Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L Posted May 26, 2021 Share Posted May 26, 2021 Just was reading through a topic that had replies from people who evidently are not clear on the copper currently being applied by some shooters to their front pistol sights. The material in question is 100% copper and comes in a roll that can be applied in a thin veneer, as opposed to the thicker brass sight overlay in use by many shooters. The material is available with adhesive applied or with no adhesive applied and was intended for use in grounding computer room flooring. It is glued to the front sight in a similar manner to the thick brass SASS approved front sight and trimmed to fit. The only difference is the thickness of the material. I do not understand why an ROC ruling is required. Since it is thinner, it does not require opening the rear sight to provide a decent sight picture. Many options are legal for front sight alteration in this clearly falls into that category. I cannot imagine a world where every potential thickness of legal material applied to a front sight has to be approved by the ROC. The original question regarding HVAC tape is completely different than this product and probably should be reviewed. Thank you, Cowboy Rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted May 26, 2021 Share Posted May 26, 2021 I guess it depends on what the definition of "Tape" is... Pretty simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L Posted May 26, 2021 Author Share Posted May 26, 2021 Brass or copper overlays are legal. Current installation method of applying a commonly used/approved brass overlay is adhesive. This material has no structural integrity and cannot be used to bind other material together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted May 26, 2021 Share Posted May 26, 2021 2 minutes ago, Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L said: Brass or copper overlays are legal. Current installation method of applying a commonly used/approved brass overlay is adhesive. This material has no structural integrity and cannot be used to bind other material together. I personally understand all of this. Again, it just comes down to the definition of "Tape". If it fits that definition then the ROC will have to make an exception to the "Tape" rule. Let them have their time to look at this...no biggie is it? Phantom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedalia Dave Posted May 26, 2021 Share Posted May 26, 2021 42 minutes ago, Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L said: The original question regarding HVAC tape is completely different than this product and probably should be reviewed. What you describe and the "HVAC" tape are different only in the material they are made from. They fall into the category of Foil tape, Many different adhesive backings can be had from temporary to almost permanent. Some adhesives are conductive as well. You can also get different thickness of foil up to a point. The foil can be comprised of Aluminum, Copper, Tin plated copper, lead, Stainless Steel and a few other specialty alloys. We use several different foil tapes where I work for shielding, tuning RF circuits, bonding, grounding, and yes even ducting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L Posted May 26, 2021 Author Share Posted May 26, 2021 1 hour ago, Sedalia Dave said: What you describe and the "HVAC" tape are different only in the material they are made from. They fall into the category of Foil tape, Many different adhesive backings can be had from temporary to almost permanent. Some adhesives are conductive as well. You can also get different thickness of foil up to a point. The foil can be comprised of Aluminum, Copper, Tin plated copper, lead, Stainless Steel and a few other specialty alloys. We use several different foil tapes where I work for shielding, tuning RF circuits, bonding, grounding, and yes even ducting. This product is non-structural in anyway and can be purchased with adhesive applied or without adhesive applied. If you start with the non-adhesive version and adhere it to your front sight it is exactly the same thing as the thicker version which is also adhered by the use of to the front sight. Tapes are intended to bind or seal. This product is merely a conductor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted May 26, 2021 Share Posted May 26, 2021 30 minutes ago, Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L said: This product is non-structural in anyway and can be purchased with adhesive applied or without adhesive applied. If you start with the non-adhesive version and adhere it to your front sight it is exactly the same thing as the thicker version which is also adhered by the use of to the front sight. Tapes are intended to bind or seal. This product is merely a conductor. Not sure what it's structural capabilities have to do with it...probably over my head. However, when used as a Transitive Verb: to fasten, tie, bind, cover, or support Again, simply needs to be defined by the ROC. Phantom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L Posted May 26, 2021 Author Share Posted May 26, 2021 In this case it’s a noun, and since the ROC has decided to review it, we will have to wait. Thicker than gold leaf, but thinner than formed brass. I would be happy to provide a sample to anyone on the ROC for inspection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Spade Mikey Wilson Posted May 26, 2021 Share Posted May 26, 2021 Wait......there are people who actually use pistol sights??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L Posted May 26, 2021 Author Share Posted May 26, 2021 11 minutes ago, High Spade Mikey Wilson said: Wait......there are people who actually use pistol sights??? Evidently it does happen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted May 26, 2021 Share Posted May 26, 2021 1 hour ago, Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L said: In this case it’s a noun, and since the ROC has decided to review it, we will have to wait. Thicker than gold leaf, but thinner than formed brass. I would be happy to provide a sample to anyone on the ROC for inspection. The Shooter taped his front sight with thin brass tape. Not an English major so... Phantom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L Posted May 26, 2021 Author Share Posted May 26, 2021 It is not a matter of semantics as you suggest, but a misuse of the word tape. Very similar to the misuse of the word clip when referring to loading your 1911. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted May 26, 2021 Share Posted May 26, 2021 32 minutes ago, Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L said: It is not a matter of semantics as you suggest, but a misuse of the word tape. Very similar to the misuse of the word clip when referring to loading your 1911. Pretty hard to ignore semantics when dealing with a rulebook, but you are correct that I see this as a matter of semantics. The ROC must define the meaning of the word and whether it applies to this situation. Phantom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Coffinmaker Posted May 26, 2021 Share Posted May 26, 2021 Well, I dunno. If "it" looks like tape. If "it" feels like tape. If "it" is onna roll like tape. If "it" applies like tape. Even if the adhesive is separate, it's TAPE. Seems simple. After all, if "it" walks like a Duck. If "it" quacks like a Duck. If "it" feels like a Duck. If"it" hatches like a Duck. It's a DUCK!! Calling it a Goose would be somewhat Oxymoron. I have also found, observed, seen, noticed, my front sights are just a "dark" thingie sticking up offa barrel end. Make no matter what material or colour, it's still just a dark thingie sticking up offa end of the barrel. Burma Shave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L Posted May 26, 2021 Author Share Posted May 26, 2021 4 minutes ago, Colorado Coffinmaker said: Well, I dunno. If "it" looks like tape. If "it" feels like tape. If "it" is onna roll like tape. If "it" applies like tape. Even if the adhesive is separate, it's TAPE. Seems simple. After all, if "it" walks like a Duck. If "it" quacks like a Duck. If "it" feels like a Duck. If"it" hatches like a Duck. It's a DUCK!! Calling it a Goose would be somewhat Oxymoron. I have also found, observed, seen, noticed, my front sights are just a "dark" thingie sticking up offa barrel end. Make no matter what material or colour, it's still just a dark thingie sticking up offa end of the barrel. Burma Shave. At what thickness (or “thinness”) does it become tape? Gold leaf (legal) and bendable brass (legal) must not be, but anything in between is? Any solid sight made from this material would be legal. A solid metal overlay would appear the same as if the sight were made from that material. It seems the rule already permits this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted May 26, 2021 Share Posted May 26, 2021 3 hours ago, Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L said: At what thickness (or “thinness”) does it become tape? Gold leaf (legal) and bendable brass (legal) must not be, but anything in between is? Any solid sight made from this material would be legal. A solid metal overlay would appear the same as if the sight were made from that material. It seems the rule already permits this. I like circular discussions...so I'll answer this rhetorical question. It's Tape if it's Tape. If it's not Tape, then it's not Tape. There...we figured it out Howz about we just kick back and wait till we here from the ROC...? Phantom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L Posted May 27, 2021 Author Share Posted May 27, 2021 9 minutes ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said: I like circular discussions...so I'll answer this rhetorical question. It's Tape if it's Tape. If it's not Tape, then it's not Tape. There...we figured it out Howz about we just kick back and wait till we here from the ROC...? Phantom I’m in. (But it’s not tape) https://basiccopper.com/20milcost5x1.html?gclid=CjwKCAjw47eFBhA9EiwAy8kzNMYWvBA3u461xgi-Gs3_Ngm7Ovk7NYBg4GOJqzWs_PBreRgjoPeuChoCBIYQAvD_BwE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Coffinmaker Posted May 27, 2021 Share Posted May 27, 2021 Thickness. OK. Does that mean the varying "thickness" of Duct Tape make it "not Tape??" PLUS ONE to Phantom (all and last) It's a DUCK. TAPE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L Posted May 27, 2021 Author Share Posted May 27, 2021 Equating a solid strip of metal to duct or duck tape? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tucker McNeely Posted May 27, 2021 Share Posted May 27, 2021 How many copper ducks does it take to make a roll of copper duck tape? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted May 27, 2021 Share Posted May 27, 2021 6 minutes ago, Tucker McNeely said: How many copper ducks does it take to make a roll of copper duck tape? Uh...it was a joke...and a follow on to his previous post that mentioned ducks...it was funny...this post is trying too hard to be funny... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L Posted May 27, 2021 Author Share Posted May 27, 2021 P - Thank you for allowing me to clarify the product in question. Hopefully the ROC will take this information into consideration when making their decision. Have a great one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L Posted May 29, 2021 Author Share Posted May 29, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted June 4, 2021 Share Posted June 4, 2021 "PLATING" definition - SASS Wire - SASS Wire Forum (sassnet.com) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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