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Latest Open Top Acquisition: "Truth and Justice" a pair of 1990s vintage custom conversions by Dave Anderson


Tuolumne Lawman 6127

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Introducing "Truth" and "Justice"!  1860 Colt custom conversion in .44 Colt (BHA).  Both have 5.5" barrels,    The host pistols were Armi San Marcos from Cimarron (The bottom of the barrel says "ASM Fredericksburg Texas".  Hand stamped serial numbers 71 and 72. After some research in Adler's book and reviewing them with those who know (including Walt Kirst) they are apparently early conversions done by Dave Anderson in the 1990s. (ASM host guns, threaded end plug in cylinder side of ejector rod housing, and several other small things). The engraving was was supposedly done by Frank "Texas Jack" Lehman in the same time period.  I knew Frank, and he had engraved several of my guns back then, and it is the script and pattern is the same as he preferred. and used on my guns.

 

They are well used, with honest wear, which is fine with me.  The action is slick, with  about a 2 to 2.5 pound trigger pull.  The front sights appear to be from Mexican brass coins cut to size.  The grips have been shaved down to make them thinner, but I plan on putting faux ivory on them.  Need to figure out is I use Pietta or Uberti grips.

 

Got them along with 500 rounds of Load-X .44 Colt cowboy ammo.  I also already have dies and bullet from loading 44 Colt in the past.  I got the from a shooting pard, that has been teasing me with them for a few years now.

 

 

T&J1.jpg

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Well, very interesting.  Dave Anderson was actually the first to attempt to produce conversions in limited small production runs..  He used ASM 1860s as the host guns, and eventually contracted to ASM to produce stepped 1860 cartridge cylinders and some other parts.  This was before ASM started to produce Type I conversions of their own. around 2000. 

 

I discovered that Truth and Justice's cylinders are NOT converted percussion cylinders!  They are beefier, and actually almost the same diameter as Uberti's cartridge conversion's cylinders.  When ASM started producing conversions, they used the shortcut of not having stepped cylinders or frames.  Anderson, however, had ASM make stepped 1860 cartridge cylinders, and had the corresponding step on the frame.  As I have said already, truth and Justice have have these stepped cylinders.

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  • 1 month later...
  • 2 weeks later...

Here are Truth and Justice after I replaced the shaved grips.  One is an 1860 ASM grip from eBay, and the other a modified Uberti 1860 grip from Graveyard Jack,

 

 

T&J .jpeg

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Im sure I'll keep these until I retire.  Will be selling a pair of LNIB 1860 Richards Type II conversions in .45, one 5.5" and one 8" barrel.  bought them two months before I got Truth and Justice!

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I am selling a pair of LNIB 1860 Richards Type II conversions in .45, one 5.5" and one 8" barrel.  bought them two months before I got Truth and Justice!

 

 

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Didnt Captain George Baylor do an article on them many years ago in the Cowboy Chronicle?  It may have been on the first wire, can't remember, the brain is gone.

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I talked to Tex and Cat Ormand.  Neither recall an article.  Reached out to Skinny, but haven't heard back yet.

 

On another note, the Type I has always been my favorite with the frame mounted rear sight and firing pin.  When Armi San Marco came out with theirs, I had a pair.  ASM, though, did not have a stepped cylinder, like the 1860 should, and Anderson did.  I loved the pair, but one had a mis-aligned cylinder notch, making it a five-shooter.  ASM folded before I could get warranty done on it.  Sold it as one pistol and a spare "parts" pistol.  Since then, the only option for a Type I is a custom (or find an Anderson like I did.)

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Howdy TL, I just PM'd you Capt. Baylor's email address.  I see him regularly including a couple days ago but won't see him again for a couple weeks or I'd ask him.  He's on facebook as well, if you are (I'm not).

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Talked to Baylor, he did not do an article on Andersons.  Also checked with Skinny, and even Cat and Tex Ormand (prior editors). They didn't have one either. SKinny has the draft and pics should be in the October Chronicle.

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While the Anderson's will be my primary main match pistols, replacing the Uberti Type IIs, my pair of Kirst/Pietta .45 Schofield 1860s (8" Saber River and 5.5" Sheriff model) will still be my back-up pair.  The Saber River is so dang beautiful, it just has to be shot sometimes!  I am going to an annual match in October, and I would guess half the stages will be shot with the Andersons, and half with the Kirsts. 

 

I have one of Walt's .45 ACP cylinders for the Piettas and it is a hoot.  I use the same 230 grain RN lead bullet for my ,45 ACP WW231 Wild Bunch 1911 loads, and my Trail Boss .45 Schofield loads for my conversions.  Both cylinders print about the same!  I am doing a Cowboy Chronicle article on the Kirst 1860 .45 ACP cylinder as a two for one gun in the 5.5" sheriff model, using also the .45 Colt cylinder.

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My 8" Pietta/Kirst Saber River 1860 Konversion in .45 Colt/Schofield and my   5.5" Pietta/Kirst Sheriff Model 1860 Konversion in .45 Colt/Schofield

 

 

Kirst-Saber.JPG

5.5 Kirst.jpeg

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ive been thinking on going this way for a bit now - your posts have edged me closer , i really like the look and i see the options leave a lot of room for a persons preferences , i have one 1858 at this point bet i think i need a couple more to kick this off 

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