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What's the best way to slick a Stoeger for shells coming out easy?


Buckshot Bear

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What's the best way to slick a Stoeger for shells coming out easy?

 

Wet & Dry wrapped around a shell? If so would it be better to spin the shell around or pull the shell repeatedly in and out? 

 

Oil on the Wet & Dry? Go up to 2000 grade? Super fine valve grinding paste? Old fashioned tooth paste?

 

Any other suggested method of slicking the chambers?

 

I know smooth non ribbed shells are best, but the vast majority of mine presently aren't.

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36 minutes ago, Still hand Bill said:

Honestly mine was fine with no work.  I did polish them using a dowel, scotch brite, and a drill.  

 

Mine won't throw out hulls real easy, even with a really hard jerk.

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24 minutes ago, Buckshot Bear said:

 

Mine won't throw out hulls real easy, even with a really hard jerk.

I guess I got lucky.  Mine will fall out with a simple tip of the muzzle.  I polished them anyway just because people say you should.  I do shoot 100% reloads of rem gun clubs or sts.  
 

just tape a strip of scotch brite on a rod, make the wrap a tight fit into the chamber.  Spin with a drill.  Start with course if material needs to be removed, then finer colors for a polish.  Sorry I don’t remember which color is which grade. 

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My Stoeger will toss just about any smooth shell, but I usually have to coax the ribbed ones out with my fingernails! No polishing done yet.

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3 hours ago, Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 said:

You did not mention the most important thing.  What shells are you using?  Make and loading.

Put round shells into the gun.   Get a 12 gauge shell case gauge.  If the shell won't drop into the case gauge and dump out freely, it probably won't drop out of the shotgun chamber after you fire it.  I was getting a 40% failure rate out of factory AA shells.  I ended up spending a little more on Remington STS and lowered my failure rate to about 5%.  I used the ones that didn't pass the case gauge test for Wild Bunch since the pump doesn't seem to care.  

 

I don't use any lube on my shells cause I have a hard enough time holding on to them as it is.  I sure don't need for them to be slippery.  

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11 hours ago, Buckshot Bear said:

I know smooth non ribbed is best

 

Try KY or some other adult personal lubricant   :P

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On mine, I used Flitz Polish (chrome polish) on a bore mop and I polished my chambers. BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY I use Winchester AA Shells. They are smooth, not ribbed.

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40 minutes ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

On mine, I used Flitz Polish (chrome polish) on a bore mop and I polished my chambers. BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY I use Winchester AA Shells. They are smooth, not ribbed.

Though I don't use stoegers anymore when I did this was my technique. ^^^^^^

Flitz on a long cotton bore mop, chuck it up in a drill, on slow speed run it in and out for about 3-4 minutes then clean thoroughly. This is best done in steps as some have experienced "over smoothing" which can make for harder extraction rather than easier. Also you do not want to (nor need to) dramatically change the chamber dimensions, as you could turn the chamber from a perfect circle into an oval. (barrels now ruined)

Then I take a good quality fine file and just break the sharp edges of the chambers mouth and extractor to facilitate loading. BEWARE this step is very easy to over do and is NOT reversible. Do not take off more than a tiny bit to keep the sharp edge from catching your shell when loading. To much will change the headspace and in extreme cases keep the chamber mouth from holding/supporting the shell  correctly (read risk of personal injury) and the gun may have intermittent FTF as the firing pins will no longer impact fully on the primer.

Take it slow and evaluate each modification for satisfaction, then do some more later if you choose.

BTW a well tuned stoeger can be a fine shotgun for the game and can last for years. For many they will be all the shotgun they ever need. YMMV

Regards

:FlagAm:  :FlagAm:  :FlagAm:

Gateway Kid

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1 hour ago, Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life said:

Though I don't use stoegers anymore when I did this was my technique. ^^^^^^

Flitz on a long cotton bore mop, chuck it up in a drill, on slow speed run it in and out for about 3-4 minutes then clean thoroughly. This is best done in steps as some have experienced "over smoothing" which can make for harder extraction rather than easier. Also you do not want to (nor need to) dramatically change the chamber dimensions, as you could turn the chamber from a perfect circle into an oval. (barrels now ruined)

Then I take a good quality fine file and just break the sharp edges of the chambers mouth and extractor to facilitate loading. BEWARE this step is very easy to over do and is NOT reversible. Do not take off more than a tiny bit to keep the sharp edge from catching your shell when loading. To much will change the headspace and in extreme cases keep the chamber mouth from holding/supporting the shell  correctly (read risk of personal injury) and the gun may have intermittent FTF as the firing pins will no longer impact fully on the primer.

Take it slow and evaluate each modification for satisfaction, then do some more later if you choose.

BTW a well tuned stoeger can be a fine shotgun for the game and can last for years. For many they will be all the shotgun they ever need. YMMV

Regards

:FlagAm:  :FlagAm:  :FlagAm:

Gateway Kid

Thank you for adding details. :D

 

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I bought an Iver Johnson a while back that was pretty rough. I have always used AA hulls for reloads and never had issues until i fed them to the IJ. To fix the sticking issue I used some fine steel wool around a copper brush, chucked it up to a DeWalt and ran it real slow for a couple of minutes. This worked like a charm and still kicks em out smooth today. Mind you I am not a gunsmith and this was a cheap gun to experiment with, but it worked for me.

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14 hours ago, Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 said:

You did not mention the most important thing.  What shells are you using?  Make and loading.

@Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933

 

I have cases of these to get through Larsen and they are ribbed, it was all I could get.  I do have a few boxes of Winchester shells. I will be more particular (if possible) in the future and try to get smooth hulled shells.

Some of these have been cut down and remade lighter by a mate of mine for my wife and daughter in laws.

 

1073774484_20211028_115134_resizedcopy.thumb.jpg.7c9eedc58862117e4ca4ed79ac6511e8.jpg

 

 

1393944869_20211028_115145_resizedcopy.thumb.jpg.196087569b4c89a905b0049d9d755798.jpg

 

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17 minutes ago, Buckshot Bear said:

 

The wild west was pretty much a memory by 1897 :) 

Oh No…you are gonna hurt someone’s feelings talking like that. :lol::lol::lol:

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10 minutes ago, Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 said:

Even though these have brass colored heads I am almost positive they are steel.  Stick a magnet on them to make sure.

 

I'm on the road at the moment, I'll check that later Larsen.

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A small honing tool for the end of the drill..then plenty of polishing !! ..and yep use 

smooth hulls. Shorten used ribbed hulls & then roll crimp, they will come out but a bit of mucking around.

I lucked upon 8,000 once fired older  tapered Win AA's which I use for trap & Cowboy..should last me a while;) 

 

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Before I started our game I bought my Stoeger new. I polished the chambers with ribbed Federal hull with a bolt thru the primer hole. Chucked in a drill with fine valve lapping compound and spun slowly until the hulls just dropped out by tipping the barrel up. I also wipe all my hull with a rag with Amor-All before loading and have only had a couple hang up in 12 years.

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Here are a few ideas.  Hopefully the text and photos will come out in the correct order.  The first thing is to inspect the chamber.  If it is shiny and smooth there is little to be done.  The primary thing to look for is roughness or ridges in the chamber.  Flitz, for example, will make the metal shiny but it will not remove imperfections in the chamber.  The best tool for the job is a chamber hone and the special oil that comes with it.

 

DSC_0003.thumb.jpeg.503fdbc25b43f3d278cbce847a633744.jpeg

 

Next up just take a rod and cut a slot in it that you can chuck in a drill motor.  Wrap the abrasive cloth in the direction the rod will rotate.  In the second photo I am pressing down on the rod to keep the cloth from unwrapping.  Once in the chamber centrifical force will force it outwards.  Apply oil and use fine cloth.

 

DSC_0005.thumb.jpeg.b7171c4783b81442ceb6534bcb9c5369.jpegDSC_0008.thumb.jpeg.491c3cb3e03883d0ca2f6eeefbdc2025.jpeg

 

 

Finally you can take a bore map and coat it with fine abrasive or for a final polish with something like Flitz.  I screw it into a short section of cleaning rod so I can make sure it is fully into the chamber when it is chucked into a drill motor.  With the bore mop keep in mind that if the chamber has imperfections the mop will conform to those imperfections.

 

DSC_0009.thumb.jpeg.ae29e7175d1fd3d61e6563b2a2163f73.jpeg

 

I will split this into three parts to make sure the photo MB size does not exceed the limit of this site.

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Next up a word about feeding your double, i.e., shells.  The common advice is to only used smooth sided hulls.  I have only used ribbed hulls for several years.  A word of explanation.  Most shells made worldwide are Reifenhousser style hulls.  (Often called Euro-trash hulls by high volume reloaders.)  Virtually all of these hulls are ribbed.  But it is not the ribs that cause shucking problems, it is the cheap construction and materials in these hulls.  The plastic is formed into long tubes and then cut into shell length sections.  The plastic tubes are in many cases much thinner than a premium American made shell.  The tube is inserted into the rim portion of the shell and then a base wad pressed in to lock everything together.  The heads, regardless of color, are steel.  Steel expands but does not contract as readily as brass. The only shells still made with brass heads are the Remington STS series and the Winchester AA.  (Some new "premium" AAs have steel heads but these are plated with nickle so they are easy to recognize.)  So what you basically have are cheap Reifenhousser hulls that are made with ribs and premium American brass base shells that are smooth sided.  Again, it is more a function of cheap vs. quality than the ribs or smoothness.  A lot of guns, including very expensive guns, don't like steel heads.  By expensive I am not talking SKB and BSS.  I am talking Perazzi and Kreighoff.  When people go to Walmart and buy the cheap four packs of Federal Red shells in addition to being cheaply constructed (i.e., Reifenshousser) they are frequently 3 dram, 1 1/8 oz loads.  The pressure from these heavy loads expands the steel head and they stick.  What I use exclusively for CAS shooting is the Remington Gun Club hull.  These are extruded hulls that are basically an STS with a ribbed hull and steel head.  Remington Gun Club on the left, Euro hull on the right.  They are well made hulls and the plastic is thicker than the typical Euro-trash hull.

 

DSC_0015.thumb.jpeg.3545a3fdd5b28dc3edcb24dc62b7e868.jpeg

 

 

If you are shooting at any level of competitiveness you have to have a case gauge.  I have hit batches of brand new AAs that three or four out of every box would not chamber freely in my doubles.  Finding this out in the middle of a stage is not the place to do it.  In the photo the shell will go into the gauge with just LIGHT pressure with a finger.  But, if a shell requires any force to go fully into the gauge it will take force to get it out of the chamber.  Even just a fingernail flip to get a hull out of the chamber on the line is wasted time. On the gauge in the photo if a shell does not drop FREELY all the way to the rim you can stick the crimp into the knurled end of the gauge and give it a twist and it will iron out imperfections in the crimp area.  Then retry on the other end and most of the time the shell will now gauge freely.  If not toss it into the junk box.

 

DSC_0002.thumb.jpeg.e34bdd3d41be7d291206688c3cf61de6.jpeg

 

The Remington has a solid case head.  As opposed to the Reifenhousser a hollow plastic tube is not inserted into the rim portion.  Rather the Remington hull is solid on the bottom and the case head is crimped around the hull body.  Thus the steel does not expand as much when the shell is fired.  To make sure everything is set to spec the Gun Club hulls are all run through a Mec Super Sizer.  This squeezes the head back to factory dimensions.  Then they are loaded once and tossed.  With light CAS loads the steel does not expand.  The main area that causes shucking problems is the crimp.  The more often a hull is reloaded the weaker the crimp area.

 

DSC_0017.thumb.jpeg.9380165db3f14193b1ed948c40be1487.jpeg

 

DSC_0018.thumb.jpeg.661d8a8ab539f6dd0fca7d7222a58626.jpeg

 

 

(The shell in the sizer is a really crappy one that was grabbed from the junk box.  Most look factory new.)

 

I use to carry a rag and wipe each shell with silicon and brush the chambers between each stage.  I no longer do either (except for BP) and have not had a failure to shuck in a long time.

 

Just ran out to the garage and cut apart a couple of hulls for an addentum to make sure people understand the difference in hull contruction.  The Reifenshousser is just a hollow tube.  Left in the photo.  The Remington has a solid head.  Right in photo.  The last photo is a close-up of the Remington head.  It even has the rim shape in it.  Several years ago all plastic hulls were offered as the metal rim did not increase hull strength.  People just could not get use to the all plastic hull so they started putting metal rims back on.  (The grooves in the Remington hull are saw marks from cutting off the metal rim.)

 

DSC_0003.thumb.jpeg.18e1a806e3d90c6c6811f56826e1baea.jpeg

 

DSC_0005.thumb.jpeg.f454fa79dc8073d33cecbc5c9dcc5c31.jpeg

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Thanks @Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 for a great reply to my question, super appreciate the time it took to write all that out and post photos as well.

And yes, a magnet sticks to the base of every shottie shell in my ammo cupboard :(

 

Once, again truly appreciate the effort in your answer. I've printed it all out and its in my notebook.

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I think it was back in 2008, Larsen did a great DIY article in the Chronicle on slicking up a Stoeger. It was a 2 parter. I did it and all has been well for 12 years now. Thanks Larsen

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