Safe locks? Dial vs electronic

[Dantankerous]

I've been looking at new gun safes of late and around my area pretty much all the retailers are selling gun safes with the electronic keypad combination lock instead of the old S&G dial that I prefer. In fact I have not seen one safe with the dial lock lately.

 

Any of you have any trouble with these new keypad locks ever? I read horror stories on the net, of course, and I can see more potential for a keypad lock failure than the tried and true dial lock.

 

Most of the retailers around here sell Liberty safes, all lines of them. Cabela's has their own plus some Brownings. Not sure if the keypad locks are of different manufacturers or not between the different brands of safes.

 

I am just not sure if I trust these keypad locks...

[Cold Lake Kid, SASS # 51474]

I had two Costco gun safes with digital key pads and had major trouble with both locking and then refusing to unlock.

I now use a steel cabinet with two hasps and lock on it, inside a locked and monitored and alarmed purpose built room, inside my alarmed and monitored home.

BUT, I'm in gun unfriendly Canada where legal registered gun owners are the villains and gang-banger, thieves and thugs get a pass.

(No kidding! The same act that made it tougher on gun owners, REDUCED prison time for criminals! You can't make this $..T up.)

[Cypress Sun]

32 minutes ago, Dantankerous said:

I've been looking at new gun safes of late and around my area pretty much all the retailers are selling gun safes with the electronic keypad combination lock instead of the old S&G dial that I prefer. In fact I have not seen one safe with the dial lock lately.

 

Any of you have any trouble with these new keypad locks ever? I read horror stories on the net, of course, and I can see more potential for a keypad lock failure than the tried and true dial lock.

 

Most of the retailers around here sell Liberty safes, all lines of them. Cabela's has their own plus some Brownings. Not sure if the keypad locks are of different manufacturers or not between the different brands of safes.

 

I am just not sure if I trust these keypad locks...

 

I have heard some very "unkind" comments about the electronic locks/keypads. I would not buy one...I'd keep looking.

[Horace Patootie, SASS #35798]

I bought a SnapSafe.  They are delivered unassembled on a pallet. It's a double door safe, but they have all sizes. It has a electronic keypad but you have keys also to open it if the electronic fails.

Horace

[Tex Jones, SASS 2263]

I purchased a Liberty safe from a dealer here in MN, with a dial lock.  Easy enough as it was on the display floor.  I looked at the dealer's web site just now and each model has the option of a dial lock or an electronic one.  Apparently that option can be ordered.  Couldn't you order one from a dealer?

[Rip Snorter]

I stuck with dial on all safes I had, except a bedside one when we had young kids and their friends in the house.  That had the touch pad, but also a key which would open it in an emergency.  Though it may take a locksmith, I believe name brand safes can be converted either way.

[Sedalia Dave]

Instead of the big box stores visit a local safe co. I got a better safe for a lot less money. They gladly swapped out the electronic lock for a S&G dial lock at no charge. When they delivered it the locksmith had me dial in my own combination. All he did was turn the special key to allow setting the new combination so he has no clue what the combo is.

 

There are good electronic locks out there but they are pricey and even then they can fail. Dial locks also fail but all the ones I have seen fail were decades old. 

[Caladisi kid]

I own key and electronic entry types and my main one has an electronic lock that requires a 9 volt to operate. It is much more convenient to access. I have had this one for 3 years now, no problem.  If the lock fails it can be removed and a separate special key can be used to open the door.   One other thing, do NOT buy cheap!!!

My 2 bits from the saddle.  

[Marshal Dan Troop 70448]

Added an Electronic locked safe after my needs called for it along with my manual dial safe. We came back from a vacation and had problems getting it to open. This occurred several times but with a guarantee and several phone calls and them sending out a service man, I was able to trade it even up for a slightly bigger safe with free pickup and delivery of a new manual one. i'll never consider an electronic safe again.

As to failure and then using a key, just makes it easier for someone to break in my thought.

[Pat Riot]

 I do not trust electronic locks or pretty much anything electronic. 
 

I would try the suggestion of @Sedalia Dave

 

Tractor Supply carries Liberty safes with mechanical locks.

 

Here’s a safe company in Kansas. Maybe they can help. 
http://www.midwestgunsafes.com/

[Sedalia Dave]

My two cents.

 

Ignore fire ratings. There is no standard so the numbers are meaningless.

Ignore door thickness. For the vast majority of bargain priced safes, most of the door is air,

Get the thickest possible metal you can afford for the top and sides.

Make sure there are plenty of locking bolts on all 4 sides of the door. The hinge side of the door can have either live or dead locking bolts. 

Inspect the gap around the door. make sure it is narrow enough to prevent a prybar being inserted.

Bolt the safe to the floor in ALL 4 corners. Bolt top to wall studs if at all possible.

If at all possible locate a safe in an area that restricts access to the sides and top. After you watch the video below you'll see why.

 

Below is a video of a typical gun safe being opened after it has been in a fire.

 

 

 

[Rip Snorter]

It is one thing in town, where FD response time is good.  Quite another in a Wildfire where resources, even if very good are spread thin and structure burn time may be long.  Another thing to note, any powerful cartridge, if chambered will blow a hole in the safe when it cooks off.  Saw several such.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

Group 2 mechanical with dial lock.

That's a commercial grade lock.

[T.K.]

I have a Canon brand Armory model gun safe and it has both digital and a Sergeant & Greenleaf dial.

The digital is handy for quick entry.

[Eyesa Horg]

Mine has the S&G dial with a key to unlock the dial. The bad part is that it's real easy to just lock the key and not bother with spinning the dial. Find I do this more than I should. The dial need to be moved clockwise about 10 numbers to open, but just brought back to 0 to lock the key which keeps the dial from turning.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

2 hours ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

 I do not trust electronic locks or pretty much anything electronic. 
 

I would try the suggestion of @Sedalia Dave

 

Tractor Supply carries Liberty safes with mechanical locks.

 

Here’s a safe company in Kansas. Maybe they can help. 
http://www.midwestgunsafes.com/

https://sargentandgreenleaf.com/product/6600-series/

[Rip Snorter]

Just now, Eyesa Horg said:

Mine has the S&G dial with a key to unlock the dial. The bad part is that it's real easy to just lock the key and not bother with spinning the dial. Find I do this more than I should. The dial need to be moved clockwise about 10 numbers to open, but just brought back to 0 to lock the key which keeps the dial from turning.

When home, I use the key in case I need rapid access, when I leave I use both.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

1 minute ago, Eyesa Horg said:

Mine has the S&G dial with a key to unlock the dial. The bad part is that it's real easy to just lock the key and not bother with spinning the dial. Find I do this more than I should. The dial need to be moved clockwise about 10 numbers to open, but just brought back to 0 to lock the key which keeps the dial from turning.

Just spin the dial counterclockwise at least one quick turn or more.

[Eyesa Horg]

3 minutes ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

Just spin the dial counterclockwise at least one quick turn or more.

I know, I just get lazy when I'm home and going in and out of on a regular basis. The issue is with my own laziness. If it didn't have the key feature, I'd be more apt to spin the dial to lock it. If we go away, I always do and then spend a few tries to get back in.. But I'd be nervous of an electronic lock. That Murphy guy ya know!

[Pat Riot]

15 minutes ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

https://sargentandgreenleaf.com/product/6600-series/

Uh…okay

[Utah Bob #35998]

I don't trust anything electronic. Including The Saloon.

[J.D. Daily]

3 hours ago, Eyesa Horg said:

Mine has the S&G dial with a key to unlock the dial. The bad part is that it's real easy to just lock the key and not bother with spinning the dial. Find I do this more than I should. The dial need to be moved clockwise about 10 numbers to open, but just brought back to 0 to lock the key which keeps the dial from turning.

I was told when a bought my Liberty safe with S & G mechanical lock that the key was only for "Day Use".  I.e. unlock safe in morning & use key during the day the lock using the dial at end of day use.  I can't remember ever using the key locking feature.

[Three Foot Johnson]

I have two with electronic keypads and three with dials. I've had the keypad locks for 25 years anyway, and never a hitch, nor do I personally know anyone who's ever had one fail - it's always the guy down the street, or the neighbor's tax preparer's uncle's former wife's new husband's step kid's best friend's father or somesuch.

[Dantankerous]

5 hours ago, Three Foot Johnson said:

I have two with electronic keypads and three with dials. I've had the keypad locks for 25 years anyway, and never a hitch, nor do I personally know anyone who's ever had one fail - it's always the guy down the street, or the neighbor's tax preparer's uncle's former wife's new husband's step kid's best friend's father or somesuch.

Thanks. What is the brand of dial, if I may ask? Safes sold around here seem to be mostly equipped with SecuRam electronic locks. I am only presuming that a company that sells high dollar safes ain't gonna use a cheap lock leading to QC issues associated with their company name.

 

The internet documents a few failures. What is the true stat? X% of how many sold fail? No idea. If I google "keypad lock failure" those are the results I get. Duh. Doubt I'd get "dial lock success rate" results at all in a search.

 

While I still don't really trust the notion of a keypad it is interesting to see that in my area 99% of safes are sold with electronic keypad locks. Why? Successful marketing? Less expensive cost to manufacture? Acceptable failure rate for sales even on big name safes?

 

I do know that the keypad safes trigger an electric solenoid. I also know solenoids fail occasionally. Some last for years. High usage generally equates to a quicker failure. Dials can get worn out as well. That technology has lasted well over 100 years and still goes strong however. 

 

Crap shoot, maybe.

[LawMan Mark, SASS #57095L]

17 hours ago, Dantankerous said:

I've been looking at new gun safes of late and around my area pretty much all the retailers are selling gun safes with the electronic keypad combination lock instead of the old S&G dial that I prefer. In fact I have not seen one safe with the dial lock lately.

 

Any of you have any trouble with these new keypad locks ever? I read horror stories on the net, of course, and I can see more potential for a keypad lock failure than the tried and true dial lock.

 

Most of the retailers around here sell Liberty safes, all lines of them. Cabela's has their own plus some Brownings. Not sure if the keypad locks are of different manufacturers or not between the different brands of safes.

 

I am just not sure if I trust these keypad locks...

Ex wife just had to pay a locksmith to open the safe she got in our divorce settlement.  She let the batteries die for an unknown length of time, and had lost the backup key.  I'll stick with dial locks.  

[Barry Sloe]

I've got 3 with digital keypads. A Liberty, Winchester, and Snap-On. Had one issue with the Winchester keypad, under warranty. Changed it out and no more problems. Keep the batteries fresh.

 

BS

 

 

 

 

 

 

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

8 hours ago, Three Foot Johnson said:

I have two with electronic keypads and three with dials. I've had the keypad locks for 25 years anyway, and never a hitch, nor do I personally know anyone who's ever had one fail - it's always the guy down the street, or the neighbor's tax preparer's uncle's former wife's new husband's step kid's best friend's father or somesuch.

I personally know folks that have had electronic lock issues.

One, more than once....

Research where these electronic locks are made.

[Oak Ridge Regulator]

I have 2 safes, my old safe is a S&G dail and my new safe is a S&G electronic keypad, the keypad is WAY faster and WAY easier to see on my old eyes and I keep the guns I use a lot in the new safe and put the old collectibles in the dial safe, the ONLY issue I have found is if my gun rom gets cold ( 40’s) or lower and the battery is old or weak it won’t function the lock, then I put in a new battery. I really love how fast and easy it is to get into the electronic safe

[Injun Ryder, SASS #36201L]

I have two safes. One with mechanical lock and one electronic.

 

The mechanical lock is an LG purchased in 2008. The combination has "drifted" so I now have to go one digit past the combination to open it. I contacted the safe manufacturer and they confirmed that this does happen. They sent me a tool and instructions to reset it back to the original combination but I have not done it yet.

 

The electronic lock is an SG purchased in 2018. I have had to replace the 9 volt battery a couple of times but no other issue.

[irish ike, SASS #43615]

When I bought my second safe I found out that safes are rated for fire and they are rated for burglaries. All the safes in Box stores are fire rated. Thin metal sides and top, gyp board inner fire barrier and then a sheet metal inside wall. 
 ended up buying a fire and burglary rated safe. Thicker outer walls, concrete inner liner. 

It came with an electronic dial. My original safe was a dial. Daughters boyfriend said most of the calls he gets for safes are for safes with electronic locks.

I had him change out the electronic for a dial.

[bgavin]

Dial for me.
I keep the combination in a file cabinet in the garage.
Also keep the numbers in IBM EBCDIC taped to the front of the safe.
If'n a bad guy breaks into my house, he will stick a 38 in my ear and force me to open the safe anyway.
If we are away from home... ain't no bad guy gonna figure out the EBCDIC... need a gen-u-ine dino saur for that one.

[Sedalia Dave]

23 hours ago, Three Foot Johnson said:

I have two with electronic keypads and three with dials. I've had the keypad locks for 25 years anyway, and never a hitch, nor do I personally know anyone who's ever had one fail - it's always the guy down the street, or the neighbor's tax preparer's uncle's former wife's new husband's step kid's best friend's father or somesuch.

 

At work I have personally seen 3 keypad style electronic safe locks fail. Over the span of 6 years one safe had the lock fail twice. First time the manufacturer sent us a new circuit board. Second time the manufacturer said we were out of luck as that circuit board was no longer available. 

Another safe the electronic keypad lock failed 2 years after purchase. Manufacturer was out of business so again SOL. Both of these saw periods of heavy use followed by long stretches of inactivity.

 

Currently all our work safes / vault doors have an electronic dial combination lock. No tumblers to manipulate or listen to. Over 20 years I've seen at least 4 fail. When these fail there is no key backup. You call the locksmith and he brings out the high dollar drill. Sometimes the door can be opened without permanent damage sometimes not.

 

I've seen exactly 2 mechanical dial locks fail. One was on a 2 drawer safe and the other was a vault door. Both were made by S&G and over 50 years old when they failed. Both saw regular use. In both cases the locksmith was able to manipulate the lock and get it to work without resorting to a drill. However once opened, he disabled the lock so that they couldn't accidentally get relocked,  In both cases the designs were so old that they couldn't be upgraded to a new lock and wound up being scrapped.

 

[Church Key, SASS # 33713]

The mechanical dial on my expensive Zanotti safe failed after 10 or so years. Luckily it happened when it was open. Got an electronic lock that has dual 9v batteries replaceable from the outside. Mechanical locks are not designed to last forever.

[Shepherd Book]

Had an electronic keypad on a Liberty safe.  Lots of experience in the military with S&G dial locks.  Had safe technician over and replaced keypad with an S&G dial.  Much happier, and now, if we get nuked or EMP'd, I can still get in the safe!  SB