Duelist style

[Singin' Sue 71615]

18 hours ago, Sedalia Dave said:

 

Its only a SDQ if you have two LOADED pistols "in hand" at the same time. As long as the first pistol no longer has unfired rounds in it you can draw and fire the second pistol without reholstering the first pistol.

 

HOWEVER, if you have one or more unfired rounds in pistol 1 you have to reholster it BEFORE drawing pistol 2.

 

At end of the pistol shooting string, both pistols have to be returned to leather unless stage instructions state otherwise.

 

 

 

I may be wrong...but I think he is talking SDQ from breaking the 170° with the 'shot' pistol?

'Hanging straight down', muzzle down.?

[Singin' Sue 71615]

On 1/31/2022 at 10:19 AM, Tennessee williams said:

I like to watch Duelist videos too. Not only to see what people do "right", but also to see what I would have changed on the run. You'll be surprised at the number of mess up and brain farts you will see from all kinds of shooters. See that offhand pistol just hanging straight down while the other one is being fired? Yeah, don't do that. That's a SDQ. 

Breaking 170° with offhand/shot pistol?

[Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life]

1 hour ago, Singin' Sue 71615 said:

Breaking 170° with offhand/shot pistol?

correct. See also Randy St Eagles replies.

In TW's original post he stated the muzzle was hanging straight (not being reholstered) implying 90 degrees down

SHB pg 17

The 170° Rule
The 170° rule means the muzzle of a firearm must always be straight down range (+/– 85° in
any direction).

SHB pg 22

STAGE DISQUALIFICATION PENALTY (SDQ

Violation of the 170° Safety Rule/Failure to maintain appropriate muzzle control

If loaded then MDQ would apply

SHB pg 23

MATCH DISQUALIFICATION PENALTIES (MDQ

Sweeping anyone with a loaded firearm

Regards

   

Gateway Kid

 

[Texas Jack Black]

 Looks like we are going off topic??

[H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619]

Cone of Safety!

[Cool Hand Luke]

On the same topic sort of, i plan to shoot duelist, but don't see too many videos for crossdraw, may just not be looking in the right places. Any good suggestions for crossdraw videos?

[Mister Badly]

13 minutes ago, Cool Hand Luke said:

On the same topic sort of, i plan to shoot duelist, but don't see too many videos for crossdraw, may just not be looking in the right places. Any good suggestions for crossdraw videos?

https://youtu.be/GVnQXopxPzQ

[Singin' Sue 71615]

2 hours ago, john brown said:

 Looks like we are going off topic??

Hmmm....it is if you are only interested in 'watching' videos...

 

[Randy Saint Eagle, SASS # 64903]

34 minutes ago, Cool Hand Luke said:

On the same topic sort of, i plan to shoot duelist, but don't see too many videos for crossdraw, may just not be looking in the right places. Any good suggestions for crossdraw videos?

This is just one but check YouTube for Amaduelist.

 

 

Randy

[Abilene, SASS # 27489]

59 minutes ago, Cool Hand Luke said:

On the same topic sort of, i plan to shoot duelist, but don't see too many videos for crossdraw, may just not be looking in the right places. Any good suggestions for crossdraw videos?

Here's my take.  Double duelist is not possible with a crossdraw, so that eliminates them.  And for regular duelist, having your offhand on the gun ready to draw it after the strongside is shot is going to be slightly faster than X-draw.  I don't shoot duelist, but seems to make sense.

[Anvil Al #59168]

1 hour ago, Cool Hand Luke said:

On the same topic sort of, i plan to shoot duelist, but don't see too many videos for crossdraw, may just not be looking in the right places. Any good suggestions for crossdraw videos?

 

 

Most (not all) Duelist are shooting it as Double Duelist. 

 

I see very few Duelist anymore shooting using the same hand. 

 

There are a few and some of them can still be pretty fast. 

[Anvil Al #59168]

Hendo.

I don't want to give unsolicited advice.

But if you want it. I see several things in that run that could 

help with transitions. 

[El Muerto Negro]

On 1/29/2022 at 7:17 PM, Dutch Coroner said:

T-Bone Dooley and El Muerto Negro

 

T-Bone’s entire 2017 EOT match is on You Tube. 

Dutch Coroner he's being very humble by not mentioning himself. 

 

EMN

[Hendo]

48 minutes ago, Anvil Al #59168 said:

Hendo.

I don't want to give unsolicited advice.

But if you want it. I see several things in that run that could 

help with transitions. 

I'll always take advice, solicited or otherwise. Tried to send you a message, but it sezs you ain't taking PM's.

[Cowtown Scout, SASS #53540 L]

1 hour ago, Anvil Al #59168 said:

 

 

Most (not all) Duelist are shooting it as Double Duelist. 

 

I see very few Duelist anymore shooting using the same hand. 

 

There are a few and some of them can still be pretty fast. 

I tried to shoot double duelist for two years but gave up as my left hand would not cooperate. Went back to shooting with my right hand only.

[Randy Saint Eagle, SASS # 64903]

1 hour ago, Cowtown Scout, SASS #53540 L said:

I tried to shoot double duelist for two years but gave up as my left hand would not cooperate. Went back to shooting with my right hand only.

For shooting strong hand only check out Doc Roy L Pain, the fastest single duelist shooter I know!

 

 

Randy

[Singin' Sue 71615]

2 hours ago, Anvil Al #59168 said:

 

 

Most (not all) Duelist are shooting it as Double Duelist. 

 

I see very few Duelist anymore shooting using the same hand. 

 

There are a few and some of them can still be pretty fast. 

I am slower shooting Duelist than two handed.

I can only shoot with my strong hand. With that said, I can start with my left pistol, transfering to my right hand. Then transfering back to my left hand and without holstering (and keeping muzzle down range) then can go to target straight from my right holster with right hand.

BUT, can cause a 170° and I just chose to reholster my 'shot' gun.

[Juiceharp Jen]

On 1/30/2022 at 6:06 PM, Cowtown Scout, SASS #53540 L said:

I have small hands and prefer lowered hammers. Do not like the Bisley grips they just don't fit my hands. You should actually shoot different revolvers to see which works best for you.

Plus one. I have Bisleys and regular Vaqueros. The lowered hammers are a must for me to shoot gunfighter. With the right grips, I can handle the Bisleys, but they are not more comfortable.

[Anvil Al #59168]

Yes. Doc Roy L Pain is one of THE best.

Fast and smooth. 

That video does not show just how smooth he normally is. 

 

[Anvil Al #59168]

12 hours ago, Hendo said:

I'll always take advice, solicited or otherwise. Tried to send you a message, but it sezs you ain't taking PM's.

 

 

OK. The one thing a DD can do is to whenever possible have the off hand doing something.

So in this one. Stand and deliver. Rifle first. You being left handed. After shooting the rifle. Put it down with the right hand

instead of the left. That gets it out of the way for the shotgun. And also lets you get you left hand on your left pistol and the same time.

While shooting left pistole. Right hand on right pistol. holster left while pulling right. THEN. that leaves your left hand open.

By staging the shotgun a little closer to you. You can then get that left hand on the shotgun while you are shooting the right pistol.

Then you always have the off hand doing something and already on the next gun.

With DD it's all in the transitions. 

[Randy Saint Eagle, SASS # 64903]

3 hours ago, Anvil Al #59168 said:

Yes. Doc Roy L Pain is one of THE best.

Fast and smooth. 

That video does not show just how smooth he normally is. 

 

I agree but I couldn’t find many videos of him.

 

 Randy 

[Billy Boots, # 20282 LTG-Regulator]

18 hours ago, Randy Saint Eagle, SASS # 64903 said:

For shooting strong hand only check out Doc Roy L Pain, the fastest single duelist shooter I know!

 

 

Randy

Yes he is for a fact.  And, one heck a  nice guy.  One of the few duelist I remember betting Nuttin when in his "hay day".  US Open, around 2011 as I remember.  He is not shabby with BP either.  I'm just glad he is a few years younger than me which sometimes keeps us out of same category.  He has a June birthday and I kind of keep tabs on that sometimes.   Kind of like that Eagle fellow and JMB.  And, I sure know to watch out for Al,  PS Parker, and Naildriver when shooting smokeless.  Them youngsters EMN and HTH are sort of in a level all their on so I know me and Al try to stay clear of them. 

Ain't none of it easy, with the black stuff them youngsters like Boss Outlaw, Straight Arrow Hombre, Calhoun Kid,   Confederate Colt, and Phantom(well, maybe not that young) are a bunch of tough guys to go up against.  Us older guys like my buddies Stone Creek, Bear Trap,  Tame Bill and Big Iron Buster are still battling it out, as we have for so many years.  (yea I keep track of Stoney's age too).

Wow, and so many great ones from past who don't shoot much and/or duelist anymore...a few that come to mind like Handsome Valentine, FJT, Texas Paladin, Macon, Four Bucks, Lefty Eastman, Nikki Sixgun and so many more.

[Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life]

6 minutes ago, Billy Boots, # 20282 LTG-Regulator said:

Yes he is for a fact.  And, one heck a  nice guy.  One of the few duelist I remember betting Nuttin when in his "hay day".  US Open, around 2011 as I remember.  He is not shabby with BP either.  I'm just glad he is a few years younger than me which sometimes keeps us out of same category.  He has a June birthday and I kind of keep tabs on that sometimes.   Kind of like that Eagle fellow and JMB.  And, I sure know to watch out for Al,  PS Parker, and Naildriver when shooting smokeless.  Them youngsters EMN and HTH are sort of in a level all their on so I know me and Al try to stay clear of them. 

Ain't none of it easy, with the black stuff them youngsters like Boss Outlaw, Straight Arrow Hombre, Calhoun Kid,   and Phantom are a bunch of tough.  Us older guys like my buddies Stone Creek, Bear Trap,  Tame Bill and Big Iron Buster are still battling it out, as we have for so many years.  (yea I keep track of Stoney's age too).

Wow, and so many great ones from past who don't shoot much and/or duelist anymore...a few that come to mind like Handsome Valentine, FJT, Texas Paladin, Macon, Four Bucks, Lefty Eastman, Nikki Sixgun and so many more.

Now there is a list of shooters who could start their own "hall of fame"

Certainly some of the best.

Regards

   

Gateway Kid

[Texas Jack Black]

 I want to thank all for the help. SASS is such a friendly group of people.

[doc roy l. pain]

Let’s see if I can get a couple to load 

[Boomstick Bruce]

On 1/29/2022 at 6:37 PM, john brown said:

 I am thinking about shooting Duelist and have been looking for videos of the top duelists I have found a few like  Pecos Nick,  and Hair trigger Hayes. Are there any others I could watch ? 

 

Thank You

 

As long as those fast guys stay on their side of the Appalachians I guess I'm pretty safe. I'm not fast, just the fastest in WV, which really isn't saying much...lol...

 

My suggestion, if you shoot one handed (not double duelist), fire the weak hand pistol first so you're drawing the strong side as you holster the weak side. My rig is double strong, no crossdraw. I switched to duelist while my rig was being made so I adapted to the rig. Honestly, I don't think I would be any faster transitioning from one pistol to the other with a crossdraw. Cut your transition times, make sure your hands are always doing something, you don't have to be a faster shooter if the other duelists stand in one spot while holstering their guns and you're moving while holstering. If the stage requires you to fire the pistols last, don't waste time holstering, just ground them. A lot of times I holster both at the same time, I'll draw the left, fire it from my right hand, transition it to my left hand and hold it, draw the right, fire it and then holster both on the move to the next shooting position but that depends on what the next gun is.

 

Say the sequence is pistol, shotgun, rifle. I'll draw left pistol, fire it from my right hand, transfer it to my left and holster it as I'm drawing the right pistol. I fire it and as I holster the right pistol, I'm also moving to the shotgun and grabbing 2 shells with my left hand. Say its P,R,S... I'll draw the left as usual, fire, holster while drawing the right, as I'm moving and holstering the right, my left hand is reaching for my rifle. As I'm putting the rifle down, I'm already moving to the shotgun drawing two shells on the way. Make sure your hands are always doing something while you're moving.

[Texas Jack Black]

9 hours ago, doc roy l. pain said:

Let’s see if I can get a couple to load 

DA2E65EC-83B6-413A-AC2E-DC2F17685836.mov 9.21 MB · 14 downloads 12120E90-08C3-4381-94E8-91B8C181A3E3.mov 7.48 MB · 4 downloads

 Great videos thank You

[Anvil Al #59168]

Here is one I find kind of funny. 

List of what not to do. Like reaching for the holster while the

pistols are staged. Not getting a good grip. And. Putting pistol down before

you get that last shot off.  We got a good laugh out of it. 

 

 

[doc roy l. pain]

Here’s one from this past EOT 

[Billy Boots, # 20282 LTG-Regulator]

13 minutes ago, doc roy l. pain said:

Here’s one from this past EOT 

4397CCB7-73D7-4260-B36A-9C1DEBE3E079.mov 4.41 MB · 0 downloads

good run. seems like that was the Duece sweep.  Good posse.

[Texas Jack Black]

  Another question I see Double shotguns and pumps is there a benefit of one over the other?

 

Thank you

[doc roy l. pain]

3 minutes ago, john brown said:

  Another question I see Double shotguns and pumps is there a benefit of one over the other?

 

Thank you

Speed wise they can be run the same by top shooters using either one. Most top duelist I know use doubles simply because they’re less likely to have mechanical failures due to their simpler mechanisms. 

[Shooting Bull]

44 minutes ago, john brown said:

  Another question I see Double shotguns and pumps is there a benefit of one over the other?

 

Thank you

 

As with anything, it depends on the shooter.  Dixie Bell once told me how long it takes each time you have to go to your shotgun belt to get fresh shells.  I can't remember the exact number. But on a 4 shotgun stage a SxS shooter has to go to their belt twice grabbing two shells each time.  A pump shooter who can grab and shoot four shells only has to go once.  The time difference is even more pronounced on a 6 shotgun stage.  

[Anvil Al #59168]

I have seen some really good shooters with a 97 switch to the double just

because of consistency. They might be a little faster with the 97 for 8-9 of the ten

stages. But that wreck on the one stage cost them more than they gained in the other stages.

 

 

 

Looking at some of the names on this post. Dang. We have some really good Duelist shooters out there.

I love talking about shooting Duelist. 

[Turkey Legs #48384]

I started shooting Duelist a couple of years ago. Fell in love with it and haven't looked back. To let you know I watched and asked a lot of questions from El Muerto Negro, Doc Roy L Pain, Iron Maiden, Yellowstone Vic, Dakota Wild Kat and many others. I have found that I like to use only one hand and love to use a cross draw. Like others have said it is all in the practice you put in. I am a left and right hand shooter - being left-eye dominant so I shoot my pistols right handed and everything else left handed. Makes for some interesting transitions sometimes. Here is a video with some mishaps but you just keep going.