Subdeacon Joe Posted June 4, 2022 Share Posted June 4, 2022 https://thenationaldesk.com/news/from-the-desk/california-court-rules-that-bees-are-actually-fish-california-endangered-species-act-cesa-crotch-western-suckley-cuckoo-franklin-species-endangered-invertebrates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 Posted June 4, 2022 Share Posted June 4, 2022 One can find similar examples. A Catholic archbishop of Quebec long ago ruled that beavers were fish for purpose of fasting rules, and one in New Orleans made the same determination with respect to alligators. There are other ecclesiastical examples down the ages, including treating birds as fish for Lent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rip Snorter Posted June 4, 2022 Share Posted June 4, 2022 Sumpin' fishy for sure! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El diablo gringo Posted June 4, 2022 Share Posted June 4, 2022 Guys are girls and bees are fish? Dang, now I need a scotch Gringo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 Posted June 4, 2022 Share Posted June 4, 2022 1 minute ago, El diablo gringo said: Guys are girls and bees are fish? Dang, now I need a scotch Gringo Make mine a stinger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Riot Posted June 4, 2022 Share Posted June 4, 2022 I thought a Suckley Cuckoo was a State Senator… Learn something new every day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyesa Horg Posted June 4, 2022 Share Posted June 4, 2022 You just can't make this stuff up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpo Posted June 4, 2022 Share Posted June 4, 2022 Makes all kinds of sense to me. The general difference between a fruit and a vegetable is with a fruit you eat the pulp, and with a vegetable you eat the seed. A tomato is a fruit. Biologically. Or botanically, if you prefer. But legally a tomato is a vegetable. That has something to do with import taxes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rip Snorter Posted June 4, 2022 Share Posted June 4, 2022 Maybe there is the germ of an idea - "Thingness" ! All matter is made up of of the same stuff at the atomic level so whatever it may be it is a "thing". Imagine the impact on conversation, and Law! No more vocabulary, at least in respect to nouns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 Posted June 4, 2022 Share Posted June 4, 2022 13 minutes ago, Alpo said: The general difference between a fruit and a vegetable is with a fruit you eat the pulp, and with a vegetable you eat the seed. A tomato is a fruit. Biologically. Or botanically, if you prefer. But legally a tomato is a vegetable. That has something to do with import taxes. But spinach and brocolli don't have any seeds.... "Fruit" is both a botanical and a culinary term. "Vegetable" just a culinary one. The ancient canard about the tomato notwithstanding, it was always both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallaby Jack, SASS #44062 Posted June 4, 2022 Share Posted June 4, 2022 my question is: ...... which bathroom are these fishy bees s'posed to use ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subdeacon Joe Posted June 4, 2022 Author Share Posted June 4, 2022 2 hours ago, Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 said: One can find similar examples. A Catholic archbishop of Quebec long ago ruled that beavers were fish for purpose of fasting rules, and one in New Orleans made the same determination with respect to alligators. There are other ecclesiastical examples down the ages, including treating birds as fish for Lent. If I recall correctly, heh!, in the Slavic Typicon amphibians and reptiles are allowed during the fasts, as is beer. And the Greek Typicon allows amphibians and beer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Father Kit Cool Gun Garth Posted June 4, 2022 Share Posted June 4, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusty Devil Dale Posted June 5, 2022 Share Posted June 5, 2022 5 hours ago, Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 said: But spinach and brocolli don't have any seeds.... "Fruit" is both a botanical and a culinary term. "Vegetable" just a culinary one. The ancient canard about the tomato notwithstanding, it was always both. Fruit is a reproductive organ of a plant. It usually contains diploid (fertilized) seeds as well as other material that attracts animals to feed on it and thus help disperse the seeds. A vegetable is a vegetative body of a plant, like stems, roots, or leaves, that have no role in reproduction. So an apple or peach contains seeds and so is a fruit. A watermelon, tomato, or ear of corn contains seeds, so they are technically also fruits (actually all three are are berries --they are aggregations of multiple fruits). A stem of celery, leaf of spinach, or a piece of sugar cane is a vegetable. A head of broccoli or cauliflower is also a vegetable. They are flowering heads that at some future point will produce seeds. But because they are harvested before their seeds become mature and fertilized, they are considered vegetables. Regarding the Ca Fish and Game code definition, fish were originally defined many years ago to include inter-tidal invertebrates like clams, abalone, crabs or lobsters. The term "Invertebrates" gradually broadened through case law to include terrestrial invertebrates, including insects, arachnids and anything else alive with no backbone. It's what happens when you mix biology with lawyers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 Posted June 5, 2022 Share Posted June 5, 2022 "Vegetable" is culinary. "Plant" and "fruit" are botanical. At least, this is the precept that I endorse. The status of any part of a plant as a 'vegetable' depends entirely upon its use in cuisine. From a culinary standpoint, the differntiation is also sweet vs. savory. Cut a tomato into a salad, or cook it into a sauce-- it's savory, not sweet. Therefore it is a vegetable, nothwithstanding that it is botanically a fruit Just as there are many culinary nuts that are not botanically "nuts". They are still nuts from the standpoint of human ingestion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgavin Posted June 5, 2022 Share Posted June 5, 2022 Why not? That XY swimmer is a "woman", after all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smuteye John SASS#24774 Posted June 5, 2022 Share Posted June 5, 2022 And Californios get mad when folks make fun of their state. Now do you see why folks make fun of it? Does reality stop at the crest of the Sierra Nevada so your officials can substitute one of their own choosing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusty Devil Dale Posted June 5, 2022 Share Posted June 5, 2022 8 hours ago, Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 said: "Vegetable" is culinary. "Plant" and "fruit" are botanical. At least, this is the precept that I endorse. The status of any part of a plant as a 'vegetable' depends entirely upon its use in cuisine. From a culinary standpoint, the differntiation is also sweet vs. savory. Cut a tomato into a salad, or cook it into a sauce-- it's savory, not sweet. Therefore it is a vegetable, nothwithstanding that it is botanically a fruit Just as there are many culinary nuts that are not botanically "nuts". They are still nuts from the standpoint of human ingestion. After you chew 'em up and swallow 'em, they're all the same. Just protein, fats, carbs, roughage, etc. Sweet, savory, fruits, veggies--none of it matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckshot Bob Posted June 5, 2022 Share Posted June 5, 2022 19 hours ago, Eyesa Horg said: You just can't make this stuff up. Unfortunately it seems they do , more and more often Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subdeacon Joe Posted June 5, 2022 Author Share Posted June 5, 2022 I have to jump in here and admit that I engaged in a bit of sensationalism with the subject line. What that court really said was that the statute has enough stretch in it to cover terrestrial invertebrates as well as aquatic invertebrates. Quote We next consider whether the Commission’s authority is limited to listing only aquatic invertebrates," the ruling stated. "We conclude the answer is, “no.” Although the term fish is colloquially and commonly understood to refer to aquatic species, the term of art employed by the Legislature in the definition of fish in section 45 is not so limited. "We acknowledge the scope of the definition is ambiguous but also recognize we are not interpreting the definition on a blank slate. The legislative history supports the liberal interpretation of the Act (the lens through which we are required to construe the Act) that the Commission may list any invertebrate as an endangered or threatened species. We thus agree with the Commission, the California Department of Fish and Wildlife (Department), and intervenors Xerces Society for Invertebrate Conservation, Defenders of Wildlife, and Center for Food Safety (collectively public interest groups) that the trial court erred when it reached a contrary conclusion. "We accordingly reverse the judgment." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallaby Jack, SASS #44062 Posted June 5, 2022 Share Posted June 5, 2022 That's all well and good ....... but which bathroom do they s'posed to use ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subdeacon Joe Posted June 5, 2022 Author Share Posted June 5, 2022 50 minutes ago, Wallaby Jack, SASS #44062 said: That's all well and good ....... but which bathroom do they s'posed to use ? They just pee in the bushes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. James H. Callahan Posted June 5, 2022 Share Posted June 5, 2022 7 hours ago, Smuteye John SASS#24774 said: And Californios get mad when folks make fun of their state. Now do you see why folks make fun of it? Does reality stop at the crest of the Sierra Nevada so your officials can substitute one of their own choosing? I feel sorry for the good intelligent conservatives (like SASS pards) in California. It's only about 98% of the population and 99.8% of all the politicians that make the rest of the country think they're all idiots. JHC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgavin Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 We live in CA, and are stuck living here until the end of the trail. I fully understand why folks laugh at CA, but it bothers me not. I certainly agree with their opinion of 66% of CA folks, and laugh along with them.2 out of 3 here in CA fit that exact description. However, joking the folks from the Deep South as being inbred, certainly stirs up the animosity, even if it doesn't really apply to them. They really bristle at the image of being thought a slow bumpkin from the family stump with a banjo in their lap. What is missed, is that every bad idea that crawls out of CA or NY eventually becomes the law of the land everywhere else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watab kid Posted June 8, 2022 Share Posted June 8, 2022 theres a reason i no longer practice the religion my mother raised me in , they have way too many opposing views that they accept with the simple phradse - "its a mystery" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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