Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 42 minutes ago, john brown said: I have seen this happen in other games .In an attempt to draw more players they dilute the game awards down to feel good awards where everyone is a champion and a slow decline starts. I'm curious what those other games are. Phantom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Jack Black Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 Did you know that PICKLE BALL is the fastest growing sport in America. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. R. Hugh Kidnme Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 2 hours ago, john brown said: Did you know that PICKLE BALL is the fastest growing sport in America. I gave that sport up because the pickles never seen to bounce off the surface properly. I tried dill, Kosher, sweet, semi -sweet, and all brands Heinz, Mount Olive, Vlasic, ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Jack Black Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 2 hours ago, Capt. R. Hugh Kidnme said: I gave that sport up because the pickles never seen to bounce off the surface properly. I tried dill, Kosher, sweet, semi -sweet, and all brands Heinz, Mount Olive, Vlasic, ....... I find that the ORGANIC kind have a better bounce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hells Comin Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 Have u tried to play with a harder pickle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Hunter SASS #20389L Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 On 3/22/2022 at 10:37 PM, Assassin said: Jim, I agree with too many categories. Some I would consider major others minor. The major categories should go 10 deep, minor categories 3 deep at world and nationals. If only 3 sign up for a category 1 award. The number of categories has become ridiculous, especially when considering cost of awards. Ditto, Like the major/minor category idea. Never has been a right answer to this problem after the door was opened up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Hunter SASS #20389L Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 Haha, Had to Google Pickleball to see what it was. The young'ens would rule that game too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snakebite Posted March 24, 2022 Share Posted March 24, 2022 12 hours ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said: I'm curious what those other games are. Phantom T Ball comes to mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Jack Black Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 19 minutes ago, Snakebite said: T Ball comes to mind. Track ,tennis, some football, Baseball, swimming and on and on This is a psychological incentive to continue playing the game. Remember when everyone gets a trophy no one wins. Now back to the Pickle Ball debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Spur Jake SASS #7728 Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 Since most members of SASS are at least 60 years of age, and did not grow up in the "I should get a trophy because I participated in such and such" , I believe that if you don't beat someone in your category, why should you get an award? I met a shooter that came in last in his category at a state championship, and in the bottom 1% of all shooters, but he was the only shooter from that state in his category, he was the state champion!!!!! IF YOU DON'T BEAT SOMEONE ELSE, YOU DON'T DESERVE A TROPHY. Just an opinion from an old SASS member. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokin Gator SASS #29736 Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 2 hours ago, john brown said: Track ,tennis, some football, Baseball, swimming and on and on This is a psychological incentive to continue playing the game. Remember when everyone gets a trophy no one wins. Now back to the Pickle Ball debate. Most of the "everybody gets an award" is in the kids games/leagues. And many adults will point out that they think that's a bad thing. It's been pointed out that in SASS the percentage of shooters at a big match who qualify for an award is pretty high with the many categories offered. That's one issue. The problem seems to be getting worse though because of the level of quality being expected for each prize down through top 10. The winners buckles/trophies should be high quality but with the number of categories just those add up to a lot let alone top 10 awards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Jack Black Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 21 minutes ago, Smokin Gator SASS #29736 said: Most of the "everybody gets an award" is in the kids games/leagues. And many adults will point out that they think that's a bad thing. It's been pointed out that in SASS the percentage of shooters at a big match who qualify for an award is pretty high with the many categories offered. That's one issue. The problem seems to be getting worse though because of the level of quality being expected for each prize down through top 10. The winners buckles/trophies should be high quality but with the number of categories just those add up to a lot let alone top 10 awards With awards being 10 deep the definition of champion is diluted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 41 minutes ago, john brown said: With awards being 10 deep the definition of champion is diluted. Curious... Have you been to a "big" match? Your understanding of "10 deep" is flawed. 2-10 are not the Champions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Jack Black Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 I won a big PICKLE BALL MATCH does that count? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt. R. Hugh Kidnme Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 1 hour ago, john brown said: I won a big PICKLE BALL MATCH does that count? Remind me to never step on the court with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 given my skill level I wear suspenders, Never would win a buckle to hold up my pants Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Assassin Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 When categories were added they never thought about all the additional sub categories. Funny thing about all the categories, before we added them we had many more members. Same with big and close targets, we had more members prior to 2008. Someone needs to look back and figure out what happened in order to fix the problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hells Comin Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 44 minutes ago, Assassin said: When categories were added they never thought about all the additional sub categories. Funny thing about all the categories, before we added them we had many more members. Same with big and close targets, we had more members prior to 2008. Someone needs to look back and figure out what happened in order to fix the problems. I've attended matches all cross the country over the last 18 years and I can't recall anyone complaining about Big and Close, but many complaints about awards ceremonies being to long! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Assassin Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 23 minutes ago, Hells Comin said: I've attended matches all cross the country over the last 18 years and I can't recall anyone complaining about Big and Close, but many complaints about awards ceremonies being to long! Just saying, I don't think folks wouldn't shoot if they lost their categories or the targets were moved out a couple yards. They abolished modern and traditional and people didn't leave in large numbers. If we get rid of some categories will people quit? Probably not, they'll just be pissed for a while and deal with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straight Arrow Hombre Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 3 hours ago, Assassin said: Just saying, I don't think folks wouldn't shoot if they lost their categories or the targets were moved out a couple yards. They abolished modern and traditional and people didn't leave in large numbers. If we get rid of some categories will people quit? Probably not, they'll just be pissed for a while and deal with it. Which categories would you like to see removed first? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hells Comin Posted March 25, 2022 Share Posted March 25, 2022 Keep Elder Statesmen and put everyone else into one Category. HC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyliefoxEsquire Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 Agreed, condition, all prior winners must shoot cowboy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 4 hours ago, Straight Arrow Hombre said: Which categories would you like to see removed first? I’m almost Senior age however, I don’t see myself moving to Senior… so many age based category breakouts from 60-75+. As for SASS/CAS being a dying sport… that is WRONG. I gave @Misty Moonshine a block of 300 or so postcards to put in new member packets since I’m an Affiliated Merchant… she said, “This will last about a WEEK”. A week! If WE WOULD STOP saying “it’s dying etc…” and be POSITIVE about the sport… we might have a different perspective. HUGS! Scarlett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 38 minutes ago, Scarlett said: I’m almost Senior age however, I don’t see myself moving to Senior… so many age based category breakouts from 60-75+. As for SASS/CAS being a dying sport… that is WRONG. I gave @Misty Moonshine a block of 300 or so postcards to put in new member packets since I’m an Affiliated Merchant… she said, “This will last about a WEEK”. A week! If WE WOULD STOP saying “it’s dying etc…” and be POSITIVE about the sport… we might have a different perspective. HUGS! Scarlett Unless the positioning of SASS changes, it'll die. Markets change and companies that adjust die out. Wishing this wasn't true won't change this. Phantom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Assassin Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 6 hours ago, Straight Arrow Hombre said: Which categories would you like to see removed first? I wouldn't like to see them removed. It would be a difficult decision. Probably just look at the least populated categories and start there. Even some of the WB have admitted the addition of categories was out of control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branchwater Jack SASS #88854 Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 41 minutes ago, Assassin said: I wouldn't like to see them removed. It would be a difficult decision. Probably just look at the least populated categories and start there. Even some of the WB have admitted the addition of categories was out of control. If more categories are considered bad for the sport, I wonder, then, why SASS unilaterally added 2 new categories to the SHB this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogmeat Dad, SASS #48563L Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 4 minutes ago, Branchwater Jack SASS #88854 said: If more categories are considered bad for the sport, I wonder, then, why SASS unilaterally added 4 new categories to the SHB this year? I saw two, El Rey and La Reina. What were the other two? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branchwater Jack SASS #88854 Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 2 minutes ago, Dogmeat Dad, SASS #48563L said: I saw two, El Rey and La Reina. What were the other two? You're right. My bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dogmeat Dad, SASS #48563L Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 18 minutes ago, Branchwater Jack SASS #88854 said: You're right. My bad. No problem, I thought I may have missed something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe LaFives #5481 Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 actually that's not two categories - its at least 16 El Rey La Reina El Rey B-Western La Reina B-Western El Rey Gunfighter La Reina Gunfigther El Rey Duelist La Reina Duelist El Rey Frontier Cartridge La Reina Frontier Cartridge El Rey Frontier Cartridge Duelist La Reina Frontier Cartridge Duelist El Rey Frontier Cartridge Gunfighter La Reina Frontier Cartridge Gunfighter El Rey Classic Cowboy La Reina Classic Cowgirl probably missed a couple Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe LaFives #5481 Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 7 hours ago, Straight Arrow Hombre said: Which categories would you like to see removed first? I'd toss B-Western and Classic since you could always shoot other categories with those firearms and styles and clothes. I'd make categories for ages 10 years apart for anything senior and above to start Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennessee williams Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 1 minute ago, Joe LaFives #5481 said: I'd toss B-Western and Classic since you could always shoot other categories with those firearms and styles and clothes. I'd make categories for ages 10 years apart for anything senior and above to start Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Assassin Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 19 minutes ago, Branchwater Jack SASS #88854 said: If more categories are considered bad for the sport, I wonder, then, why SASS unilaterally added 2 new categories to the SHB this year? Is adding categories helping to grow SASS? Adding categories is just appeasing age groups today, nothing against them. Also, allowing older shooters to shoot in a younger category and adding more categories for older shooters make no sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe LaFives #5481 Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 On 3/23/2022 at 4:00 PM, Phantom, SASS #54973 said: Either would have been fine with me. I know folks were really hoping to get their "bronze" horsey trophy thingie for winning their category... Not the painted Cowboy. Someone or some people were definitely not in sync with their Customers. Phantom We would have loved to have the Remington's as first prize. As a match we were known for it. When SASS dictates the shooting categories and the addition ones that we had to offer (with zero additional contestants). We simply could not afford it and maintain the cost. You may remember that we ran a survey 3-5 years ago where we asked if folks wanted the same trophies or more categories - most said the trophies but now that we became the World Championship we didn't have the choice to limit the categories like we were before. Additionally as I've mentioned before. When EOT was at founders, the trophies were not great those last years. The Plastic Globes were not nearly as nice as the Remington's. And they stopped giving out the nice pewter "SASS Marshal's" after 2015-2016. In 2017 the awards were sponsored by the NRA and yet the trophies were worse than before. (My 2nd place was a wooden plaque not a Marshal for example) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Jack Black Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 7 hours ago, Joe LaFives #5481 said: We would have loved to have the Remington's as first prize. As a match we were known for it. When SASS dictates the shooting categories and the addition ones that we had to offer (with zero additional contestants). We simply could not afford it and maintain the cost. You may remember that we ran a survey 3-5 years ago where we asked if folks wanted the same trophies or more categories - most said the trophies but now that we became the World Championship we didn't have the choice to limit the categories like we were before. Additionally as I've mentioned before. When EOT was at founders, the trophies were not great those last years. The Plastic Globes were not nearly as nice as the Remington's. And they stopped giving out the nice pewter "SASS Marshal's" after 2015-2016. In 2017 the awards were sponsored by the NRA and yet the trophies were worse than before. (My 2nd place was a wooden plaque not a Marshal for example) Easy fix seeing YOUR club is actually in control 1 Raise fees 2 cut back on categories 3 set your club standards and stick to them and tell SASS HQ your requirements. Called tough LOVE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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