. For 38 SPL, 1.0 cc any Hi-Tek coated bullet weight also purchased from Scarlett. Edited June 25 by Bingo Montana 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beartrap SASS#57175 Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 Do it. You'll like it. 38's do not need any filler, just load to base of bullet. Use 3f for them. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Coffinmaker Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 Real simple formula or recipe for APP in Suppositories (Cartridges). APP to the base of the bullet as seated in the case. No compression and Crimp. If you wish to reduce a charge, just fill the Air Space with Cream-0-Wheat. 38 Spl doesn't need to be reduced. The recipe is the same regardless of bullet selected. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 Most BP shooters are loading APP these days. Use the same bullets you load with smokeless powder - no special BP lube needed. Wash brass after firing as APP residue will tarnish brass. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 Johnny D Nitro! I’m so glad you’re gonna come to the dark side! It’s the most fun! I load APP in my 38 spl and 32 HR Mag cases. 38 special is about 10gr by WEIGHT case is 3/4 full. I don’t use filler. It’s a time thing. In my 32 HR cases I think it’s about 9gr - the case is virtually full. In my shotshells I load 38-40gr BY WEIGHT and an ounce of shot. Big Iron Bohannon, Keelhaul, and Ya Big Tree can help you!! If I can help you in anyway, just ask! Bulletsbyscarlett@gmail.com HUGS! See you in August! Scarlett 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafe Conager SASS #56958 Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 (edited) I use app in my 38s and my 45 colt &Schofield, easy load, powder to the base of bullet, does not require special lube like real black powder, easy clean up. Lots of smoke and boom come on over to the dark side we have cookies. Rafe Edited July 11 by Rafe Conager SASS #56958 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny D Nitro Posted June 25 Author Share Posted June 25 3 hours ago, Scarlett said: Johnny D Nitro! I’m so glad you’re gonna come to the dark side! It’s the most fun! I load APP in my 38 spl and 32 HR Mag cases. 38 special is about 10gr by WEIGHT case is 3/4 full. I don’t use filler. It’s a time thing. In my 32 HR cases I think it’s about 9gr - the case is virtually full. In my shotshells I load 38-40gr BY WEIGHT and an ounce of shot. Big Iron Bohannon, Keelhaul, and Ya Big Tree can help you!! If I can help you in anyway, just ask! Bulletsbyscarlett@gmail.com HUGS! See you in August! Scarlett Scarlett, I said “considering” and “occasionally”. I’m not going full dark side just yet. I still have much to learn and improve upon in my game as is. Still, it’s fun to shake things up once in a while. Thanks for the info. See ya soon. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 JN, you have the International Blackpowder Championship coming up near the end of August. Buy a couple bottles of APP, Shooters World BP or even Triple Seven and join the fun. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedalia Dave Posted June 26 Share Posted June 26 @Johnny D Nitro Come over to the Dark Side, We have Cookies. 5 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted June 26 Share Posted June 26 4 hours ago, Johnny D Nitro said: Scarlett, I said “considering” and “occasionally”. I’m not going full dark side just yet. I still have much to learn and improve upon in my game as is. Still, it’s fun to shake things up once in a while. Thanks for the info. See ya soon. I read “considering” and occasionally”. I am just confident that I’ll see you on the Dark Side more and more. No pressure, though. Hugs! Scarlett 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny D Nitro Posted June 26 Author Share Posted June 26 12 hours ago, Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 said: JN, you have the International Blackpowder Championship coming up near the end of August. Buy a couple bottles of APP, Shooters World BP or even Triple Seven and join the fun. That’s exactly what I’m looking at. Two extra days of guns in the sun. I can clean guns for that. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister Badly Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 On 6/25/2024 at 1:13 PM, Scarlett said: Johnny D Nitro! I’m so glad you’re gonna come to the dark side! It’s the most fun! I load APP in my 38 spl and 32 HR Mag cases. 38 special is about 10gr by WEIGHT case is 3/4 full. I don’t use filler. It’s a time thing. In my 32 HR cases I think it’s about 9gr - the case is virtually full. In my shotshells I load 38-40gr BY WEIGHT and an ounce of shot. Big Iron Bohannon, Keelhaul, and Ya Big Tree can help you!! If I can help you in anyway, just ask! Bulletsbyscarlett@gmail.com HUGS! See you in August! Scarlett I just finished loading my cartridges for Black Gold. 17.7 gr of APP by weight in 357 cases. I'll try to get a stage video. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boggus Deal #64218 Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 While you don’t “need” to reduce .38 Spl loads, you absolutely don’t need to waste a case full of powder just to make a target go ding. A little filler saves a lot of powder and even as good a deal as @Scarlett sells powder, why use more than you have to? A 3/8” piece of this on top of the powder works wonders. https://www.homedepot.com/p/Frost-King-0-375-in-x-20-in-Grey-Poly-Foam-Tape-Weatherstrip-Caulk-Saver-C21H/100067266 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedalia Dave Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 7 hours ago, Boggus Deal #64218 said: While you don’t “need” to reduce .38 Spl loads, you absolutely don’t need to waste a case full of powder just to make a target go ding. A little filler saves a lot of powder and even as good a deal as @Scarlett sells powder, why use more than you have to? A 3/8” piece of this on top of the powder works wonders. https://www.homedepot.com/p/Frost-King-0-375-in-x-20-in-Grey-Poly-Foam-Tape-Weatherstrip-Caulk-Saver-C21H/100067266 My experience with 38 loads is that while you can use filler the rewards is not worth it. Besides the extra time, 38s with filler will have excessive blowby and cause more problems than the small amount of powder you save is worth. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boggus Deal #64218 Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 26 minutes ago, Sedalia Dave said: My experience with 38 loads is that while you can use filler the rewards is not worth it. Besides the extra time, 38s with filler will have excessive blowby and cause more problems than the small amount of powder you save is worth. That wasn’t Lady Jane’s experience. No real extra time, nearly double the rounds loaded, no blow by and guns stay clean. Three category wins at EOT, four at Winter Range speak for themselves. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abilene, SASS # 27489 Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 1 hour ago, Sedalia Dave said: My experience with 38 loads is that while you can use filler the rewards is not worth it. Besides the extra time, 38s with filler will have excessive blowby and cause more problems than the small amount of powder you save is worth. I can see downloading larger caliber BP rounds. Downloading .38's is for wimps and does not fit the original spirit of the category. IMO, of course. People will do what they want, and that's why it was necessary to create the smoke standard. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister Badly Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 (edited) I don't shoot BP all the time. Usually just a couple of stages at our monthly matches. I've been using full loads of APP in 38 cases and get plenty of smoke. Especially with my 24" rifle from the hip I have to rely on memory.This video is with the 38 loads. Thought I'd kick it up a notch shooting Outlaw at Black Gold with full loads in some nickel 357 cases I acquired. Don't look for my name in the top half of the results. Lol. Edited July 8 by Mister Badly 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erasmus Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 I'm also on the 1.0cc of APP or Shooters World under a 125 coated RNFP train. That said, I'll also load 1.0cc of Goex under a 158 RN in pistols just to say I'm shooting real black (I'm primarily a cap and ball shooter anyway). Reloading with APP is cleaner and faster, but real black is cheaper. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyesa Horg Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 1 hour ago, Erasmus said: real black is cheaper. And smells better 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ORNERY OAF Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 Only way to go is a full load of the "Holy Black"! Keep the creme-o-wheat for breakfast 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 This is me shooting APP & SW Multi Black (shotgun). 115gr bullet & 32 HR Mag revolvers and 125gr 38spl in rifle. I make good smoke and have the most fun. As for any smell… I put powdered incense in about 1/3 of my shotshells. Makes it fun for the posse when shooting under cover. It’s especially fun when shooting in high humidity or rain. I know some of you aren’t on board with the substitutes. I can store APP, travel with APP, and sell APP without a gazillion papers to fill out and report. I only sell items I use myself - except for the smokeless powders other Clean Shot - so the holy black out. Hugs! IMG_1216.mov 6 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister Badly Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 APP in 38 cases makes plenty of smoke for sure. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bingo Montana Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 (edited) There is no doubt that APP in 38 SPL makes good smoke. 20240707 CC Stage 1 Bingo Vision Short.mp4 Edited July 8 by Bingo Montana 4 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted July 11 Share Posted July 11 On 7/8/2024 at 4:05 PM, Bingo Montana said: There is no doubt that APP in 38 SPL makes good smoke. 20240707 CC Stage 1 Bingo Vision Short.mp4 91.57 MB · 0 downloads Um. Im pretty sure there were targets down range when you started shooting but they disappeared! AWESOME video!! I love this game and Frontier Cartridge Gunfighter!! HUGS! Scarlett 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bingo Montana Posted July 11 Share Posted July 11 10 hours ago, Scarlett said: Um. Im pretty sure there were targets down range when you started shooting but they disappeared! AWESOME video!! I love this game and Frontier Cartridge Gunfighter!! HUGS! Scarlett @Scarlett almost as good as we had it at the 2023 NC State match when the sun came up over the berm in the morning! That was awesome!!!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucky R. K. Posted July 12 Share Posted July 12 On 7/11/2024 at 9:31 AM, Bingo Montana said: @Scarlett almost as good as we had it at the 2023 NC State match when the sun came up over the berm in the morning! That was awesome!!!!! I saw this once at the NC State match. Fontana Vic was the first to shoot that morning with the sun coming up directly in his face. When he was finished shooting the berm was completely hidden by the smoke, you couldn't see Vic. I have a picture somewhere that I will post if I can find it. BP shooters have to work harder at the sport, but they also have much more fun. Lucky 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I. M. Crossdraw, SASS# 8321 Posted July 13 Share Posted July 13 (edited) With Subs, just load them up, about 1 cc of subs and leave space to seat bullet, none to very little compression is needed. No special BP lubed bullets needed. Smoke. I started on subs then graduated to real BP. Loading with real BP; BP lubed bullets, grease cookies or greased wads with mild to moderate powder compression are necessary. I shoot 38s with BP lubed bullets. Fire and smoke. Edited July 13 by I. M. Crossdraw, SASS# 8321 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watab kid Posted July 13 Share Posted July 13 i bought some from scarlett , although i dont shoot black in maytches i do as a range fun time , i recently got a small cannon from a family member , think ill be buyong more ...............now to get some fuse material , Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister Badly Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 Well, I didn't get any videos running those full 357 cases but I got to see how they worked at our local match yesterday. Stage one with the early morning sun behind the targets and no breeze at all was pretty much a whiteout. The other four stages weren't much better. I think I'll pick and choose stages at my local match to use the remainder of those loads. It's hard enough hitting targets without aiming. Not seeing them makes it a bit more difficult. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Maverick Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 17 minutes ago, Mister Badly said: Well, I didn't get any videos running those full 357 cases but I got to see how they worked at our local match yesterday. Stage one with the early morning sun behind the targets and no breeze at all was pretty much a whiteout. The other four stages weren't much better. I think I'll pick and choose stages at my local match to use the remainder of those loads. It's hard enough hitting targets without aiming. Not seeing them makes it a bit more difficult. yeah, but the spotters can't see any misses either. LOL TM 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 1 hour ago, Texas Maverick said: yeah, but the spotters can't see any misses either. LOL TM Experienced spotters stand well off to the side of the shooter and can see obscured targets. 1 hour ago, Mister Badly said: Well, I didn't get any videos running those full 357 cases but I got to see how they worked at our local match yesterday. Stage one with the early morning sun behind the targets and no breeze at all was pretty much a whiteout. The other four stages weren't much better. I think I'll pick and choose stages at my local match to use the remainder of those loads. It's hard enough hitting targets without aiming. Not seeing them makes it a bit more difficult. There are ways to shoot and hit and arrays of obscured targets all of the same height. Start by aiming at the middle of the first target. Maintain that elevation and swing to the next target lining up with the target stand. This will usually get a hit on a large target. However, small targets like plate racks require a sight picture. Also, when allowed I shoot downwind to upwind and bottom to top so I'm not shooting into my smoke cloud. Smokeless shooters often prefer shooting right to left. I shoot downwind to upwind. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedalia Dave Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 2 hours ago, Mister Badly said: Not seeing them makes it a bit more difficult. But it is a lot more fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Maverick Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 3 minutes ago, Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 said: Experienced spotters stand well off to the side of the shooter and can see obscured targets. We all do this when it is possible but some stages you can hardly even see the targets for smokeless shooters. I have always said that whomever designs the stages should also work with someone that has experience at spotting so they make room for spotters to do their job. TM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 3 minutes ago, Texas Maverick said: We all do this when it is possible but some stages you can hardly even see the targets for smokeless shooters. I have always said that whomever designs the stages should also work with someone that has experience at spotting so they make room for spotters to do their job. TM Pretty props look great and make for nice photos. However, open stages with few obstructions make for the easiest spotting. I think of the cemetery and mine stages at the 4-Corners Regional. They also allow for better dispersion of BP smoke clouds. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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