Waxahachie Kid #17017 L Posted November 18, 2021 Share Posted November 18, 2021 For me, I am not interested in a stainless, large loop, lever action, in any caliber, but I am very hopeful that some later offerings will be something I will purchase. We are all rooting for Ruger, and hoping for the best for the new Marlin. Yep, a lot of us were burned by the Remington offerings, and the old saying: "fool me once, shame on you...fool me twice, shame on me", comes to mind. Once burned, there is a tendency to be apprehensive about things. But...the passing of time, will tell. I have to believe, based on what I hear, is that Ruger is aware of what came before, and doesn't want their product to be the "same song, second verse". I also believe they are aware that there are still a lot of J.M. Marlins out there, so we are able to compare what was, to what will be. I believe they are determined to not come up short. They can do it...until proved otherwise, I think they will. But, being an imperfect human, I could be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennessee williams Posted November 18, 2021 Share Posted November 18, 2021 21 hours ago, Slapshot said: Just guessing , I'd say Smith and Wesson is another. Although the brothers did split and Dan formed Dan Wesson now owned by CZ. Huh? Horace Smith and Daniel Wesson started 2 companies in about 1855 or 1856. One of those companies was reorganized into what is now Winchester. Before it was Winchester, it was Volcanic repeating arms. The other is what we know as Smith and Wesson now. The Daniel Wesson that started the Dan Wesson gun company you're talking about was a great great grandson of the co-founder of s&w. He did work at s&w but they got bought out in the late 60s. Then he started Dan Wesson. I think that was 68. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slapshot Posted November 18, 2021 Share Posted November 18, 2021 Just now, Tennessee williams said: Huh? Horace Smith and Daniel Wesson started 2 companies in about 1855 or 1856. One of those companies was reorganized into what is now Winchester. Before it was Winchester, it was Volcanic repeating arms. The other is what we know as Smith and Wesson now. The Daniel Wesson that started the Dan Wesson gun company you're talking about was a great great grandson of the co-founder of s&w. He did work at s&w but they got bought out in the late 60s. Then he started Dan Wesson. I think that was 68. Thanks , I was guessing, wasn't sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Stevens SASS#55996 Posted November 18, 2021 Share Posted November 18, 2021 Just food for thought, when you buy a Uberti 73’ these days you’re buying a frame……that you then have to dump money into just to make sure it does not eat itself alive. Now we are going to have an American made rifle option made by a company owned by the producer of the most popular and reliable handgun in our game. Remington itself was in the toilet when they took on Marlin production. Even upper management was ashamed of their products. Ruger is very strong as a company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster Ron Wayne Posted November 18, 2021 Author Share Posted November 18, 2021 35 minutes ago, Waxahachie Kid #17017 L said: For me, I am not interested in a stainless, large loop, lever action, in any caliber, but I am very hopeful that some later offerings will be something I will purchase. We are all rooting for Ruger, and hoping for the best for the new Marlin. Yep, a lot of us were burned by the Remington offerings, and the old saying: "fool me once, shame on you...fool me twice, shame on me", comes to mind. Once burned, there is a tendency to be apprehensive about things. But...the passing of time, will tell. I have to believe, based on what I hear, is that Ruger is aware of what came before, and doesn't want their product to be the "same song, second verse". I also believe they are aware that there are still a lot of J.M. Marlins out there, so we are able to compare what was, to what will be. I believe they are determined to not come up short. They can do it...until proved otherwise, I think they will. But, being an imperfect human, I could be wrong. I believe Ruger is on top of the Game . And they won't be putting out anything till all the bugs are worked out . We almost never have issues with something Ruger brings to market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roscoe Regulator Posted November 18, 2021 Share Posted November 18, 2021 On 11/7/2021 at 4:07 PM, Phantom, SASS #54973 said: For cryin' out loud, can we please just call them Marlins? Ruger may have other ideas, and true to form, make design changes, calling it a Ruger something or other. Acquiring Marlin may have been more about certain rights and a ready entree for the lever action market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted November 18, 2021 Share Posted November 18, 2021 2 hours ago, Roscoe Regulator said: Ruger may have other ideas, and true to form, make design changes, calling it a Ruger something or other. Acquiring Marlin may have been more about certain rights and a ready entree for the lever action market. To think that a company such as Ruger would see no Goodwill value in keeping the name Marlin would be an extraordinary surprise. Phantom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted November 18, 2021 Share Posted November 18, 2021 13 minutes ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said: To think that a company such as Ruger would see no Goodwill value in keeping the name Marlin would be an extraordinary surprise. Phantom Maybe than can take a lesson from Ruth's Chris.... "Ruger's Marlin"? Sorry, just had to have fun here. GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted November 18, 2021 Share Posted November 18, 2021 Well, in all seriousness, it wouldn't surprise me if Ruger officially calls it: Ruger '1894 Marlin'. And of course, Ruger 1895 Marlin, Ruger 336 Marlin, etc.......... Under Marlin, it was the 'Marlin 1894' but if RUGER is gonna make em, then I'm sure the name will be appropriate and NOT confusing. Just my thinking. ..........Widder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster Ron Wayne Posted November 20, 2021 Author Share Posted November 20, 2021 On 11/18/2021 at 11:56 AM, Widder, SASS #59054 said: Well, in all seriousness, it wouldn't surprise me if Ruger officially calls it: Ruger '1894 Marlin'. And of course, Ruger 1895 Marlin, Ruger 336 Marlin, etc.......... Under Marlin, it was the 'Marlin 1894' but if RUGER is gonna make em, then I'm sure the name will be appropriate and NOT confusing. Just my thinking. ..........Widder I would believe you are probably on the right track hear . I see no Problem calling them Ruger 1894 & 1895 Marlins . Seems pretty logical to me . Rooster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted November 20, 2021 Share Posted November 20, 2021 On 11/18/2021 at 9:56 AM, Widder, SASS #59054 said: Ruger '1894 Marlin' Good Lord...I can see it now... CZ 1873 Colt... Ownerships change all the time. Names don't because there is a value to those names. Phantom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creeker, SASS #43022 Posted November 20, 2021 Share Posted November 20, 2021 1 hour ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said: Good Lord...I can see it now... CZ 1873 Colt... Ownerships change all the time. Names don't because there is a value to those names. Phantom +1 Ruger is a full line firearms manufacturer. IF they had simply wanted to enter the lever action rifle market - they could have done so easily without purchasing Marlin. And honestly, probably would have made a better firearm if they had started with a clean sheet design. But a Ruger Lariat lever rifle (like that? Figured it fit in with Vaquero and Wrangler) would not have the history and emotional attachment that the Marlin brand name evokes - so it would be silly for Ruger to purchase Marlin and then diminish it by changing the name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roscoe Regulator Posted November 20, 2021 Share Posted November 20, 2021 On 11/18/2021 at 10:07 AM, Phantom, SASS #54973 said: To think that a company such as Ruger would see no Goodwill value in keeping the name Marlin would be an extraordinary surprise. Phantom Expect that once Ruger is done with design changes, as I think we should expect, it won't actually be a "Marlin" and should not pretend to be so. It will be their first lever action, not some noble attempt to preserve the Marlin rifle and marque. Their market to cowboy action shooters would not likely be anywhere near enough volume to sustain a rifle category. Not surprising that they started with a bush rifle caliber. We are just speculating here, so there is no excuse for trolling each others thoughts about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted November 20, 2021 Share Posted November 20, 2021 8 hours ago, Roscoe Regulator said: Expect that once Ruger is done with design changes, as I think we should expect, it won't actually be a "Marlin" and should not pretend to be so. It will be their first lever action, not some noble attempt to preserve the Marlin rifle and marque. Their market to cowboy action shooters would not likely be anywhere near enough volume to sustain a rifle category. Not surprising that they started with a bush rifle caliber. We are just speculating here, so there is no excuse for trolling each others thoughts about it. First off, have a difference of opinion has nothing to do with "Trolling". Using these kind of terms does nothing except end discussions. And as far making design changes...so a company that buys a name/product line is forever prevented from making changes/improvments to that product line??? THAT is funny. Phantom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster Ron Wayne Posted November 20, 2021 Author Share Posted November 20, 2021 31 minutes ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said: First off, have a difference of opinion has nothing to do with "Trolling". Using these kind of terms does nothing except end discussions. And as far making design changes...so a company that buys a name/product line is forever prevented from making changes/improvments to that product line??? THAT is funny. Phantom LOL I dont think Ruger will Change the design of The Marlin Rifles . They are a great design . I think Ruger might improve the quality of workmanship in the gun . And maybe MIM some of the parts . And Defiantly improve wood to meatal fit . IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckshot Bob Posted November 20, 2021 Share Posted November 20, 2021 I think allot of people here might be shocked by the amount of the shooting/hunting public that never knew that Remington bought Marlin or that Ruger owns them now . When Joe hunter walks into the gunshop and wants a 30-30 like grandpa had the the salesman is going to show him a Winchester and a Marlin. I’m glad he’ll still have a choice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roscoe Regulator Posted November 21, 2021 Share Posted November 21, 2021 22 hours ago, Creeker, SASS #43022 said: +1 Ruger is a full line firearms manufacturer. IF they had simply wanted to enter the lever action rifle market - they could have done so easily without purchasing Marlin. And honestly, probably would have made a better firearm if they had started with a clean sheet design. But a Ruger Lariat lever rifle (like that? Figured it fit in with Vaquero and Wrangler) would not have the history and emotional attachment that the Marlin brand name evokes - so it would be silly for Ruger to purchase Marlin and then diminish it by changing the name. Maybe they bought patent rights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Still hand Bill Posted November 21, 2021 Share Posted November 21, 2021 3 hours ago, Roscoe Regulator said: Maybe they bought patent rights. Patents are only 17 years. I expect the patents on any of the Marlin rifles are long expired. Now the name Marlin is probably a copyright and that is valuable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Church Key, SASS # 33713 Posted November 21, 2021 Share Posted November 21, 2021 FYI - Ruger has extensive experience in designing and manufacturing lever action rifles; the Ruger 96. Here's a link to Wickopedia on this model: Ruger 96 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazy Eeyour Posted November 22, 2021 Share Posted November 22, 2021 Ruger model 96 in 44 mag had a 1 in 20 twist rather than 1 in 38. Allows for longer bullets to stabilize. Shorter bullets to stabilize at less velocity. Ruger 44 mag pistols have a 1 in 20 twist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roscoe Regulator Posted November 22, 2021 Share Posted November 22, 2021 14 hours ago, Church Key, SASS # 33713 said: FYI - Ruger has extensive experience in designing and manufacturing lever action rifles; the Ruger 96. Here's a link to Wickopedia on this model: Ruger 96 In a sense, but tube-fed? Interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckshot Bob Posted November 23, 2021 Share Posted November 23, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
"Big Boston" Posted November 23, 2021 Share Posted November 23, 2021 On 11/21/2021 at 6:28 PM, Lazy Eeyour said: Ruger model 96 in 44 mag had a 1 in 20 twist rather than 1 in 38. Allows for longer bullets to stabilize. Shorter bullets to stabilize at less velocity. Ruger 44 mag pistols have a 1 in 20 twist. I had issues with my Marlin 1894 44Mag/Spl. and felt compelled to dig a bit deeper into the twist issue. You may or may not be aware of this, but SAAMI has specifications for the 44 Magnum Pistol/Revolver cartridge as well as the 44 Magnum Centerfire Rifle cartridge. Yes, two specifications that differ when it comes to bore/groove and twist rate specs. Interestingly, AFAIK, CIP has one specification. The specifications are easy enough to look up, so, in a nutshell, rifles built outside of SAAMI jurisdiction are usually built to CIP specs, bore/groove and twist the same as a SAAMI pistol. Whereas, if a rifle was built to SAAMI specs it would have shallow rifling and oversized bore/groove dimensions and a 1:38 twist. In all likelihood Marlin created and paid for the 44 Magnum Rifle standard, as it also calls for microgroove rifling, with either 12 or 6 grooves. The 6 groove rifling mimics the look of deep cut Ballard rifling, but it is only about half as deep as a pistol/revolver rifling and both the 12 and 6 groove rifling twist is 1:38 twist instead of the 1:20 spec for a Pistol/Revolver. Each caliber has it own nuances, and hats off to any Cowboy that runs 44 Mag, IMNSHO it can be a bag of snakes to run at cowboy velocities with cast bullets, especially the ones from undersized LEE molds. Remember, 44 Mag max bullet diameter is 0.432", minimum is 0.429". LEE builds their 44 cal molds to minimum spec. I've asked them why, but in typical LEE arrogance was told that 429 was the best size. I've kept one Vaquero in 44 Mag, mostly out of sentiment, as I abandoned it as a viable CAS round, YMMV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roscoe Regulator Posted November 23, 2021 Share Posted November 23, 2021 4 hours ago, "Big Boston" said: I had issues with my Marlin 1894 44Mag/Spl. and felt compelled to dig a bit deeper into the twist issue. You may or may not be aware of this, but SAAMI has specifications for the 44 Magnum Pistol/Revolver cartridge as well as the 44 Magnum Centerfire Rifle cartridge. Yes, two specifications that differ when it comes to bore/groove and twist rate specs. Interestingly, AFAIK, CIP has one specification. The specifications are easy enough to look up, so, in a nutshell, rifles built outside of SAAMI jurisdiction are usually built to CIP specs, bore/groove and twist the same as a SAAMI pistol. Whereas, if a rifle was built to SAAMI specs it would have shallow rifling and oversized bore/groove dimensions and a 1:38 twist. In all likelihood Marlin created and paid for the 44 Magnum Rifle standard, as it also calls for microgroove rifling, with either 12 or 6 grooves. The 6 groove rifling mimics the look of deep cut Ballard rifling, but it is only about half as deep as a pistol/revolver rifling and both the 12 and 6 groove rifling twist is 1:38 twist instead of the 1:20 spec for a Pistol/Revolver. Each caliber has it own nuances, and hats off to any Cowboy that runs 44 Mag, IMNSHO it can be a bag of snakes to run at cowboy velocities with cast bullets, especially the ones from undersized LEE molds. Remember, 44 Mag max bullet diameter is 0.432", minimum is 0.429". LEE builds their 44 cal molds to minimum spec. I've asked them why, but in typical LEE arrogance was told that 429 was the best size. I've kept one Vaquero in 44 Mag, mostly out of sentiment, as I abandoned it as a viable CAS round, YMMV. I have used my 44 Magnum Blackhawk FlatTop in a match or two and simply used my 44 Special Trailboss load. In my "Remlin" rifle I ran 44 Mag, again with a Trailboss load well within CAS velocity limits and with very manageable recoil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roscoe Regulator Posted November 23, 2021 Share Posted November 23, 2021 17 hours ago, Buckshot Bob said: Nothing about Cowboy rifle models, especially 45 Colt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabez Cowboy,SASS # 50129 Posted November 24, 2021 Share Posted November 24, 2021 I would like to see a model 1894 in .38- 40, 20 inch Tappered Octagon Barrel . Blued and Wood. And a 1895 Cowboy with a 26 inch Tappered Octagon Barrel in .45 - 70 Jabez Cowboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster Ron Wayne Posted November 24, 2021 Author Share Posted November 24, 2021 10 hours ago, Jabez Cowboy,SASS # 50129 said: I would like to see a model 1894 in .38- 40, 20 inch Tappered Octagon Barrel . Blued and Wood. And a 1895 Cowboy with a 26 inch Tappered Octagon Barrel in .45 - 70 Jabez Cowboy After Ruger puts out the 357 & 44 &45 . I hope the do the 45/70 and 30/30 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Rainmaker, SASS #11631 Posted November 24, 2021 Share Posted November 24, 2021 I would bet the 30-30 and 45-70s would be a higher priority; bigger market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michigan Slim Posted November 24, 2021 Share Posted November 24, 2021 Make mine a .38-55 please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster Ron Wayne Posted November 24, 2021 Author Share Posted November 24, 2021 25 minutes ago, Michigan Slim said: Make mine a .38-55 please! I would love a 24"-26" Long Octogan Barrel Marlin in 38-55 from Ruger Myself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cholla Posted November 25, 2021 Share Posted November 25, 2021 Davidsons (here in Prescott just a stone's throw from the Ruger plant) is a prime mover to make Ruger produce a firearm to certain specs. Perhaps they would accept input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokin Gator SASS #29736 Posted November 25, 2021 Share Posted November 25, 2021 I'd love Davidsons to order a run of 44-40 cowboy models. But I know there's a ton of other configurations and calibers that will be made before that could ever happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster Ron Wayne Posted November 25, 2021 Author Share Posted November 25, 2021 10 minutes ago, Smokin Gator SASS #29736 said: I'd love Davidsons to order a run of 44-40 cowboy models. But I know there's a ton of other configurations and calibers that will be made before that could ever happen. As big as SASS Shooting is to all of us . Too the shooting world . We are small potatoes. But I would like to hope the 44/40 would make in in there some day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokin Gator SASS #29736 Posted November 25, 2021 Share Posted November 25, 2021 I have one that was from a small batch (325 or 350) I believe. I think it was through Davidsons but not positive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cholla Posted November 25, 2021 Share Posted November 25, 2021 49 minutes ago, Rooster Ron Wayne said: As big as SASS Shooting is to all of us . Too the shooting world . We are small potatoes. But I would like to hope the 44/40 would make in in there some day. IF and that's a BIG IF, SASS does what they said they are going to do to grow the sport to the 1980/1990s popularity, that would get the attention of Davidson's and Ruger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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