Tucker McNeely 263 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 I have a friend at work that asked if I knew of a 10mm lever gun. Who can make such a beast? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Goody, SASS #26190 1,281 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 I would say it is do-able. Same guys that are making the 45acp work in the 73. Start with a rifle chambered in 38-40 so the bore would be the right size, cut the chamber end off, rechamber for the 10mm. shorten mag tube to match the barrel and get one of the carriers that handle the shorter 45 caliber cartridges. Cody Conagher quotes $560 on his website to do the 45acp thing, I would guess it would be more or less the same depending on whether he already has a 10mm reamer. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
The Original Lumpy Gritz 7,483 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 Just because you might be able to. WHY, would you? Very expensive brass for one thing. OL 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Michigan Slim 7,904 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 Would be legal for deer in Indiana. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nimble Fingers SASS# 25439 216 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 27 minutes ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said: Just because you might be able to. WHY, would you? Very expensive brass for one thing. OL Wouldn’t it be close to a .41 Magnum? Lever actions in .357 and .44 magnum, why not .41? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tucker McNeely 263 Posted February 9 Author Share Posted February 9 33 minutes ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said: Just because you might be able to. WHY, would you? Very expensive brass for one thing. OL Because it’s his money and he wants to. Next question Mr. Lumpy? 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tucker McNeely 263 Posted February 9 Author Share Posted February 9 59 minutes ago, Goody, SASS #26190 said: I would say it is do-able. Same guys that are making the 45acp work in the 73. Start with a rifle chambered in 38-40 so the bore would be the right size, cut the chamber end off, rechamber for the 10mm. shorten mag tube to match the barrel and get one of the carriers that handle the shorter 45 caliber cartridges. Cody Conagher quotes $560 on his website to do the 45acp thing, I would guess it would be more or less the same depending on whether he already has a 10mm reamer. Thx Goody. I’ll have him get in touch w/ Cody. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sedalia Dave 13,612 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 Toggle link rifle or a Marlin. The 92 action would be cost prohibitive to rework. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Widder, SASS #59054 7,850 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 You can do about anything ya want to with a Marlin..... if ya got enough aspirin. P.S. - The aspirin is for the headaches you'll encounter before you achieve success..... ..........Widder 3 1 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tom Bullweed 478 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 I have looked into retiring a Uberti Henry trapper and having the .45 Colt chamber lined and machined for .45 ACP to be a companion for my 1911s. My concern is that the revolver rounds are seated with a roll crimp. Most auto rounds are secured with a taper crimp so that the case mouth stays square for proper chambering. The makes it easier for a round to be pushed into the case due to forces of recoil and the mag spring. The heavier recoil of the 10mm may be more problematic than the .45 ACP. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tom Bullweed 478 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 Just now, Tom Bullweed said: I have looked into retiring a Uberti Henry trapper and having the .45 Colt chamber lined and machined for .45 ACP to be a companion for my 1911s. My concern is that the revolver rounds are seated with a roll crimp. Most auto rounds are secured with a taper crimp so that the case mouth stays square for proper chambering. The makes it easier for a round to be pushed into the case due to forces of recoil and the mag spring. The heavier recoil of the 10mm may be more problematic than the .45 ACP. To get a proper roll crimp the bullet needs to have a crimp canelure. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Griff 1,610 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 1 hour ago, Tom Bullweed said: I have looked into retiring a Uberti Henry trapper and having the .45 Colt chamber lined and machined for .45 ACP to be a companion for my 1911s. My concern is that the revolver rounds are seated with a roll crimp. Most auto rounds are secured with a taper crimp so that the case mouth stays square for proper chambering. The makes it easier for a round to be pushed into the case due to forces of recoil and the mag spring. The heavier recoil of the 10mm may be more problematic than the .45 ACP. I'm having a Henry done in Cowboy45special... still a rimmed cartridge so legal for Classic Cowboy, yet can run 45 Auto ballistics for hogs!!! 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Widder, SASS #59054 7,850 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 Howdy Griff. If the rifle can handle the pressures, you can load those Cowboy 45 Specials to .45 Super ballistics. ..........Widder Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G W Wade 1,050 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 45 ACP headspace on the case mouth. Too much crimp can cause misfires. GW Quote Link to post Share on other sites
The Rainmaker, SASS #11631 920 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 11 hours ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said: Just because you might be able to. WHY, would you? Very expensive brass for one thing. OL Agreed Lumpy. I can also put a Ferrari engine in a Pinto... but why? Yes, it's his money... but why? 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Marshal TKD, Sass # 36984L 176 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 11 hours ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said: Just because you might be able to. WHY, would you? Very expensive brass for one thing. OL Why? That is simple! The 10mm is a Planet Wrecker Magnum in a pistol. In a long gun it would turn into a Galaxy Wrecker Magnum. 1 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 1,159 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 5 minutes ago, The Rainmaker, SASS #11631 said: Agreed Lumpy. I can also put a Ferrari engine in a Pinto... but why? Yes, it's his money... but why? Oooh! That would be super cool! Not to mention unexpectedly unusual. Sounds like a lot of fun. Fun... Unique... These are things that we all do from time to time. Everyone should have a least one oddly customized gun in their collection. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sedalia Dave 13,612 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 The issue I see is chamber pressures. 10 mm has 2.5 times the chamber pressure of 45 Colt. Not sure a toggle like rifle is up to a steady diet of that level of pressure. 1 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Trailrider #896 1,878 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 There already is a "10mm" round that works in leveraction rifles. It's called the .38 WCF, aka .38-40! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
J.D. Daily 340 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 14 minutes ago, Trailrider #896 said: There already is a "10mm" round that works in leveraction rifles. It's called the .38 WCF, aka .38-40! The 10mm has 40% more energy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Griff 1,610 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 12 hours ago, Widder, SASS #59054 said: Howdy Griff. If the rifle can handle the pressures, you can load those Cowboy 45 Specials to .45 Super ballistics. ..........Widder I'm not sure the toggle link can... I'd have to do some serious bolt thrust calculations... and I ain't that good with math! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bailey Creek,5759 166 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 You could have a 92 converted over to 10MM . 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sedalia Dave 13,612 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 20 minutes ago, Bailey Creek,5759 said: You could have a 92 converted over to 10MM . Earlier I said that a 92 action would be too expensive. However thinking about it it is probably doable. You would likely have to start with a 38 special rifle. The rim diameter of 10 mm Auto is only 0.015" smaller than a 38 special. this would save a lot of expensive bolt work. The cartridge stop and mag tube would be the right size and the cartridge guides could be easily modified. The carrier would be the tricky part. With no cartridge rim, getting the case head to rise up so that cartridge would enter the chamber without binding might prove to be a real challenge. One idea in my mind that might work may negate being able to use the loading gate. You would however need a new barrel. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Griff 1,610 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 (edited) The trouble with converting an 1892 action to a rimless cartridge is that the round's feeding is controlled by the RIM through the cartridge guides. The Marlin 1894 action is very close in strength to the 1892 Winchester, but doesn't rely on a mechanical feed control, making the conversion somewhat easier. The only issue can be reliable extraction, with can be successfully modified. Edited February 9 by Griff 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
El CupAJoe 320 Posted February 9 Share Posted February 9 10 mm has high pressure and large case diameter both of which lead to higher bolt force. While a 73 would definitely be the easiest to convert in my non-gunsmith brain, I too would want a better locking action than toggle. A 92 action could definitely handle the bolt force ala 454 Casull, which I calculate has a bolt thrust of ballpark 12,000 lbf. I calculate 10 mm to be approx 5500 lbf bolt thrust. .357 Mag approx. 4000 lbf bolt thrust. Also for reference, I calculate 30-30 to be about 5900 Lbf Bolt thrust. Hope this helps, but I'm not an internal balistician and any information i provide here is reference only to be used at your own risk... 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tom Bullweed 478 Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 9 hours ago, J.D. Daily said: The 10mm has 40% more energy. I have some Remington .38-40 High Speed factory ammo made for Win 1892 and single shot rifles. I would never try it in my original 73. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Duffield, SASS #23454 1,009 Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 On 2/8/2021 at 8:56 PM, Nimble Fingers SASS# 25439 said: Wouldn’t it be close to a .41 Magnum? Lever actions in .357 and .44 magnum, why not .41? I have a Marlin in .41 Magnum. It is a splendid deer rifle. Duffield 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nimble Fingers SASS# 25439 216 Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 10 hours ago, Griff said: I'm not sure the toggle link can... I'd have to do some serious bolt thrust calculations... and I ain't that good with math! But if they are putting out a 1873 that shoots.44mag, I would think a 10mm/.41mag would be less pressure. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Griff 1,610 Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 3 minutes ago, Nimble Fingers SASS# 25439 said: But if they are putting out a 1873 that shoots.44mag, I would think a 10mm/.41mag would be less pressure. It's my understanding that "fatter" and longer cartridges lessen bolt thrust as there's more surface area to hold the cartridge in place. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
El CupAJoe 320 Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 1 hour ago, Nimble Fingers SASS# 25439 said: But if they are putting out a 1873 that shoots.44mag, I would think a 10mm/.41mag would be less pressure. I calculate bolt thrust for 44 mag to be somewhere in the ballpark of 5900+ lbf... 1 hour ago, Griff said: It's my understanding that "fatter" and longer cartridges lessen bolt thrust as there's more surface area to hold the cartridge in place. so, think of the chamber as a piston, the greater the diameter of the gas pressure that has to be contained, the greater the force for the same pressure value. Now as the pressure increases, friction in the chamber will also increase, but so will the tendency for the brass to stretch and flow and push against the bolt... I'm not sure who's making a 44mag 73, but I'd probably want to use those toggles (in case of improved metallurgy) if I was approaching this project and a 92 or a marlin was not an option. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tucker McNeely 263 Posted February 10 Author Share Posted February 10 https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/11/01/10mm-40sw-ranger-point-precision-1040ss/ You guys got me thinking. I found this. Pretty neat. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Flatbush 31 Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 Well, there you go! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Warden Callaway 4,788 Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 But can they convert it to use Glock magazine? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
The Rainmaker, SASS #11631 920 Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 No... 1911. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sedalia Dave 13,612 Posted February 10 Share Posted February 10 5 hours ago, Tucker McNeely said: https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/11/01/10mm-40sw-ranger-point-precision-1040ss/ You guys got me thinking. I found this. Pretty neat. At $1800.00 plus the cost of the donor rifle I doubt people are knocking down their door for one. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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