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Lady in OPEN Category?


Scarlett

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I shoot Lady Frontier Cartridge Gunfighter. It’s my  category. It’s what I LOVE shooting.  It’s also a category that doesn’t meet the minimum at a lot of places. It’s not a “choose your category wisely” situation for me.  
 

Here’s my question. Would it be acceptable for me to shoot FCGF in the OPEN category?

 

Be honest.
 

I know I can shoot LGF and shoot BP. I know I can shoot LGF and shoot smokeless. But neither of those are my category. 

 

Thoughtful replies appreciated. 
 

Hugs!

Scarlett

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43 minutes ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

There are no male only categories in SASS, so yes you can shoot FCGF.

Capt Bill beat me to it.  Yes, you can shoot FCGF (now I’m in for it).  On the other hand, I can’t shoot LFCGF.

 

On first reading I was a little unclear on how you phrased the question.  To me “Open” means the “Open Age Categories” Cowboy/Cowgirl.  A cowgirl can shoot Cowboy!

 

It is not unusual in Wild Bunch matches to see registration forms, scoresheets and even awards with the category “Men’s Modern”.  There is no such thing.

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I hate the term “choose your catagory wisely”. Many shooters like shooting a certain style, be it BW, CC, GF or whatever.  I know a lady gunfighter who just likes to shoot GF. She, or anyone who shoots in a smaller category are taking on all comers in that category. When an MC makes the comment “choose your category wisely” it cheapens their accomplishment. The lady I know works hard to be the best she can be in her chosen category. 

 

In answer to your OP, yes shoot open if you want. Beat a few (or all!)of the men!

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47 minutes ago, Hoss said:

I hate the term “choose your catagory wisely”. Many shooters like shooting a certain style, be it BW, CC, GF or whatever.  I know a lady gunfighter who just likes to shoot GF. She, or anyone who shoots in a smaller category are taking on all comers in that category. When an MC makes the comment “choose your category wisely” it cheapens their accomplishment. The lady I know works hard to be the best she can be in her chosen category. 

 

In answer to your OP, yes shoot open if you want. Beat a few (or all!)of the men!

Thank you, Hoss. You answered the question  I was trying to ask - I know I CAN shoot in an Open category, I guess I was wanting to know if there would be any resentment… 

 

We’ll see how the matches I’ve registered for go… stay tuned  :)  

 

Hugs, 

 

Scarlett

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You go girl! 

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Shoot whatever you want!

 

This sport is one of few that I feel is more for the enjoyment of the sport than the competition (and I am very very competitive at other things).

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15 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

Thank you, Hoss. You answered the question  I was trying to ask - I know I CAN shoot in an Open category, I guess I was wanting to know if there would be any resentment… 

 

We’ll see how the matches I’ve registered for go… stay tuned  :)  

 

Hugs, 

 

Scarlett

There is always a chance of resentment from some of those who get beat and it doesn’t matter who beats them. They’ll get over it or they won’t last long in our sport.  Shoot what you like and enjoy!

 

Randy

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I’m thinking 99.9% of male shooters wouldn’t mind having you or any other lady shooter competing in their category, I sure wouldn’t have any Ill feelings or resentment over it. 

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Howdy Scarlett,

 

We've never met, so first let me thank you for your support of the CT Valley Bushwackers. I believe that you'ed be welcome to shoot any category you want. You should go ahead and do it if you enjoy that style of shooting. I shoot Classic Cowboy. I know that I'll always be well below the top shooters, but I grew up with Hoppy, Gene, Roy and a bunch of other movie cowboys and they always shot Classic style. That's how I want to shoot. Often I'm the only shooter in the category but I enjoy myself and if I get lumped into Duelist, that's OK, too.

 

Shoot how you want and enjoy yourself,

 

Rev. Chase

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5 hours ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

There are no male only categories in SASS, so yes you can shoot FCGF.

 

I thought Buckaroo is a male only category....... :D

 

..........Widder

 

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Hi Scarlett, 

By "open" do you mean cowgirl/cowboy and shooting FCGF?  

Age based allow for any style shooting, except gunfighter.  SHB 26.6 Page 5

"AGE BASED CATEGORIES Age based categories are offered to allow all participants to compete amongst their peers. Age based categories carry the following guidelines:

- May use any main match revolver.

- Revolvers may be shot in any SASS legal shooting style – EXCEPT Gunfighter.

- May use any SASS legal main match shotgun and any legal main match rifle.

- May use any SASS legal ammunition.

 

So you could shoot FCGF in Gunfighter, or B Western.  

Now FCD could be shot in any category 

 

And as I have shot against a few women shooting in the open categories, I am used to being beaten by them :-) 

 

 

 

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11 hours ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

There are no male only categories in SASS, so yes you can shoot FCGF.

Well there’s Classic Cowboy and then Classic Cowgirl. There’s BWwestern and Ladies BWestern. There’s also age based categories that are men and then the ladies version. 

 

- Wrangler/Lady Wrangler: Age 36 and up. - Forty-Niner/Lady Forty-Niner: Age 49 and up. - Senior/Lady Senior: Age 60 and up. - Silver Senior/Lady Silver Senior: Age 65 and up. - Elder Statesman/Grand Dame: Age 70 and up. - Cattle Baron/Cattle Baroness: Age 75 and up. - El Patron/La Patrona: Age 80 and up. - El Rey/La Reina: Age 85 and up.

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I am thinking I might need to change categories to FCGF so if there are only 3 of us I might get a picture with the lovely Scarlett. Assuming I could maintain 3rd place out of 3.

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11 hours ago, Scarlett said:

I shoot Lady Frontier Cartridge Gunfighter. It’s my  category. It’s what I LOVE shooting.  It’s also a category that doesn’t meet the minimum at a lot of places. It’s not a “choose your category wisely” situation for me.  
 

Here’s my question. Would it be acceptable for me to shoot FCGF in the OPEN category?

 

Be honest.
 

I know I can shoot LGF and shoot BP. I know I can shoot LGF and shoot smokeless. But neither of those are my category. 

 

Thoughtful replies appreciated. 
 

Hugs!

Scarlett

Heck yea!!! Why not? We've had ladies at our local matches that signed up for categories that are neither male or female because they wanted some competition! I applaud you!B)

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2 hours ago, Rye Miles #13621 said:

Well there’s Classic Cowboy and then Classic Cowgirl. There’s BWwestern and Ladies BWestern. There’s also age based categories that are men and then the ladies version. 

 

- Wrangler/Lady Wrangler: Age 36 and up. - Forty-Niner/Lady Forty-Niner: Age 49 and up. - Senior/Lady Senior: Age 60 and up. - Silver Senior/Lady Silver Senior: Age 65 and up. - Elder Statesman/Grand Dame: Age 70 and up. - Cattle Baron/Cattle Baroness: Age 75 and up. - El Patron/La Patrona: Age 80 and up. - El Rey/La Reina: Age 85 and up.

This is from page 5 of the current Shooters Handbook;

 

SECTION 2 – SHOOTING CATEGORIES

 

SASS recognizes shooting categories based upon age, gender, costuming, equipment, shooting style, and/or propellant. The age for a competitor is determined by their age on the first day the match starts. All SASS categories are open gender categories (there are no men’s categories).

 

Thanks

Randy

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2 hours ago, Tn Tombstone said:

I am thinking I might need to change categories to FCGF so if there are only 3 of us I might get a picture with the lovely Scarlett. Assuming I could maintain 3rd place out of 3.

You sweet thing! You know I’ll take my picture with you anytime! :wub:
 

Hugs!

Scarlett

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2 things, my opinion is match directors should offer all base categories. No matter how many enter it. Scarlett you shoot ldyfcgf all the time and there is only one national championship,  it should be offered. If you came to ohio state I would have that category for you,   Now all the extra categories, have a minimum if you want……..and we do as well.  3 minimum to offer “ silver sr duelest” or whatever age break you want to add to a style or costume category….    Second the phrase “ choose your catagory wisely” to me refers to shooters who jump  around in category depending on who else might be attending. Ie: changing so they can place higher. And yes there are shooters who do that, to the point many matches now have a cut off date for any further changes.    I hope they offer the category for you,     Just my $.02 worth 

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2 hours ago, Rye Miles #13621 said:

Heck yea!!! Why not? We've had ladies at our local matches that signed up for categories that are neither male or female because they wanted some competition! I applaud you!B)

 

I agree 1000%. First in category doesn't mean much when you are the only person in the category. I am much prouder of some 2nd and 3rd place awards because of who I was shooting against than I am of 1st place awards where I had no competition.

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12 hours ago, Scarlett said:

Thank you, Hoss. You answered the question  I was trying to ask - I know I CAN shoot in an Open category, I guess I was wanting to know if there would be any resentment… 

 

We’ll see how the matches I’ve registered for go… stay tuned  :)  

 

Hugs, 

 

Scarlett

Go for it, they need some competition. I don't know of any cowboys that would have any resentment but I guess there could be some but that isn't the cowboy way and I wouldn't worry about it.

 

TM

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14 hours ago, Scarlett said:

I shoot Lady Frontier Cartridge Gunfighter. It’s my  category. It’s what I LOVE shooting.  It’s also a category that doesn’t meet the minimum at a lot of places. It’s not a “choose your category wisely” situation for me.  
 

Here’s my question. Would it be acceptable for me to shoot FCGF in the OPEN category?

 

Be honest.
 

I know I can shoot LGF and shoot BP. I know I can shoot LGF and shoot smokeless. But neither of those are my category. 

 

Thoughtful replies appreciated. 
 

Hugs!

Scarlett

 

Scarlett,

 

First, it was always my opinion that all of the SASS Base Categories should be offered at EVERY match, regardless of the number signed up.  There are only 38 of those as shown in the attached chart.  Of course, that is just my take on the situation.  The problems all start when folks start to apply the age breaks to the shooting style categories creating a possible 124 additional sub-categories.

 

My wife who shoots LFCD runs into that problem a lot as well, but has managed to just squeak by and I seem to recall that she only had to bump to LD at one match.  She would have shot LFC, but they didn't have enough for even that category.

 

I have had it happen to me at a match as well when this determination of a minimum number of shooters for a category issue became a big issue.  I signed up for FCGF, was told there weren't enough so I agreed to bump to GF.  Then I was later told that there weren't enough GF either, but I could move to B-Western!  I didn't have the clothes, didn't have the right rifle, etc, it is just wasn't MY Category.  I finally just asked to be left in FCGF, that they didn't need to give me an award, they didn't even need to say anything, just let me shoot MY Category and enjoy the match, that's all I was there for anyway.  They agreed, and everyone was happy!

 

Folks spend a lot of time and effort to find "Their Category" and they just want to be able to shoot it at all of the matches they attend.  As long as all of the Base Categories are offered, there is a space for everyone to shoot "Their Category", just not necessarily the age defined sub-category.  While it is ultimately at the discretion of the Match Director, if you look at the SASS Handbook, the way I read it, that is the case.  The limits only apply to the categories ABOVE the Base categories (i.e. age breaks)...

 

SASS Handbook, Version 26.2, 01 Jan 2023

 

MINIMUM ENTRANT CATEGORY MANDATES

In the interest of ensuring and promoting a true competitive environment at the SASS Sanctioned Championship level of competition (State, Regional, National, and World Championships),
all possible category breakdowns may be offered, however, categories above the base categories will only be honored if they meet the minimum entry mandates decreed by SASS and the Championship agreements.   Ladies’ categories must have a minimum of three entrants and open categories must have a minimum of seven entrants in order to be honored at the SASS Championship level.

 

 

All that being said, if your only option for shooting FCGF is to either shoot in the Open FCGF category, then by all means DO IT!  As a fellow FCGF shooter, I would welcome the opportunity to get my posterior handed to me by such a fine person such as yourself.  :P  Bring It On and let the wailing begin!   :lol:

 

Hope to see you at the Ides!

 

Dogmeat Dad & Holli Docaday (Lil Feathers New Alias)

 

 

SASS Official Category Matrix 26_2.pdf

 

 

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3 hours ago, Tn Tombstone said:

I am thinking I might need to change categories to FCGF so if there are only 3 of us I might get a picture with the lovely Scarlett. Assuming I could maintain 3rd place out of 3.

 

Been there, done that, got 4th out of 3... B):lol:

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I finished 1st in WRANGLER (out of two) at an annual competition and it didn't meet the "minimums" because the majority of the people there were competing in "Senior" categories. Don't really care, but out of principle there should always be awards for the BASE categories. Not so sure about the Lady award for ages 120-124 that shoots Frontier cartridges in a double duelist fashion with an outlaw shooting stance, but she probably should to just for showing up.

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1 hour ago, Randy Saint Eagle, SASS # 64903 said:

This is from page 5 of the current Shooters Handbook;

 

SECTION 2 – SHOOTING CATEGORIES

 

SASS recognizes shooting categories based upon age, gender, costuming, equipment, shooting style, and/or propellant. The age for a competitor is determined by their age on the first day the match starts. All SASS categories are open gender categories (there are no men’s categories).

 

Thanks

Randy

SASS says all categories recognizes age, gender etc but then it says all SASS categories are open gender categories. So a man can shoot in Lady Gunfigter etc? Hmm kinda sounds weird to me. 

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16 minutes ago, Rye Miles #13621 said:

So a man can shoot in Lady Gunfigter etc? Hmm kinda sounds weird to me. 

 

This has already created a bit of a controversy at major Matches.

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1 minute ago, Itchy Trigger said:

 

This has already created a bit of a controversy at major Matches.

I think the wording needs to be edited! All SASS categories are open gender categories really needs to be looked at!

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1 minute ago, Reverend P. Babcock Chase said:

Howdy Again,

 

Things are simpler now. You can use any bathroom or SASS category based on the gender you "identify" as. 

 

Rev. Chase

I'm afraid this is what it's become!:wacko:

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1 hour ago, Dogmeat Dad, SASS #48563L said:

 

I'm totally confused by the term "open category".   I've never heard it mentioned by anyone.   Is that a category where any age can shoot any style?   Does this mean a gunfighter can move over to an age-based category and shoot it Gunfighter-style?   

 

:huh:

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31 minutes ago, Rye Miles #13621 said:

So a man can shoot in Lady Gunfigter etc? Hmm kinda sounds weird to me. 

 

Only if they pass the required "Equipment Check".  As I have been told, wearing a Kilt will expedite the process....:rolleyes:

 

56483733_4daf2f11ce_b.jpg

 

 

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Just now, Crusty Knees said:

 

I'm totally confused by the term "open category".   I've never heard it mentioned by anyone.   Is that a category where any age can shoot any style?   Does this mean a gunfighter can move over to an age-based category and shoot it Gunfighter-style?   

 

:huh:

 

 

The term "Open Category" has been around since the beginning (or at least as long as I have been involved, about the year 2000).  It refers to the fact that Women have the option to shoot in either the "Ladies" specific categories or they can choose to shoot in what is typically called the "Men's" categories, hence they are "Open" to either Men or Women.

 

We have a very good female shooter in the North East, Appaloosa Amy, that always shot in the "Open" category at the Mason Dixon Stampede back when it was the North East Regional, and I am sure there are others that I am not aware of as well.

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