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blowback with 44 sp in 44mag lever guns


stef75
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fellas do you get blowback with these combinations in lever guns? I dont notice it with 38 in my 357 but maybe I am too insenstiive . And what are the effects of 'blowback anyhow, a little gas in the face or inconsistent ballistics? 

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Anytime a shorter length case is used in a longer chamber, you are gonna get a carbon ring

build up which will cause some difficultly when you try to chamber a longer length case.

Soooooo, be sure to super clean the chamber if you later decide to use .44 mag cases.

 

As for the blowback problem, there could be numerous causes for that:

1. lightly charged loads and your cases are not expanding inside the chamber.

2.  lightly crimped (or no crimped) ammo, which won't allow your powder to ignite

completely to expand the cases.

3.  you could have a slightly oversized chamber.  You didn't mention if it was a Marlin or not, but

if its a Marlin, produced by Remington, chances are the chamber could be on the large size of

SAAMI specs.

 

P.S. - you didn't list your load data.  If you will list your load data, some of the

Wire pards could tell you if you are using a light load/bullet combo.

All you may need to do is change your load data or bullet weight.

Sometimes, changing just your powder type will help solve your issue.

 

..........Widder

 

Edited by Widder, SASS #59054
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Posted (edited)

Thanks Widder,  I havent loaded yet but getting a uberti 73 44 mag on loan. 

 

 Can I post load data here? Well the mods will let me know if not I guess.

Considering:

1.  5 - 5.5 grains of red dot  behind cast 200grain RNFP.

2. 6.5- 7 grains of unique behind a 240grain maybe for hunting and fun.

 

I assume the uberti specs arent too oversized? Will the first load be susceptible to blowback?

Edited by stef75
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I can't comment on the Uberti specs because I've never handled one.

 

If you have sufficient blowback, slug your barrel to find its true lands/groove dementions

and make sure your lead bullets are proper size for the barrel.

 

..........Widder

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, stef75 said:

I assume the uberti specs arent too oversized?

 

My experience with Uberti firearms (based on .3577 and .45 Colt chambered guns)  - the chambers will be cut at SAAMI maximum diameter.  Which in .45 Colt guns, makes the chamber  as much as 5-6 thousandths of an inch larger than the cartridge.  With .44 special and .44 magnum being more modern cartridge designs, the cartridge diameter to chamber size fit will probably be more snug.

 

Quote

Will the first load be susceptible to blowback?

 

Probably not, if you have the bullet sized the same or one or two thousandths larger than the barrel groove diameter.   In other words, shoot a 0.430" or 0.431" lead bullet.  Shoot a soft slug that will obdurate (swell up) to be snug in the barrel, too.  Both size and hardness matter in controlling blowback.

 

The common commercial cast .44 caliber bullets will be 0.429" and 12 to 16 Brinnell hardness - those could certainly be difficult to shoot without having a little blowback because the smaller, hard bullet will not seal the barrel, which means less case expansion to seal the chamber to keep in the combustion gases.  And if you order (or cast) bullet designs made for the .44 WCF (aka .44-40), they are usually sized at 0.427" or 0.428" and very likely to give some blowback problems unless pretty soft.

 

So, there are several other ways to prevent blowback as well, in case you have problems, but good bullet selection, a healthy powder charge, and a tight crimp are the things that are easy to apply as the first step.

 

good luck, GJ

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I have two 92's in .44 Magnum.   A pre-safety Rossi, and a rebarreled Winchester.

I have found that with Specials, I got a lot of stove pipes and other "malfunctions."   So, I just switched to downloaded Magnums.  Now the guns work just fine.

As far as blowback goes, my primary main match gun is an AWA Lightning in .45 Colt.   I know it exists because my cases are all sooty.   I just clean the gun after the match.   I don't really notice the blowback unless I actually make an effort to pay attention for it.  It's not a debilitating thing.

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7 hours ago, stef75 said:

Thanks Widder,  I havent loaded yet but getting a uberti 73 44 mag on loan. 

 

 Can I post load data here? Well the mods will let me know if not I guess.

Considering:

1.  5 - 5.5 grains of red dot  behind cast 200grain RNFP.

2. 6.5- 7 grains of unique behind a 240grain maybe for hunting and fun.

 

I assume the uberti specs arent too oversized? Will the first load be susceptible to blowback?

Seven grains of Unique under a 240 RNFP bullet is my Wild Bunch rifle load.  The bullet does not need a gas check.  I don't get blow back in my rifle with that load.  That load would be plenty good for small game.  However, for larger game, say feral hogs, I would use a gas checked bullet and a slow burning pistol powder like W296/H110 or 2400 for more velocity.

 

While my rifle will cycle 44 Specials, I shoot 44 magnums because once-fired 44 magnum cases are not too hard to find, but not so 44 Special cases.

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Unless you are shooting black powder, you shouldn't have blowback problems with .44 Spl in a .44 Mangle-em rifle.  I would be more concerned, however, if you were to get hangfires, with smokeless powders, which would indicate too light a load and/or too little crimp.  Also, I would check a cartridge or two to see if you can push the bullet down into the case before you crimp. (Use a dummy round for the test.) That will verify if there is enough grip by the case on the bullet. Usually the expander plugs on .44 Spl and Magnum die sets are correct.  Use a roll crimp of the case mouth into the bullet crimp groove or lube groove, but not so much as to bulge the case wall behind the crimp away from the bullet's side.  Since the .44 Maggie rifle is a '73, you shouldn't have trouble feeding, but if you do, I'd switch to magnum brass, with loads reduced.  I've used 7.5 gr Universal behind a 213.5 gr. cast bullet in my Rossi '92 to duplicate my .44-40 ballistics (8.0 gr Universal).  This is a stout load in my OM Vaquero with 7.5" barrels...950 ft/sec from the handgun.

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Ditto on HK Uriahs post. I've always used .44 mag brass downloaded, never had problems of any kind.

I recommend this route especially if the rifle is on loan, you wouldn't want to create any problems for the owner.

Good luck, Pard

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Just to put my Oar inna water.  It doesn't matter which straight wall cartridge you use.  44 Mag, 44 Spl, 44 Russian, 45 Colt, 45 Schofield, C45S.  With straight wall cases, the cases DO NOT expand enough to seal the chamber.  Especially true with Uberti Rifles.  You can mitigate the Bloc-By somewhat with the load, but you will be burning way more powder and shoot ing much heavier bullets then needed for this game.  This will become really evident with BP and Subs.  Keep a small bottle of Break Free handy at a match if the carrier gets sticky (it will).

 

Short cases will create a carbon ring in the chamber that may well interfere with cambering full length cases.  Some powder leave less, some more.  BP and Subs don't leave a ring.

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