Cole Younger Requlator Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 I have been using this for a while and it works fantastic---and I have no financial interest in this product. Just want to share the news QuikLoaderBy Roger Siminoff (SASS alias "Roger Rapid") QuikLoader Kit Parts QuikLoader Installed on MEC QuikLoader puts a 3° SASS-legal taper in the leading 1/2″ of your 12‑gauge shotshells to facilitate the feeding of shotshells into your shotgun and cut seconds off your score. No more fumbling! QuikLoader not only improves feeding in break‑action, Side‑by‑Side and Over/Under shotguns, it also improves feeding on Winchester Model '97 pump‑action and Model '87 lever‑action shotguns, too! ♦ Fits on MEC Jr or MEC Sizemaster♦ Replaces the First Crimping Die♦ Change-out is a Snap & Does Not♦ Upset any of the MEC's Settings♦ Available for 12GA Only Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Gun Barney, SASS #2428 Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 Just wondering... mostly because i dont ever do this in any way when making BP shells for either my 12ga double or my 87... but what is the technical difference between using a tapering die specifically made for a 12ga shell, and "necking" the shell with any other die that doesn't say "12GA" on it (other than is gets around the rule stated below by having "12ga" stamped on the tool). Not trying to stir the pot, I am just curious because I can see how this may aid feeding in my 87, and even in getting the shells into my double. The excerpt below is from the current shooters handbook: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Dan Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 will this work on a mec 9000 ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Rapid Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 Cole Younger: Thanks for the post and glad you're having success with QuikLoader. Crazy Gun Barney: This die is made specifically for 12 ga and is very similar to the clean-up die RCBS used to make. It doesn't "neck" the shell or "cone" it. Instead it does a final sizing of the shell after it is crimped (the final crimping usually bulges the case slightly). Also, the force of the final crimp usually puts a small roll-edge on the shell (see left shell in photo below). So, in one step QuikLoader does a final-sizing as well as a minor taper on the last 1/2˝ of the shell (shell on right in photo below). A minor difference in the cartridge but really helps them drop into a s/s. RR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCandless Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 1 hour ago, Crazy Gun Barney, SASS #2428 said: Just wondering... mostly because i dont ever do this in any way when making BP shells for either my 12ga double or my 87... but what is the technical difference between using a tapering die specifically made for a 12ga shell, and "necking" the shell with any other die that doesn't say "12GA" on it (other than is gets around the rule stated below by having "12ga" stamped on the tool). Not trying to stir the pot, I am just curious because I can see how this may aid feeding in my 87, and even in getting the shells into my double. The excerpt below is from the current shooters handbook: Necked down shotgun shells are distinctly "bottle nosed". I don't know of any factory made shells of this type. But that hasn't stopped people from trying. I'm thinking that would certainly increase pressures. Martini-Henry once made a shotgun that used a 14ga bottle-nose shell, but I don't have any pictures of that. Folks have also tried it this way, partially crimped with an overshot card... which is definitely illegal. Notice the bit of a bottle-neck towards the base. I don't think that's legal either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Gun Barney, SASS #2428 Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 Good deal. So what is the final diameter at the end of the 12ga shell after being tapered? I dont have a shell here at work with me, but SAAMI dims on Google show a 12ga to have a .797" diameter. With a simple 3° taper, that reduces the end to .745", a difference of .052". That doesn't sound like much, but keep in mind the difference between a 32 long and a 38 special is only .045" in diameter. My 87 is 10ga. So, I am assuming that the 1/2" depth and the 3° taper are not random dimensions, there is a reason behind them. So if an eager machinist were to develop a similar tool for 10ga, do you think the 3° and 1/2" depth rule is the acceptable taper? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castalia,SASS#18915 Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 1 hour ago, Crazy Gun Barney, SASS #2428 said: The excerpt below is from the current shooters handbook: This idea has been around for some time. It was banned years ago . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jailhouse Jim, SASS #13104 Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 If it helps CGB, I use mine on a MEC 600 JR. After loading each shell, I measured the taper from base to end at between .003 and .005. I am away from home on a fire so I can't give you actual dimensions but it isn't a huge difference. I am most pleased with the fact the shell is "Trued" so they pass the shell checker every time and drop nicely into the chambers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Go West Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 The original rule banning tapered shells was due to the use of a 16 ga. die on 12 ga. shells. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Gun Barney, SASS #2428 Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 13 minutes ago, Go West said: The original rule banning tapered shells was due to the use of a 16 ga. die on 12 ga. shells. So there is a "rule based" limit to the allowed taper (both depth and angle)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Rapid Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 Crazy Gun Barney: Thx for the question. After being tapered, the shells are measuring .793˝-.795˝ in the middle of the case. The cases I just measured are not PERFECTLY round - which I believe is due to deformities in the case and wad and not to the die. The very end of the case after being tapered (a DoubleAA Winchester) measures .765˝-.767˝ - about .030˝ difference. (Your calculation of a 32° taper delivering a .745˝ result is right, but the cases are "plastic" and the diameter rebounds a bit. However, the feed edge of the shell is where the big difference is, and this is the edge that gets in the way when feeding doubles into a s/s. In the photo I posted above, the rolled edge of the untapered case (left in photo, a regular shell out of the MEC) was .803˝-.808˝!! - showing a rather not-perfectly-round crimp end that is almost .040˝ larger than what QuikLoader does. RR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Gun Barney, SASS #2428 Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 I've been known to run them thru a sizer to ensure they are not bulged, but I always read the rules I copied earlier as eliminating the possibility of reducing the diameter of a shell specifically to make them easier to chamber than standard factory ammo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Fire, SASS 10064 Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 who is the vendor for this die? Price ? I assume also works on factory ammo? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Rapid Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 Marshal Fire... Re: vendor? ... at the moment, they can be purchased from UniqueTek, Coyote's Mercantile, or directly from me by clicking on this link. (Regarding price, please check with the various resources above so I don't make this sound like a commercial post.) Yes, they absolutely can be used on factory (non-"reloaded") ammo. RR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 The more important question is where did you find a slime green Mec? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Rapid Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 Larsen... You obviously don't know the old cowboy song: "You Better Not Make Fun of My Slime Green MEC!" Just sayin'... * About 8 or 9 years ago they had a promotion and their MEC Jrs were slime green. It absolutely keeps me from falling asleep when I'm loading shotshells!!!!!!!! See ya at Bordertown! RR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toranado, SASS # 58447 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Sooooo. Legal or not?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three Foot Johnson Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Twenty years ago, or more, I made a similar die from a .50 BMG case for 20 gauge shells. It's a bit time consuming, as it's made to be used in a single stage Rock Chucker and the shell has to be pushed in, then the die turned over and pushed back out, but it smooths out the crimp bulge nicely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Art Tillery Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 35 minutes ago, Toranado, SASS # 58447 said: Sooooo. Legal or not?? Yep, Legal to use Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waxahachie Kid #17017 L Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Looks interesting. For me...I gotta use either a no crimp shell, or a rolled-crimp shell, in my Parker double, with damascus barrels. I have one of those old timey iron, roll-crimp devices, that were popular way back in the day. It's old, but works great. Thanks for your post. W.K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-BAR #18287 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 2 hours ago, Major Art Tillery said: Yep, Legal to use Not to be obnoxious, but PWB has yet to post. Kinda hoping you are right, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tequila Shooter Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 I looked at this and wondered if it would work on brass shells. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branchwater Jack SASS #88854 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 13 hours ago, Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 said: The more important question is where did you find a slime green Mec? If I recall, MEC did a zombie line several years back.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fireball #7709 Life Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 It's probably good that someone is filling this gap in the MEC process, but the ability to do this has been around for 40 years or more. Just one of the machines that produces this AS PART OF ITS NORMAL PROCESS, is the Hornady 366 progressive, I believe there are others that will produce similar results as delivered, but this is what I've used for the last 30 years. The first 2 pics are some of my crappy reloads for practice.(they look even better on once or twice fired hulls for matchs) It's entertaining to see the comments that pop up when someone rediscovers what's possible, or what was/is available from the factory. You'll notice the factory AA load in the 2nd 2 pics is identical for all practical purposes. It's a shame AA's quality has slipped so much, but STS's are still being made nicely.(insert much hand wringing about cost/availability) For all the hand wringing rules people, who, what and how would you measure any of it? Set actual dimensional go/no go? Check using calibrated calipers, or micrometers? Compressed plastic or touching lightly? Its a ridiculous notion. I've never seen a match director/RO bother to look at someones ammo(most/all of what we're discussing is hidden in the shotshell belt). What's next, ammo checks at major matches?! Ammo checks at the line? Seems like everyone is walking around with an orange sizer on the posse, just before they shoot these days, wish I'd a dreamt that one up. I'd be more concerned about what some people put IN the shells, than how they look. Back in the day of crappy knockdowns, a lot of us were experimenting with double loads of shot ahead of guessed at powder charges with cut down wads. There is only so much deformation of the plastic hull that the basic shape will retain, this new gizmo doesn't appear to do as much as is possible with other readily available methods, but if you have a MEC, and want to fool with it, it appears to make better looking and likely functioning ammo. Clearly it's not something that could be regulated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCandless Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 I had several boxes of reloaded Win AA shells that went fine through the case check, but eventually the crimp edge expanded and would fail the check. I'd run them through the press again and all would be fine, but they'd still expand with time. So, I have something like this mounted on my gun cart, and run all shells through it prior to use on a stage. It works like magick! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Jorge Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Just to make sure, prior to purchase, I, too would like the legality of the device officially confirmed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusty Devil Dale Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 I make a practice of re-crimping my shells the evening before a match. It re-sizes the crimp end bulge and any out-of -roundness from relaxation of the plastic in storage. It only takes a few minutes to run 100 shells through the final crimp die. I also put them through a MEC Supersizer, but honestly, I don't see much benefit form that. The brass doesn't seem to change much after re-sizing during loading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cusz M. Dutch SASS Life 55326 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 A rolled crimp on the drill press will give almost if not the same profile. Will also take the cheap plastic shells and melt them into nice looking crimp. Same with the AA with the folds no longer holding. Melt them back and good for one more go. The taper is very visible even to the naked eye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 9 hours ago, Fireball #7709 Life said: It's probably good that someone is filling this gap in the MEC process, but the ability to do this has been around for 40 years or more. Just one of the machines that produces this AS PART OF ITS NORMAL PROCESS, is the Hornady 366 progressive, I believe there are others that will produce similar results as delivered, but this is what I've used for the last 30 years. The first 2 pics are some of my crappy reloads for practice.(they look even better on once or twice fired hulls for matchs) It's entertaining to see the comments that pop up when someone rediscovers what's possible, or what was/is available from the factory. You'll notice the factory AA load in the 2nd 2 pics is identical for all practical purposes. It's a shame AA's quality has slipped so much, but STS's are still being made nicely.(insert much hand wringing about cost/availability) For all the hand wringing rules people, who, what and how would you measure any of it? Set actual dimensional go/no go? Check using calibrated calipers, or micrometers? Compressed plastic or touching lightly? Its a ridiculous notion. I've never seen a match director/RO bother to look at someones ammo(most/all of what we're discussing is hidden in the shotshell belt). What's next, ammo checks at major matches?! Ammo checks at the line? Seems like everyone is walking around with an orange sizer on the posse, just before they shoot these days, wish I'd a dreamt that one up. I'd be more concerned about what some people put IN the shells, than how they look. Back in the day of crappy knockdowns, a lot of us were experimenting with double loads of shot ahead of guessed at powder charges with cut down wads. There is only so much deformation of the plastic hull that the basic shape will retain, this new gizmo doesn't appear to do as much as is possible with other readily available methods, but if you have a MEC, and want to fool with it, it appears to make better looking and likely functioning ammo. Clearly it's not something that could be regulated. My 45+ year old Mec 600jr crimps like that OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted October 15, 2021 Share Posted October 15, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cole Younger Requlator Posted October 15, 2021 Author Share Posted October 15, 2021 Thank you Pale Wolf . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 On 10/13/2021 at 5:30 PM, Marshal Fire, SASS 10064 said: who is the vendor for this die? Price ? I assume also works on factory ammo? Thanks I saw Coyote Mercantiles video last night and ordered one. It was $79.99 and free shipping. I have just loaded 250 shotshells - AA once fired hulls - some I loaded a few days ago (I gauge as I load - won’t gauge now). I ended up with about 25-30 that wouldn’t gauge when I went to box them for regional this weekend. The SliXprings checker/sizer is AWESOME but not for 25-30 shells. This handy gadget will make it so much easier and will save me loads of time and reduce wasted components. The video was clearer than the pictures, for me. Hugs! Scarlett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 On 10/13/2021 at 4:43 PM, Roger Rapid said: Marshal Fire... Re: vendor? ... at the moment, they can be purchased from UniqueTek, Coyote's Mercantile, or directly from me by clicking on this link. (Regarding price, please check with the various resources above so I don't make this sound like a commercial post.) Yes, they absolutely can be used on factory (non-"reloaded") ammo. RR FYI: of the three sources listed, Coyote's Mercantile has free shipping, others have a fee . . . just saying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 15 minutes ago, Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L said: FYI: of the three sources listed, Coyote's Mercantile has free shipping, others have a fee . . . just saying Nothing is "Free"... But I love the "Free" promotions of this product Phantom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Rapid Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 Got several PMs and emails on what QuikLoader will fit. The list is growing but at the moment it will work in the MEC Jr press, MEC 650 and 9000 progressive presses, MEC Grabber, MEC Sizemaster, and Texan presses. It will not work in a MEC Case Conditioner, RCBS RockChucker, or Dillon SL900. Please PM me if you learn of something else it will work in. RR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.