Good 357 load for 1873

[Tallboy]

I did find this which answers my question... very interesting if anyone else is wondering. I know 110 isn't used in any reloading here likely, but it's still very interesting to me

 

Quote

4. The primary reason for "DO NOT REDUCE" warnings for H-110 or W-296 is SQUIBS and here's why: These powders tend to burn in a "serial" manner, which means the primer flash will ignite the first layer of powder kernels and in turn, those kernels ignite the next layer of kernels, which ignite the next layer until all powder is finally ignited. This works exactly like a fuse where any air gap or void between kernels will cause ignition to cease ... or at least stall until other touching kernels ignite it. A stall results in multiple pressure peaks .... not good for accuracy but not specifically dangerous. If powder ceases to light up the next layer of kernels .... basically the fire goes out ... just like a cut fuse and you end up with a squib where the bullet gets stuck in the bore. Squibs happen way more in colder weather and almost always at initial ignition.

5. How can a reduced charge increase chamber pressure? Here's how: Let's assume a typical water bottle represents a cartridge where the end with the bottle cap is the primer and the water represents the powder. If the water bottle is nearly full, water will collect at the primer end and will ignite in a "serial" manner. Lay a half full water bottle flat horizontally and look at it. A much larger area of water surface is now exposed to the primer flash. This can cause the powder to ignite in a parallel manner, which will raise chamber pressures to very high levels. In other words, it turns a slow burning powder into a very fast burning powder and increases chamber pressure dramatically. The safe standard to prevent excess pressure and prevent squibs is to load to at least 75% of case capacity .... 80% is better.
 

 

[Eyesa Horg]

1 hour ago, Tallboy said:

Thanks again for posting that. I actually saw you post that before but at that exact moment I wasn't ready to see it. (Since then I have read the how-to section another time). I just bought Titegroup!

I used TiteGroup a few years ago and it was less temp. sensitive in the winter, but I found it a bit snappy in the pistols. Talking cowboy loads now.

I'd start at about 3 gr. with a 125 gr. pill and go from there and see what you like for accuracy etc.

From what I've seen and heard with the typical powders we use, they all run about the same amount by weight. JMHO

 

Just FYI, I have been using Clays or Clay-Dot, just got some Clean shot from Scarlett and will be trying that next year. I use a grain or so more in my 45's, but 3 is the load in Ellie's guns. She does use 38 sp cases though as there is less empty space. When I went below 3 there was unburnt powder, especially in the pistols.

[Cholla]

Way back when I used to have a Dan Wesson .357, Red Dot and Winchester 231 were my go to powders. I liked Red Dot best as I could load down for lead wadcutters and up for jacketed bullets. My reloading manual back then was the Speer #10. I just checked my Speer #14 and Red Dot isn't even listed, which is why I keep all my older manuals and buy any I find at yard sales or gun shows.

[Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life]

Welcome to the TiteGroup club!

I have been using it for years with good results. Of course I have tried other powders but keep coming back to TiteGroup. 
Yes it is a bit more “snappy” than some others (and seems to be a bit louder), but it meters smoothly and consistently through my Dillon’s and before this pandemic BS was among the least expensive powders available. My CAS loads all use the same charge weight. 125, 140, 147, 158 grain bullet with SPM primer and 3.2 grains TiteGroup. Not temperature or position sensitive in my experience. I have gone as low as 2.8 with the 125’s for several years but actually prefer the 3.2 grain load’s feedback. 
Regards

    

Gateway Kid

edit to add I only shoot 38 special in my CAS guns

[Tallboy]

2 minutes ago, Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life said:

Welcome to the TiteGroup club!

I have been using it for years with good results. Of course I have tried other powders but keep coming back to TiteGroup. 
Yes it is a bit more “snappy” than some others (and seems to be a bit louder), but it meters smoothly and consistently through my Dillon’s and before this pandemic BS was among the least expensive powders available. My CAS loads all use the same charge weight. 125, 140, 147, 158 grain bullet with SPM primer and 3.2 grains TiteGroup. Not temperature or position sensitive in my experience. I have gone as low as 2.8 with the 125’s for several years but actually prefer the 3.2 grain load’s feedback. 
Regards

    

Gateway Kid

Do you find that SP vs SPM affects that? Currently I only have CCI 500 primers.

[Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life]

Before CAS I had been using CCI for 25 years. My reloading mentor used them then and still does today. My entry into cowboy coincided with the community organizer’s regime and subsequent primer shortages. Around here the only primers available were Federal SPM and that is what I stocked up on in the following years. The only reason I continue using magnums is habit as I could not tell any difference between SP and SPM. The CCI work fine unless you have super light springs and then you may get an occasional light strike and FTF. Factory springs don’t seem to have that issue and my experience with CCI has been very positive in many different calibers and guns. I keep a few around to “proof” a gun if I have done anything to the springs, if a gun will set off CCI it will set off anything. 
Regards

    

Gateway Kid

["Big Boston"]

18 hours ago, Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life said:

Quick and dirty way especially for low powder volume loads (light loads) that don't mostly fill the case.

Set up a chronograph.

1) Take your loaded hand gun and safely point muzzle towards sky.

2) Gently bring muzzle parallel to ground and fire a round over your chronograph.

Repeat 1-2 for the remaining rounds.

1A) Next take loaded hand gun and point towards ground.

2A) Gently bring muzzle parallel to ground and fire a round over your chronograph.

Repeat 1A-2A for remaining rounds

1B) Take your loaded hand gun and hold parallel to ground.

2B) Give a brisk push forward and back, then fire a round over the chronograph.

Repeat 1B-2B for remaining rounds

This will give you powder forward, powder more or less level and powder rearward in the case.

Review data from chronograph, big variances in velocity are what you are looking for, same for noticeable sound differences or felt recoil.

Again not the most precise test but if you are borderline on your powder load and/or the powder is one of those that could be position sensitive it will be pretty obvious.

A version of this at one time was used to verify compliance with power factor requirements in Wild bunch. Don't know if they still do it or not.

Regards

   

Gateway Kid

 

Tallboy, I'm only a few years ahead of you, Your scenario is just about where I started about 5 years ago. The above method of testing is what I do. For expediency I ship the level shake back and forth step, my thinking if powder forward and powder rearward are good, level shouldn't be an issue. The step will be useful if either forward or rearward is not good. 

 

Using a Hi-Tek bullet is a good idea. That coating works well.

 

I agree with your choice of using 357 brass. That simplifies loading and cleaning. I have a '66 in the mix, so 38 Spl brass is what I use for that. I originallyused 38 spl for all my 38/357 guns, but eventually changed to 38s in the 38 and 357 in the 357s. You don't have to, but I think it's advisable. 

 

L.O.A.L. is important with the 1873 rifle for feeding reasons. 1873 rifles tend to want ammunition longer than 1.4" and a bit shorter than 1.6". I load my 38s to 1.5" and call it a day. They will work in every gun, 38 or 357. The bullet I used to use was a Hi-Tek 147 gr oversized 9mm bullet. It has no crimp groove but if you use a LEE Factory Crimp Die (LFCD) it is not an issue. A good velocity goal would be 900 fps in the rifle. My load was a bit less at 870 fps. If you load in 357, try for a LOAL of a bit below 1.6" and to get a consistent load your target velocity should be a bit higher. There are also some 158 gr bullets that can be loaded to accommodate the required LOAL.

 

The Great Reloading Component era we're in will influence your choice of powder. Powders that burn faster than Unique are usually good candidates. Next preference would be bulky powders. I refer often to the LEE VMD chart to rate a powder bulkiness.

 

VMD/Powder	Manufacturer
.2172 IMR TRAIL BOSS	Hodgdon
.1489 ALNT E3	Alliant
.1462 CLAYS	Hodgdon
.1446 IMR GREEN	Hodgdon
.1423 IMR RED	Hodgdon
.1413 RED DOT	Alliant
.1349 A NITRO100	Western
.1343 IMR 700X	Hodgdon
.1341 AMER-SELECT	Alliant
.1331 SOLO 1000	Western
.1300 TITEWAD	Hodgdon
.1296 WIN AA PLUS	Hodgdon
.1278 R COMPETITION	Western
.1266 WIN AA LITE	Hodgdon
.1266 INTERNATIONAL	Hodgdon
.1262 GREEN DOT	Alliant
.1205 wSUPER-TAR	Hodgdon
.1205 IMR PB	Hodgdon
.1196 IMR TARGET	Hodgdon
.1122 HERCO	Alliant
.1122 WW452/Trap 100	Winchester
.1100 SR4756	Hodgdon
.1099 UNIVERSAL	Hodgdon
.1099 SOLO 1500	Western
.1092 UNIQUE	Alliant
.1071 IMR 800X	Hodgdon
.1064 BULLSEYE	Alliant
.1063 ALLIANT STEEL	Alliant
.1046 SR7625	Hodgdon
.1006 BLACKHORN 209	Western
.0997 Clean Shot D032	Lovex
.0931 WIN 231	Hodgdon
.0926 HP38	Hodgdon
.0921 IMR BLUE	Hodgdon
.0889 POWER PISTOL	Alliant
.0865 BLUE DOT	Alliant
.0859 WIN SUPER HANDI	Hodgdon
.0848 TITEGROUP	Hodgdon
.0847 wSUPER-LIT	Hodgdon
.0840 wSUPER-FLD	Hodgdon

 

My powder is 452, long ago obsolete but it does show up as #22 and that sort of tells you VMD is a factor but that doesn't mean that some of the denser loads will not work. 

 

That is where I'd start, that will give you a good load for everything you shoot. It should also shoot to POA in a '73 SA. My next quest was to find a nice shooting revolver load. I went through a few different combinations and finally settled on a wadcutter WC load. A WC load is not a rifle load, very easy to tell what it is. I load it to a level that will shoot to the sights. Unfortunately 357 WC data is scarce, but using 38 Spl data works. Somewhere near max is where you will end up. Use a WC that has a crimp groove near the top, so that some lead sticks out to make it legal for Cowboy. I use a LEE 358-148-WC but any bullet that looks like it will work. My load chronographs at or under 800 fps. You'll notice I am above mouse belch power, but still mild. Mouse Belch loads seldom shoot to the sights and consistency becomes a challenging goal. Remember: I'm assuming that you will be using a chronograph,  The Gateway Kid has good advice, follow it. 

 

A high power load is fairly easy. You can use a jacketed bullet and follow the recipes and you'll be golden. Again, very easy to differentiate ammo, IOW, if you do not shoot jacketed in your '73 Rifle, you know it isn't being abused. A '73 Miroku is meant to shoot all 357 ammo, but I don't see the sense when you have other firearms that are stronger. 

There are plenty of good options, but I like what I have worked out for myself. I hope your quest for components works out. I use a Chrony for my testing, a basic cheap chronograph that works. 

 

BB

 

 

[Tallboy]

38 minutes ago, "Big Boston" said:

 

Tallboy, I'm only a few years ahead of you, Your scenario is just about where I started about 5 years ago. The above method of testing is what I do. For expediency I ship the level shake back and forth step, my thinking if powder forward and powder rearward are good, level shouldn't be an issue. The step will be useful if either forward or rearward is not good. 

 

Using a Hi-Tek bullet is a good idea. That coating works well.

 

I agree with your choice of using 357 brass. That simplifies loading and cleaning. I have a '66 in the mix, so 38 Spl brass is what I use for that. I originallyused 38 spl for all my 38/357 guns, but eventually changed to 38s in the 38 and 357 in the 357s. You don't have to, but I think it's advisable. 

 

L.O.A.L. is important with the 1873 rifle for feeding reasons. 1873 rifles tend to want ammunition longer than 1.4" and a bit shorter than 1.6". I load my 38s to 1.5" and call it a day. They will work in every gun, 38 or 357. The bullet I used to use was a Hi-Tek 147 gr oversized 9mm bullet. It has no crimp groove but if you use a LEE Factory Crimp Die (LFCD) it is not an issue. A good velocity goal would be 900 fps in the rifle. My load was a bit less at 870 fps. If you load in 357, try for a LOAL of a bit below 1.6" and to get a consistent load your target velocity should be a bit higher. There are also some 158 gr bullets that can be loaded to accommodate the required LOAL.

 

The Great Reloading Component era we're in will influence your choice of powder. Powders that burn faster than Unique are usually good candidates. Next preference would be bulky powders. I refer often to the LEE VMD chart to rate a powder bulkiness.

 

VMD/Powder	Manufacturer
.2172 IMR TRAIL BOSS	Hodgdon
.1489 ALNT E3	Alliant
.1462 CLAYS	Hodgdon
.1446 IMR GREEN	Hodgdon
.1423 IMR RED	Hodgdon
.1413 RED DOT	Alliant
.1349 A NITRO100	Western
.1343 IMR 700X	Hodgdon
.1341 AMER-SELECT	Alliant
.1331 SOLO 1000	Western
.1300 TITEWAD	Hodgdon
.1296 WIN AA PLUS	Hodgdon
.1278 R COMPETITION	Western
.1266 WIN AA LITE	Hodgdon
.1266 INTERNATIONAL	Hodgdon
.1262 GREEN DOT	Alliant
.1205 wSUPER-TAR	Hodgdon
.1205 IMR PB	Hodgdon
.1196 IMR TARGET	Hodgdon
.1122 HERCO	Alliant
.1122 WW452/Trap 100	Winchester
.1100 SR4756	Hodgdon
.1099 UNIVERSAL	Hodgdon
.1099 SOLO 1500	Western
.1092 UNIQUE	Alliant
.1071 IMR 800X	Hodgdon
.1064 BULLSEYE	Alliant
.1063 ALLIANT STEEL	Alliant
.1046 SR7625	Hodgdon
.1006 BLACKHORN 209	Western
.0997 Clean Shot D032	Lovex
.0931 WIN 231	Hodgdon
.0926 HP38	Hodgdon
.0921 IMR BLUE	Hodgdon
.0889 POWER PISTOL	Alliant
.0865 BLUE DOT	Alliant
.0859 WIN SUPER HANDI	Hodgdon
.0848 TITEGROUP	Hodgdon
.0847 wSUPER-LIT	Hodgdon
.0840 wSUPER-FLD	Hodgdon

 

My powder is 452, long ago obsolete but it does show up as #22 and that sort of tells you VMD is a factor but that doesn't mean that some of the denser loads will not work. 

 

That is where I'd start, that will give you a good load for everything you shoot. It should also shoot to POA in a '73 SA. My next quest was to find a nice shooting revolver load. I went through a few different combinations and finally settled on a wadcutter WC load. A WC load is not a rifle load, very easy to tell what it is. I load it to a level that will shoot to the sights. Unfortunately 357 WC data is scarce, but using 38 Spl data works. Somewhere near max is where you will end up. Use a WC that has a crimp groove near the top, so that some lead sticks out to make it legal for Cowboy. I use a LEE 358-148-WC but any bullet that looks like it will work. My load chronographs at or under 800 fps. You'll notice I am above mouse belch power, but still mild. Mouse Belch loads seldom shoot to the sights and consistency becomes a challenging goal. Remember: I'm assuming that you will be using a chronograph,  The Gateway Kid has good advice, follow it. 

 

A high power load is fairly easy. You can use a jacketed bullet and follow the recipes and you'll be golden. Again, very easy to differentiate ammo, IOW, if you do not shoot jacketed in your '73 Rifle, you know it isn't being abused. A '73 Miroku is meant to shoot all 357 ammo, but I don't see the sense when you have other firearms that are stronger. 

There are plenty of good options, but I like what I have worked out for myself. I hope your quest for components works out. I use a Chrony for my testing, a basic cheap chronograph that works. 

 

BB

 

 

Awesome thanks! All of that makes perfect sense, and I deeply appreciate it. As a side question do you shoot at a range? I was looking at chronographs that I can use at an outdoor range, it seems my option is magnetospeed

[Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life]

If you don't already have one a chronograph is your friend

Invaluable for load development and verification of reloading procedures (checks if you are doing things right) and how close you are to doing things wrong.

 

https://pact.com/

 I have a MKII from 1988 vintage and a MKIV from about 2000. Both check one another to within about 6-10FPS.

You will need their "skyscreen" kit to measure your bullet speed. I do not have one of the infrared ones, mine is the standard model and works fine.

Biggest advantage is you are shooting over a "screen" that is downrange rather than the chronograph itself so if your aim is bad you destroy a $15 part rather than a $180+ chronograph. Disadvantage is unless you buy the wireless version (more expensive) you will have a fairly long run of wires to connect everything.

I bought a cheap camera tripod ($30) to mount the screens to and throw everything into a cheap duffle bag.

 

https://competitionelectronics.com/

Have used a friends ProChrono LTD and it agrees with mine to within about 10 FPS. Be sure you aim above the chronograph or you will have a nice piece of scrap metal as it is an all in one unit. Again you will need some kind of (cheap) tripod to mount the device to at the range. His was bluetooth enabled though we didn't use that. If your eyes are as old as mine you will need binoculars to see the readout unless you want to walk downrange occasionally.

 

Caldwell

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiGl_-2zvn6AhWIqWoFHeMqCNAQFnoECEwQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.caldwellshooting.com%2Frange-gear%2Fchronographs-and-wind-meters%2Fballistic-precision-g2-chronograph-with-220v-adapter%2F720002.html&usg=AOvVaw2eFO4o5rXtSjopbsosHeDh

Have heard and read that the tripod mounting system is very lightweight and flimsy. More research required

 

Magnetospeed

https://www.googleadservices.com/pagead/aclk?sa=L&ai=DChcSEwics5y_z_n6AhWcFdQBHX-2CBkYABAVGgJvYQ&ohost=www.google.com&cid=CAASJORonZtzOxKgXzv8r7Z_SMPPPADqWFDjwcLhU3StsRFKm0JyLw&sig=AOD64_2kVREI7fKLXSyG119ktMnJSYyWxQ&q&adurl&ved=2ahUKEwi_kI-_z_n6AhWYm2oFHVi2BmgQ0Qx6BAgIEAE

Being barrel mounted sounds okay (definitely different) but haven't used or know anyone who has.

 

 

Regards

   

Gateway Kid

[Tallboy]

1 hour ago, Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life said:

If you don't already have one a chronograph is your friend

Invaluable for load development and verification of reloading procedures (checks if you are doing things right) and how close you are to doing things wrong.

 

https://pact.com/

 I have a MKII from 1988 vintage and a MKIV from about 2000. Both check one another to within about 6-10FPS.

You will need their "skyscreen" kit to measure your bullet speed. I do not have one of the infrared ones, mine is the standard model and works fine.

Biggest advantage is you are shooting over a "screen" that is downrange rather than the chronograph itself so if your aim is bad you destroy a $15 part rather than a $180+ chronograph. Disadvantage is unless you buy the wireless version (more expensive) you will have a fairly long run of wires to connect everything.

I bought a cheap camera tripod ($30) to mount the screens to and throw everything into a cheap duffle bag.

 

https://competitionelectronics.com/

Have used a friends ProChrono LTD and it agrees with mine to within about 10 FPS. Be sure you aim above the chronograph or you will have a nice piece of scrap metal as it is an all in one unit. Again you will need some kind of (cheap) tripod to mount the device to at the range. His was bluetooth enabled though we didn't use that. If your eyes are as old as mine you will need binoculars to see the readout unless you want to walk downrange occasionally.

 

Caldwell

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiGl_-2zvn6AhWIqWoFHeMqCNAQFnoECEwQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.caldwellshooting.com%2Frange-gear%2Fchronographs-and-wind-meters%2Fballistic-precision-g2-chronograph-with-220v-adapter%2F720002.html&usg=AOvVaw2eFO4o5rXtSjopbsosHeDh

Have heard and read that the tripod mounting system is very lightweight and flimsy. More research required

 

Magnetospeed

https://www.googleadservices.com/pagead/aclk?sa=L&ai=DChcSEwics5y_z_n6AhWcFdQBHX-2CBkYABAVGgJvYQ&ohost=www.google.com&cid=CAASJORonZtzOxKgXzv8r7Z_SMPPPADqWFDjwcLhU3StsRFKm0JyLw&sig=AOD64_2kVREI7fKLXSyG119ktMnJSYyWxQ&q&adurl&ved=2ahUKEwi_kI-_z_n6AhWYm2oFHVi2BmgQ0Qx6BAgIEAE

Being barrel mounted sounds okay (definitely different) but haven't used or know anyone who has.

 

 

Regards

   

Gateway Kid

Awesome info, thank you!! Do you usually see people using those regular style at outdoor ranges? I don't think I've ever seen one now that I think about it, but I do know a lot of people that reload. Maybe I haven't noticed before. I have to go to a range, sadly I don't have our own land, so I have to see if they allow that.

["Big Boston"]

2 hours ago, Tallboy said:

Awesome thanks! All of that makes perfect sense, and I deeply appreciate it. As a side question do you shoot at a range? I was looking at chronographs that I can use at an outdoor range, it seems my option is magnetospeed

 

I'm sorry, didn't think of that. I set up at the range during off hours, I'm usually the only one there. My Chrony gets set 10 ft from the muzzle. Perhaps I'm spoiled. I imagine a busy range would require consulting the range officer. Labradar may be an option, but I have no personal experience. 

 

This game is not meant for quitters, I does require a bit of focus and some determination.  I dabbled while I was still working, since retirement I'm into it a bit deeper. 

 

BB

[Tallboy]

Just now, "Big Boston" said:

 

I'm sorry, didn't think of that. I set up at the range during off hours, I'm usually the only one there. My Chrony gets set 10 ft from the muzzle. Perhaps I'm spoiled. I imagine a busy range would require consulting the range officer. Labradar may be an option, but I have no personal experience. 

 

This game is not meant for quitters, I does require a bit of focus and some determination.  I dabbled while I was still working, since retirement I'm into it a bit deeper. 

 

BB

Luckily I'm not a quitter 

[Bison Bud]

On 10/24/2022 at 8:49 AM, Captain Bill Burt said:

 

The only one causing an issue is Tallboy. He posted a question and got 14 responses attempting to answer the question and one response gently suggesting he find a mentor (not a bad suggestion). 

 

 

His response is to get all huffy and threaten not to ask any more questions. 
 

I’m with Dave, it’s fine asking questions here, but there’s no substitute for an experienced friend helping you up the learning curve.

 

I never said that any of it wasn't good advice, I simply said that I'm sorry he got offended.  I for one think we need to focus more on the questions offered rather than be so hyper-critical and all inclusive, but to each his own.  One does indeed need to learn to read between the lines and simply let some things go when posting on the internet.  Anyway, I'm sorry if I ruffled your hackle feathers by my previous comments, as that was not my intent!

 

On another note, I would also like to clarify that I do not use Titegroup in true rifle cartridges, only the pistol caliber ones that I use for Cowboy shooting and for me that's primarily .38 Special/.357 Magnum and .44 Special/.44 Magnum.  Good luck and good shooting to all.  

[Ranger Dan]

I use the magneto speed chronograph. Works great on all types of rifles. Haven't tried it on a revolver yet.

[Tallboy]

8 minutes ago, Ranger Dan said:

I use the magneto speed chronograph. Works great on all types of rifles. Haven't tried it on a revolver yet.

I actually just called the range and regular ones are allowed! Sweet.... 

 

As a sidenote, how does Bullseye differ from Titegroup. According to this burn chart they burn literally identically as far as speed. I own Titegroup (hasn't arrived yet), but I was still just thinking about how other powders "act differently" that burn very similarly.

[Ranger Dan]

4 minutes ago, Tallboy said:

I actually just called the range and regular ones are allowed! Sweet.... 

 

As a sidenote, how does Bullseye differ from Titegroup. According to this burn chart they burn literally identically as far as speed. I own Titegroup (hasn't arrived yet), but I was still just thinking about how other powders "act differently" that burn very similarly.

Each powder has specific advantages and disadvantages. You have to read up on them from the manufacturer. I use titegorup, so am familiar with its properties. Very fast burning pistol powder that is not position sensitive so is excellent for use as a light load in large capacity cases. These same properties make it not so good as a full power "hot" load, because only a small amount of over charge will exceed maximum pressure, and you have a very small window of charge weights to work with. I use this powder for all my "light" pistol loads from 9mm to 44 magnum. For hotter loads, longer range shooting I use slower burning bulkier powders that will fill the case and prevent overcharging. Another powder similiar to titegroup is "clean shot", same fast burn rate and position sensitivity, but much bulkier. Takes about twice as much clean shot to make the same weight as titegroup. Read up on "Internal Ballistics" a discipline that precedes "External Balistics" and will explain a lot about how all the components of ammunition tie together.

[Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971]

On 10/24/2022 at 7:07 AM, Tallboy said:

I did find this which answers my question... very interesting if anyone else is wondering. I know 110 isn't used in any reloading here likely, but it's still very interesting to me

 

 

At major matches we have long range side matches.  I have used H110 in a 357 mag cartridge for such matches.  My rifle easily hits targets at 200 yards.    However, the powder is unsuitable for main match loads.  H110 is a fine grained ball powder and meters well.

[Tallboy]

42 minutes ago, Ranger Dan said:

Each powder has specific advantages and disadvantages. You have to read up on them from the manufacturer. I use titegorup, so am familiar with its properties. Very fast burning pistol powder that is not position sensitive so is excellent for use as a light load in large capacity cases. These same properties make it not so good as a full power "hot" load, because only a small amount of over charge will exceed maximum pressure, and you have a very small window of charge weights to work with. I use this powder for all my "light" pistol loads from 9mm to 44 magnum. For hotter loads, longer range shooting I use slower burning bulkier powders that will fill the case and prevent overcharging. Another powder similiar to titegroup is "clean shot", same fast burn rate and position sensitivity, but much bulkier. Takes about twice as much clean shot to make the same weight as titegroup. Read up on "Internal Ballistics" a discipline that precedes "External Balistics" and will explain a lot about how all the components of ammunition tie together.

Thanks Dan, great explanation. That was one of my favorite first things I read was the ballistics formulas (I do like math and physics).