WATCH IT PARDS

[Dusty Devil Dale]

1 hour ago, bgavin said:

It is sad to hear about anybody dying from this.

However... that 34 year old mom knowingly took up residence in an infected persons bedroom.
She intentionally violated "quarantine" and she intentionally exposed herself to COVID.

 

Actually, the quarantine does not apply against persons already residing in the same household, for obvious reasons.

We all have significant personal responsibility to protect against infection.
Intentionally putting ourselves in harm's way is not taking responsibility.

 

I fail to see how this family's exposure was in any way elective or intentional

Q: did the Mom perform all the vigorous sterilization of the room, and disinfect all surfaces on a constant basis?

 

Yes

Q: did the Mom being the regimen of Zinc, L-Lysine, Vit-C and Vit-D?

 

The Mom meticulously  followed the advice of their family physician -- an Internist who is Board Certified in Infectious Disease Care and the head of Infectious Disease for tge largest hospital in the region . 

 

The vitamins and Zinc that you described are, as yet, not the standard of medical care for COVID.  The Vitamin D3 supplement could help reduce inflammation, but it is uncommon for outdoor people to have Vitamin D3 deficiency.  Taking it supplementally would only enrich the sewer, because the kidneys would remove and flush the excess. 

 

Q: did the Mom who intentionally violated quarantine do so with a fresh N95 mask on a 24x7 basis?

 

She violated nothing,  but did wear a double NIOSH  N-95, as recommended by her consulting physicians. 

 

Q: did the Mom begin a rigorous steaming of her nose and sinus cavities as a preventative after moving into a COVID environment?

 

That is unproven not the standard of medical practice for COVID exposed people.  

 

Q: dis the Mom constantly sterilize her hands and avoid touching her face?

 

You're obviously trying to make the case that this woman was not a victim, but rather an irresponsible imbecile.  Sorry, that's just not the case here.  She and her husband both carefully followed her very capable medical advice ( rather than doing whatever the Internet advised. )

 

She did not survive long enough for me to quiz her, or try to blame her for what was blatant irresponsibility on the part of the School Board and the parents who hysterically influenced them to violate the State Medical Examiner's order requiring persons to wear a mask indoors when other people are  present.  

Q: was all the exposed bedding and clothing washed every single day?

 

They followed their best medical advice

Q: was the infected child in a fresh mask 24x7?

Again, they followed their best medical advice

Or, did the Mom blindly believe the propaganda from those damn fools who push vaccines as a false panacea, so she did none of the above, and it killed her

 

The Mom was a victim..  You need to get over denying it. 

I think I'm about done with this one.  Believe whatever you wish to believe from whatever source you like.  As for me. I prefer to rely on properly licensed physicians,  of which my wife is one, for my medical advice.   

 

Some of us are still grieving over this loss.  She was left with few choices, because other selfish idiots preempted all of them.  That's the undeniable fact. 

Like most diseases, COVID passes by hands to eyes, nose and mouth.

These are the entry points, and the reason why constant sterilization of hands and surfaces is MANDATORY with this bug.

My Dad was a doctor and he POUNDED that lesson into me as a kid.

 

I'm sure her physicians told her that, if she didn't already know it and practice it (unlikely).  She was a highly educated woman.  

COVID resides in the nose, sinus and throat area before it descends into the lungs.
Exposure to hot steam KILLS the bug.

 

I don't think hot steam up the nose  is an accepted medical treatment for COVID nasal infection.  Hospitals certainly are not doing it.  

true hot steam temperatures would likely stress or injure nasal and sinus linings and weaken their natural immunity. 

Two of my daughters are R.N.s and balls-deep in COVID, along with all the other nurses who work those 12 and 16 hours shifts in the COVID wards.
They understand the need for the above protocols, which is why they have worked 2+ years around these patients without getting infected.

 

That is why hospitals have infectious disease protocols-- to protect their staff from diseases brought in by people who catch the disease by either refusing to take precautions, or who had their options to do so preempted by poor decisions made by others around them.  

Attempting to blame that Mom's death on parents objecting to masks is a cop-out.

 

I vehemently disagree.  The family was sequestered at home, except for the children attending school.  This couple did not eat away from home, attend church, visit friends, enter stores to shop (used curbside delivery) and both worked from home in a remote ranch house for the past year.  Neither was in poor health.  The decision made by the School Board directly forced them to either become exposed or violate State truancy law.  

It is up to each of us to follow the sterilization protocols to keep us from infection.

 

And how do we do that while our kids are at school catching it from less careful  kids?  It's time to face the reality that if the Board had required masks, everybody's kids would have been better protected, just like your nurse daughters are protected by wearing masks which I'm sure are required where they work.  

Blindly trusting an experimental shot and experimental booster as a replacement for protecting one's self is a fool's errand, and doing so does kill people.

 

 

I inserted my responses above.  Like I said, I'm about done with this thread.  People are firmly set In their belief systems, and aren't going to be influenced by anything we write here.  Believe as you will.  DDD

[Slapshot]

8 hours ago, Dusty Devil Dale said:

We do have that right to own a gun, but we don't have a right to fire that gun irresponsibly into the air to enjoy celebrating New Years Eve, disregarding other persons life or safety.  All of those other people have interfacing Constitutional Rights too and we have no right to ignore and step on them.   

 

We all have a right to choose whether or not to be vaccinated.  For some it is a harder and more complicated choice than it is for others.  And the media and a few irresponsible, grandstanding medical people continue to further confuse people. 

 

The different vaccines clearly aren't for everybody and they protects (or threaten) different people differentialy.   So I agree the choice whether or not to be vaccinated is a personal choice that needs to be individually made by people consulting with their own medical professionals who know their particular medical situation.  But a part of that consideration ought to be understanding the added risk that we present to others around us by remaining less protected.  

 

Factually speaking, a person cannot contract the COVID virus from the contents of the several vaccines.  People can have serious  adverse side reactions, but those reactions are not the virus itself --at least not virus caught from the vaccine.  Cases where vacvine-caused infection have been reported all had side exposure to many other people in the vaccine time frame. 

 

I guess the wearing of a mask to reduce our likelihood of being an unknowing COVID spreader is a personal choice too.  But the choice to just put on a painless, risk-less mask in crowds or indoors in order to help protect the other people around us, seems to me to be a very small compromise toward practicing common decency.  Just asserting that everyone else can stay confined at home so that we can be free to make our own choices (choices that otherwise would increase their risk of  endangerment), falls someplace short of that common decency, IMO.   

 

 

If your vaccine and mask work then you take/wear them and leave others to their own decisions. You nor anyone else has the right to tell someone they HAVE to take the vaccine. 

Hell you don't even know what the long term side effects are now do you? But you think it's fine to force people to do something with their own body that they choose not to or think dangerous to them. Shame on you.

If you are scared of catching it stay home, take the vaccine and all the miracle boosters you want. Thats what me and the wife did for almost a year. Except me who had to keep working offshore in order to eat. But at home the wife and I didn't go allot of places. I certainly didn't and want advocate for others to put a unproven drug into their body. I think it is very irresponsible of others to tell other people what medicines they have to take. Especially something that was rushed and untested as this vaccine.

 

At the end of the day its your responsibility to protect yourself. Not my job. Take all the experimental drugs/vaccines you want,  wear 2 masks if you want to. Just don't try and shame me if I choose not to.

 

And as far as being a unknown covid spreader I think last I heard it was the people with vaccines that had very mild symptoms that was unknowingly spreading it. Common decency is not telling someone to put chemicals in their body they don't want. Or does that common decency thing only work to your benefit?

 

[Slapshot]

5 hours ago, Dusty Devil Dale said:

I inserted my responses above.  Like I said, I'm about done with this thread.  People are firmly set In their belief systems, and aren't going to be influenced by anything we write here.  Believe as you will.  DDD

Exactly even you are firmly set in your beliefs. So why get mad when others are just as set in theirs?

[Dusty Devil Dale]

2 hours ago, Slapshot said:

If your vaccine and mask work then you take/wear them and leave others to their own decisions. You nor anyone else has the right to tell someone they HAVE to take the vaccine. 

Hell you don't even know what the long term side effects are now do you? But you think it's fine to force people to do something with their own body that they choose not to or think dangerous to them. Shame on you.

If you are scared of catching it stay home, take the vaccine and all the miracle boosters you want. Thats what me and the wife did for almost a year. Except me who had to keep working offshore in order to eat. But at home the wife and I didn't go allot of places. I certainly didn't and want advocate for others to put a unproven drug into their body. I think it is very irresponsible of others to tell other people what medicines they have to take. Especially something that was rushed and untested as this vaccine.

 

At the end of the day its your responsibility to protect yourself. Not my job. Take all the experimental drugs/vaccines you want,  wear 2 masks if you want to. Just don't try and shame me if I choose not to.

 

And as far as being a unknown covid spreader I think last I heard it was the people with vaccines that had very mild symptoms that was unknowingly spreading it. Common decency is not telling someone to put chemicals in their body they don't want. Or does that common decency thing only work to your benefit?

 

I believe I was very specific NOT to advocate the everyone be required to take the vaccine.  Read more carefully. 

What I said was:

 

"The different vaccines clearly aren't for everybody and they protect (or threaten) different people differentialy.   So I agree the choice whether or not to be vaccinated is a personal choice that needs to be individually made by people consulting with their own medical professionals who know their particular medical situation."

 

I cannot see how I could have been any more clear. 

[Slapshot]

10 hours ago, Dusty Devil Dale said:

 

 

I guess the wearing of a mask to reduce our likelihood of being an unknowing COVID spreader is a personal choice too.  But the choice to just put on a painless, risk-less mask in crowds or indoors in order to help protect the other people around us, seems to me to be a very small compromise toward practicing common decency.  Just asserting that everyone else can stay confined at home so that we can be free to make our own choices (choices that otherwise would increase their risk of  endangerment), falls someplace short of that common decency, IMO.   

 

 

But yet you chastise those that don't want to wear a mask.

 

How is it if a mask works that if you wear one and I don't you aren't protected? 

[Dusty Devil Dale]

2 hours ago, Slapshot said:

If your vaccine and mask work then you take/wear them and leave others to their own decisions. You nor anyone else has the right to tell someone they HAVE to take the vaccine. 

Hell you don't even know what the long term side effects are now do you? But you think it's fine to force people to do something with their own body that they choose not to or think dangerous to them. Shame on you.

If you are scared of catching it stay home, take the vaccine and all the miracle boosters you want. Thats what me and the wife did for almost a year. Except me who had to keep working offshore in order to eat. But at home the wife and I didn't go allot of places. I certainly didn't and want advocate for others to put a unproven drug into their body. I think it is very irresponsible of others to tell other people what medicines they have to take. Especially something that was rushed and untested as this vaccine.

 

At the end of the day its your responsibility to protect yourself. Not my job. Take all the experimental drugs/vaccines you want,  wear 2 masks if you want to. Just don't try and shame me if I choose not to.

 

And as far as being a unknown covid spreader I think last I heard it was the people with vaccines that had very mild symptoms that was unknowingly spreading it. Common decency is not telling someone to put chemicals in their body they don't want. Or does that common decency thing only work to your benefit?

 

Who said anything about telling people to put chemicals in their body?  

[Dusty Devil Dale]

1 hour ago, Slapshot said:

But yet you chastise those that don't want to wear a mask.

 

How is it if a mask works that if you wear one and I don't you aren't protected? 

I think you made my point.  My mask does NOT work as well if others don't also wear one. 

 

Keep in mind that the purpose of the mask isn't to make a showing or political statement.  It's only purpose is to intercept moisture droplets carrying viral material, keeping them external to a person's respiratory system.   Generally speaking, an N-95 mask does that at the 95% level for moisture droplet-size particles.  Simply put, infected moisture droplets captured by a mask do not make it inside you.  

 

If you walk through a store that was visited by an unknowingly infected person who coughed while not wearing a mask, 5 or 10 minutes (or even an hour) before you arrived, their virus populated moisture droplets are still suspended in the air and distributed by the store's ventilation system. If their coughs occurred just seconds or a minute before you walk down the same isle, you are passing and breathing through a fairly dense cloud of viral droplets. 

 

If you wear no mask, it is quite easy for viral particles to be picked up and deposited into your respiratory pathway in large enough numbers to initiate a new infection.  (viral particle numbers are hugely important). 

 

Conversely, if you DO properly wear an N-95 mask, your chances of picking up a large enough dose from those distributed moisture droplets is greatly reduced -- probably only about 5% with an N-95.  

 

If the other person had also worn an N-95 mask,  the number of moisture droplets that they left suspended in the air would have been greatly reduced and the  chances of a large enough dose being transmitted is much reduced.  

 

If you have been vaccinated and timely boostered, the intent of the vaccine is to stimulate your IGG immunity to immediately create enough natural antibodies to block the attachment sites of the viral particles to your cells. 

 

You also have another immune system, T-cell immunity, that maintains another kind of longer-term antibodies that actually directly attack any unrecognized protein particles, including viruses, and destroy them.  T-cell immunity is more long-term, and isn't reliant on timely vaccine stimulation. But T-cell levels can vary a great deal between people, so it is not, of itself, entirely predictable as protection. 

 

So if the infected person wears a mask, you wear a mask, and your immune system is in good enough order (naturally or from a vaccine), the numbers of viral particles actually invading and attaching to your cells is controlled below the number needed to install a new infection.  

 

The big issue with the Omicron Variant is that it requires a much smaller (1/10 as much) dose to grow into a viable new infection.  

 

The virus doesn't know anything about principles, beliefs, or politics.  It only understands infection opportunity, which is greatly interrupted by wearing of masks, social distancing, and natural or vaccine-stimulated immunity.  

 

Natural immunity is a very complex subject.  It is affected by genetics, diet/vitamin availability, background health condition (immuno-compromise) and to a degree by lifestyle.  But natural immunity was not, of itself, adequately protecting people; consequently many folks contracted infection that their natural system could not effectively combat and they died --over 3/4 million of them in the US alone.  That is why CDC and most MDs all say to do the same things:

 

> Wear a mask

>  Wash your hands frequently and liberally use hand sanitizer for at least 20 seconds. 

> Encourage those around you to wear a mask --particularly indoors.

> Avoid crowded or confined places where others are present.

> maintain 6 feet between yourself and others where possible.

> be careful about what you touch and be aware of where your hands go afterwards until they are washed.

> Don't touch your or others mask without first sanitizing your hands thoroughly.

> Follow your doctor's advice about getting vaccinated and timely boostered.

> Use common sense and immediately leave places where people appear ill, and particularly if they are actively coughing or sneezing.

> avoid eating in public venues. 

 

 

[Slapshot]

The CDC and the WHO along with Fauci say allot of things. But you know what they have told so many different stories about covid according to the agenda at the time they are like the little boy that cried wolf.

 

You proved my point by saying masks are ineffective. Use common sense don't go out if you feel your PPE isn't enough to protect you. But the problem is the saying common sense is a total joke. Everyone has a different opinion what common sense is. Everyone should just do what they feel is necessary and leave others alone.

 

What's the old saying your rights stop where mine begin? But just whos rights take precedence? Yours cause you feel one should do a certain thing or mine because I believe in freedom of choice? I fully respect your right to wear masks, take vaccines, boosters or not, what ever you feel necessary to keep you safe. How about respecting others rights to do the same.

 

I think I'll just agree to disagree with you. I hope you have a good day and hope you stay safe and covid free.

[Dusty Devil Dale]

3 hours ago, Slapshot said:

The CDC and the WHO along with Fauci say allot of things. But you know what they have told so many different stories about covid according to the agenda at the time they are like the little boy that cried wolf.

 

You proved my point by saying masks are ineffective. Use common sense don't go out if you feel your PPE isn't enough to protect you. But the problem is the saying common sense is a total joke. Everyone has a different opinion what common sense is. Everyone should just do what they feel is necessary and leave others alone.

 

What's the old saying your rights stop where mine begin? But just whos rights take precedence? Yours cause you feel one should do a certain thing or mine because I believe in freedom of choice? I fully respect your right to wear masks, take vaccines, boosters or not, what ever you feel necessary to keep you safe. How about respecting others rights to do the same.

 

I think I'll just agree to disagree with you. I hope you have a good day and hope you stay safe and covid free.

If you think I proved your point, then you didn't read accurately.   But agreeing to disagree is the best course at this point.  We aren't making progress here.

 

Best of health to you and those around you.  

[Possum Stu]

[irish ike, SASS #43615]

On 2/12/2022 at 9:34 PM, Dusty Devil Dale said:

What you described is criminal (felony) insurance fraud, whether against private insurance or taxpayers.  People doing what you describe are actively being investigated and prosecuted. 

Yeah but....who's going to turn them in. The doctor says its covid, then its covid.

[irish ike, SASS #43615]

A few things;

1. My doctor doesn't wear a mask and he knows I'm not vaccinated!

2.  We went for 2 years with everyone wearing anything for masks. Now suddenly you're at great risk if you're not wearing an N95.

3.  I saw a neighbor out shoveling his driveway with a mask on. There was 2" of snow and it proves he bought into the worlds coming to an end agenda. Both made want to stop and ask if he is a slow adult?