.38 Special or .357?

[Crusty Knees]

My rifle will cycle flawlessly either .357 Magnum cases and a 125gr bullet or a .38 Special with a 125gr bullet.  My revolvers are .357s so yeah, they'll do either just fine.

For cowboy loads, the data is pretty similar.  After shooting both, I couldn't tell a difference.  So, no problem.

 

I have a good supply of both length cases.   That got me to wondering.  For cowboy shooting, is there any advantage to using one over the other?

 

Thanks,

CK

 

 

[July Smith]

4 minutes ago, Crusty Knees said:

 For cowboy shooting, is there any advantage to using one over the other?

 

Not really one better than the other for this sport.  38s are typically cheaper if not almost free, so that is an advantage in some ways.  If you use 357 brass you will be able to tell if you get your brass back or not because I am willing to bet 99% of your other posse members won't be using 357 brass.

[watab kid]

not a big diff in loads for this game , its more about the OAL and cycling in the rifle , my marlin runs great on 38s so i went that way , a friends rifle runs best on 357s so she went that way , either work in both of our revolvers , her husband loads both but i only load the 38s 

[Hendo]

I had one Uberti pistol in .357 and a crapload of shells, so I just stayed that route. I don't worry about OAL all that much, and it only hurts a little when I don't get all my brass back.

[Roger Rapid]

Ditto on Watab Kid - even though .38Spec can be fired in .357 guns, some rifles - like Lightnings - run better with the 1.60˝ OAL of the .357 / 45LC / .44-40, etc.

...RR

[Cypress Sun]

.38spl. Smaller ignition area, cooler weather = more reliable rounds.

[Uncle Ethan # 94321]

Longhunter has a very good article on his website about OAL and 38s in rifles. I reload my 38s to an OAL of 1.56. Not had any problems with jamming.

[TN Mongo, SASS #61450]

+1 for Watab Kid's comment on overall cartridge length.  I started with a 92' rifle that only functioned with an OAL of around 1.52.  That was the OAL of a 125 bullet in a .357 case, so that's what I used.  My only problem was I only had a few hundred .357 cases, but thousands of .38 cases.

 

I tried loading that the .38s to the 1.52 OAL and I also had no functioning problems.  You can leave your 125gr sticking out of the case a little above the cannelure groove and crimp into the side of the bullet with no problem.

 

I haven't owned that 92' for fifteen years, but my current 1873s and Marlins both love the 1.52 overall length. 

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

. 38 Special cases are cheaper and easier found than .357.

OLG 

[J-BAR #18287]

Some clubs still use some rifle and pistol knockdowns. Loading your .357s with 158 grain bullets makes them easy to identify at the loading table, for those targets that you want to hit a bit harder. I have also used nickel cases to differentiate between knockdown and mouse fart loads.

[Marshal Chance Morgun]

More shooters use .38's. Personally, I hate it when I get .357 back.

[Roscoe Regulator]

Minimum "Cowboy" loads provided by Hodgdon for 357 cases and 125 gr bullets puts you close to the SASS velocity limit for pistols. You will be in the better range using 158 grain bullets. That was my decision in making up a load for my 357 Ligntning. For rifle, the rated velocity is well within SASS rule limits. If I did shoot 357s in my pistols, there would be a concern with 125s or lighter. My pistols get 38 Long Colt with the 125s, and the loading block is designed to keep things straight.

[Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life]

21 minutes ago, Marshal Chance Morgun said:

More shooters use .38's. Personally, I hate it when I get .357 back.

I don't mind when I get a few 357's back. I have almost completed my 12 setting "goblet" collection when I find them while reloading my 38's.

Regards

   

Gateway Kid

[H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619]

If .38 Special and .357 Magnum both work with no problems for you, then go with whatever you find easiest to use.

I don't load either caliber for SASS, but the closest comparison I can give you is my experience with .44 Special and .44 Magnum.  In a nutshell, I have a couple of rifles chambered for the Magnum round that tended to stovepipe if I tried to run Specials in them.   I mention this because it is *possible* that someday you may get a rifle chambered for .357 Magnum that won't like .38 Specials for whatever reason.

That is why I gave up on running the shorter shells in rifles chambered for the longer ones.    If you have no problems with the short shells, don't worry about it.

Good luck, and happy shooting.

[Hendo]

3 hours ago, Marshal Chance Morgun said:

More shooters use .38's. Personally, I hate it when I get .357 back.

I'd be more than happy to rid you of them pesky magnum shells. 

[Anvil Al #59168]

4 hours ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

. 38 Special cases are cheaper and easier found than .357.

OLG 

 

This.

 

I would go ahead and use the .357 till they split or I lost them all.

Then go all .38's

[Cliff Hanger #3720LR]

I have always recommended 357s in guns that can take them.

Should you run out of ammunition at a match you can barrow either 357s or 38s because the carbon ring is out at 357 length and not in the way for the occasional 38.

As far as load data, use the same in both with your 125 g bullets.

You will not notice any difference.

[Roscoe Regulator]

2 hours ago, Cliff Hanger #3720LR said:

I have always recommended 357s in guns that can take them.

Should you run out of ammunition at a match you can barrow either 357s or 38s because the carbon ring is out at 357 length and not in the way for the occasional 38.

As far as load data, use the same in both with your 125 g bullets.

You will not notice any difference.

I think the few statements that one "will not notice any difference" loading either 38 or 357 brass the same relies on the context that either is loaded to a similar COL and then pressure level. The 38s are typically loaded to a COL pretending to be 357s, while the actual 357 brass is loaded by crimping in the crimp groove.

[Imis Twohofon,SASS # 46646]

I load .38 for Jersey Bratt's Marlin because it has a short barrel and wont hold ten .357 length cartridges. I load .357 for my 73 because it feeds the longer cartridge better. In both I use 125 RNFP, the same powder charge and the same primers.  Case length is the only difference. I have lots of both cases.

 

Imis 

[Tulsey, SASS#11236]

Years ago I shot nothing but 38 in a converted 92. One day I wanted to shoot BP 357 and found out they would not chamber. Found out I had neglected doing good chamber cleaning. Since then I use 357 for rifle so I could use either one any time since I had a good supply of 357. Makes it easy to keep rifle loads separate if you use 38s in revolvers 

[El CupAJoe]

since all my centerfires are once again in 38/.357/350L I like to keep things organized.  I prefer all my purpose ammo to be .357 magnum and all my fun/game ammo to be 38 special cases.  thankfully my Rossi 92, seems to do fine with either case length in the bullet profiles I currently cast.  I think for frontiersman, I'm going to standardize in 38 special nickel plated to keep them organized from my smokeless plinking loads.

[Dusty Devil Dale]

On 1/3/2022 at 10:55 AM, J-BAR #18287 said:

Some clubs still use some rifle and pistol knockdowns. Loading your .357s with 158 grain bullets makes them easy to identify at the loading table, for those targets that you want to hit a bit harder. I have also used nickel cases to differentiate between knockdown and mouse fart loads.

No reason not to load 158gn in .38 sp cases, if you think they are necessary.   

[J-BAR #18287]

3 hours ago, Dusty Devil Dale said:

No reason not to load 158gn in .38 sp cases, if you think they are necessary.   

Except if you don’t want the same loads in the rifle as in the revolvers, the different cases are easier to separate when trying to load quickly at the loading table.  Put the 158 grainers in .38 brass and the lighter loads in 357brass if you want, fine with me.  Just please don’t slow down the loading table trying to figure out which is which.  It has happened and it’s frustrating to other shooters.

[Dusty Devil Dale]

13 hours ago, J-BAR #18287 said:

Except if you don’t want the same loads in the rifle as in the revolvers, the different cases are easier to separate when trying to load quickly at the loading table.  Put the 158 grainers in .38 brass and the lighter loads in 357brass if you want, fine with me.  Just please don’t slow down the loading table trying to figure out which is which.  It has happened and it’s frustrating to other shooters.

Agree.  That is exactly why they make loading blocks.   

 

Watching my wife consistently knock down heavy plate targets with 78 gn projectiles in her .32 mag pistols, I sometimes think we put too much importance on projectile weight.  Truth is, a good hit on the top 1/2 of a heavy (30 lb) KD target from a .22 or pellet gun will almost always take them down, unless they are adjusted for Mountain Howitzers. 

( As I recall, the 158 gn bullet in a factory .38 Sp load was to be the standard used for target adjustment. ) 

[Sedalia Dave]

The beauty of powder coated bullets is that it is easy to differentiate different loads by using different colors. 

 

 

[Hendo]

1 hour ago, Dusty Devil Dale said:

Agree.  That is exactly why they make loading blocks.   

 

Watching my wife consistently knock down heavy plate targets with 78 gn projectiles in her .32 mag pistols, I sometimes think we put too much importance on projectile weight.  Truth is, a good hit on the top 1/2 of a heavy (30 lb) KD target from a .22 or pellet gun will almost always take them down, unless they are adjusted for Mountain Howitzers. 

( As I recall, the 158 gn bullet in a factory .38 Sp load was to be the standard used for target adjustment. ) 

Ya know, I've been itching to try my Mountain Howitzer on the clock...

[Colorado Coffinmaker]

 

Sheesh.  NO!!