EOT registration announcement from SASS on Facebook

[Dogmeat Dad, SASS #48563L 449]

9 minutes ago, Black Hills Barb said:

See if you can get on a waiting list!

 Don't know if they have one.  I mentioned that in one of the other threads.

[JB32311 3]

EOT Schedule.docx

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 2,920]

JB...

If you want many pards to see your suggestion, paste the text into the edit function of another post.

 

good luck, GJ

[Frontier Lone Rider 44]

With this many pards in the East ready and willing to attend an EOT, maybe they should rotate EOT East every two to three years.  It appears the membership would definitely support the activity, so it isn't a case of losing money.

[JB32311 3]

Given the popularity of the Match it would make sense to offer two separate three-day shooting matches which are held back to back.  This would accommodate twice the number of shooters.  Being held in the middle of the US this would help accommodate an increased number of shooters.  Realistically, folks here on the east coast would spend 3 days travel time to New Mexico, hence why some never go.  It takes a two week vacation to travel to, shoot, and then travel home for one match!!  If the match were centrally located (as this year), and offered two (2) separate 3-day shooting venues back to back, SASS could accommodate more shooters!  YES I KNOW THERE ARE A LOT OF LOGISTICS FOR VOLUNTEERS, SHOOT-OFF, ETC., But anyone see any other way?

 

Jb

[Dogmeat Dad, SASS #48563L 449]

Remember that the goal is to have ALL competitors shoot the exact same match.  That is impossible as it is, just running three shifts per day for three days, to make sure that all of the competitors have the exact same conditions on the same stages, but trying to further split that into two completely separate matches spanning six days is a recipe for disaster.  Not to mention the fact that you would have to have the winners who shot the first three day match return for their awards after the second three day match has finished.  It's just never going to work.

 

To the best of my knowledge, Winter Range was historically the "Biggest Match" (at least after the move of EOT to Founders Ranch) and they handled what 1,000 shooters, maybe 1,200?  (I'm sure someone from that committee will provide the correct answer)  and although they sold out every year, realistically how many of them returned every year?  Every other year?  Every 3rd, 4th, 5th year?

 

EOT was the same.  Certainly those in contention for a World Title went every year, but for the rest of us, it was likely every other (or 3rd, or 4th, or 5th) year at best.  Many have never been, and have little desire to do so.  (Their loss in my opinion, but their choice none the less)  Again, just my opinion, but EOT needs a venue that can handle 1,200 to 1,500 competitors annually, and where they are moving to (The previous Winter Range Facility) can do that, and they have also proven that they can handle the volume and still provide a World Class event.  Granted, that information comes from what I have read and from those I know who have attended, as I have personally never been.  Too far away, and unfortunately, that is a problem for many.

 

This year for EOT was an anomaly.  For the first time ever, folks on the Eastern half of the country were within a days drive of EOT.  Of course it filled up instantly, I would have been shocked if it hadn't.  That's why I started trying to get on almost immediately after they opened registration.  (Didn't help any, but I knew it would fill fast)  How many of those folks are likely to make the drive to Phoenix for EOT 2022?

 

Regardless, I would love to attend this EOT, but it doesn't appear to be in the cards.  While I wish that EOT could be more centrally located, I will take solace in the fact that the new National Championship will be in Oklahoma City, OK which is half the distance to Pheonix, AZ and 1/3rd closer to home than Founders Ranch.  That makes the odds of me attending the National Championship significantly higher going forward than EOT, and likely more often as well.

 

 

 

 

[Singin' Sue 71615 1,115]

2 hours ago, JB32311 said:

Given the popularity of the Match it would make sense to offer two separate three-day shooting matches which are held back to back.  This would accommodate twice the number of shooters.  Being held in the middle of the US this would help accommodate an increased number of shooters.  Realistically, folks here on the east coast would spend 3 days travel time to New Mexico, hence why some never go.  It takes a two week vacation to travel to, shoot, and then travel home for one match!!  If the match were centrally located (as this year), and offered two (2) separate 3-day shooting venues back to back, SASS could accommodate more shooters!  YES I KNOW THERE ARE A LOT OF LOGISTICS FOR VOLUNTEERS, SHOOT-OFF, ETC., But anyone see any other way?

 

Jb

Kansas is 'Central' US...just saying.

[Aspen Filly 50535 37]

4 hours ago, Dogmeat Dad, SASS #48563L said:

Remember that the goal is to have ALL competitors shoot the exact same match.  That is impossible as it is, just running three shifts per day for three days, to make sure that all of the competitors have the exact same conditions on the same stages, but trying to further split that into two completely separate matches spanning six days is a recipe for disaster.  Not to mention the fact that you would have to have the winners who shot the first three day match return for their awards after the second three day match has finished.  It's just never going to work.

 

To the best of my knowledge, Winter Range was historically the "Biggest Match" (at least after the move of EOT to Founders Ranch) and they handled what 1,000 shooters, maybe 1,200?  (I'm sure someone from that committee will provide the correct answer)  and although they sold out every year, realistically how many of them returned every year?  Every other year?  Every 3rd, 4th, 5th year?

 

EOT was the same.  Certainly those in contention for a World Title went every year, but for the rest of us, it was likely every other (or 3rd, or 4th, or 5th) year at best.  Many have never been, and have little desire to do so.  (Their loss in my opinion, but their choice none the less)  Again, just my opinion, but EOT needs a venue that can handle 1,200 to 1,500 competitors annually, and where they are moving to (The previous Winter Range Facility) can do that, and they have also proven that they can handle the volume and still provide a World Class event.  Granted, that information comes from what I have read and from those I know who have attended, as I have personally never been.  Too far away, and unfortunately, that is a problem for many.

 

This year for EOT was an anomaly.  For the first time ever, folks on the Eastern half of the country were within a days drive of EOT.  Of course it filled up instantly, I would have been shocked if it hadn't.  That's why I started trying to get on almost immediately after they opened registration.  (Didn't help any, but I knew it would fill fast)  How many of those folks are likely to make the drive to Phoenix for EOT 2022?

 

Regardless, I would love to attend this EOT, but it doesn't appear to be in the cards.  While I wish that EOT could be more centrally located, I will take solace in the fact that the new National Championship will be in Oklahoma City, OK which is half the distance to Pheonix, AZ and 1/3rd closer to home than Founders Ranch.  That makes the odds of me attending the National Championship significantly higher going forward than EOT, and likely more often as well.

 

 

 

 

Winter range usually runs somewhere between 600ish-750ish for total shooters....Black Jack Zack could quote numbers more accurately than I.

[irish ike, SASS #43615 1,253]

EOT is going to be in Arizona. Done.

Winter Range which has been renamed is going to be east of the Mississippi.

New club running the new WR but WR has had the largest attendance over EOT for many years. Even before the move to New Mexico.

Ones the so called world championship, the other the national.

Seems SASS has hit upon a solution that will work.

[Sedalia Dave 13,612]

6 minutes ago, irish ike, SASS #43615 said:

Winter Range which has been renamed is going to be east of the Mississippi.

 

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[Tex Jones, SASS 2263 839]

6 minutes ago, Sedalia Dave said:

 

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The national championship is moving to Oklahoma, to be hosted by the Territorial Marshals who put on Land Run.  As such, it is west of the Mississippi.

[Sedalia Dave 13,612]

Just now, Tex Jones, SASS 2263 said:

The national championship is moving to Oklahoma, to be hosted by the Territorial Marshals who put on Land Run.  As such, it is west of the Mississippi.

 

That's what I thought but Irish Ike's post said is was going to be held East of the Big Muddy.

 

What we really need is 3 or 4 venues that each take turns hosting both the National and World Championships. Would allow more shooters the possibility of attending. The logistics of attending a week long match that takes more than a day's travel to attend can be pretty hard to overcome.

[Bailey Creek,5759 166]

Nothing against the Club that is hosting E.O.T. its a great club i have shot there.Great place.

With that being said. It isn't big enuff for an event like E.O.T.

I know i have said it should of been held at SPARTA ILLINOIS.

With 1000 camping sites with hook ups. One of the down sides with sparta . Its owned by the state.

With the state hurting for funds, something could of been worked out . I believe.

What you have now is a lot of Members that isn't happy.

I am one of them. Mite as well shread my application.

[Captain Bill Burt 3,304]

2 minutes ago, Bailey Creek,5759 said:

Nothing against the Club that is hosting E.O.T. its a great club i have shot there.Great place.

With that being said. It isn't big enuff for an event like E.O.T.

I know i have said it should of been held at SPARTA ILLINOIS.

With 1000 camping sites with hook ups. One of the down sides with sparta . Its owned by the state.

With the state hurting for funds, something could of been worked out . I believe.

What you have now is a lot of Members that isn't happy.

I am one of them. Mite as well shread my application.

I believe the concern was a governor who could and might shut it down at the last minute.

[DeaconKC 2,202]

@Singin' Sue 71615 and I were talking about this. There are very few venues in the Nation capable of handling that many shooters, plus having the surrounding supports needed for caring for that number of shooters. Camping spots, hotels, restaurants, etc. requirements. Am I personally glad to see an event like this East of the Mississippi? Sure, lots closer to me, but OK City is calling loudly to me as well. Is it sad that many cannot get in this year, sure, but hopefully there will be more that they can make.

[Bailey Creek,5759 166]

Nothing against the Club that is hosting E.O.T. its a great club i have shot there.Great place.

With that being said. It isn't big enuff for an event like E.O.T.

I know i have said it should of been held at SPARTA ILLINOIS.

With 1000 camping sites with hook ups. One of the down sides with sparta . Its owned by the state.

With the state hurting for funds, something could of been worked out . I believe.

What you have now is a lot of Members that isn't happy.

I am one of them. Mite as well shread my application.

[Bailey Creek,5759 166]

Thats why you have a Contract .

[DeaconKC 2,202]

26 minutes ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

I believe the concern was a governor who could and might shut it down at the last minute.

And Pritzker would love to use COVID as an excuse to screw over hundreds of gun owners.

[Toranado, SASS # 58447 51]

17 minutes ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

I believe the concern was a governor who could and might shut it down at the last minute.

 

Correct, a state owned facility, that is in one of the most corrupt and anti-gun states in the country. (and yes I unfortunately live there)   Yes, lots of camping, but alot of us don't camp and there are only a few hotels in the area.

 

The facilities at Paradise Pass, has plenty of space for camping and parking and DOZENS of great hotels and food in the area.  

 

It sounds like they stopped at the 300 mark yesterday because of commitments to people who has signed up for EOT in NM and they promised them a spot. (Very fair)   I am assuming many of the 200 on that list from NM may not decide to attend and the waiting list they said is being created, that many on that list will be able to go.  So if you want to go,  I would get on the list.

 

An EOT on this side of the Mississippi has been a buzz of conversation since announced,  not surprised it filled up so quickly.

[Big Iron Patnode SASS 60632 36]

10 minutes ago, Bailey Creek,5759 said:

Thats why you have a Contract .

The state can void the contract in the event it is a safety concern. This year they could use Covid, next year they could use global warming caused by so many guns in one area. I'm just glad the Paradise Pass was able to step up on a truly short notice and help us not have to go through another EOT withdrawal.

[Sedalia Dave 13,612]

I find it more than a little sad that all the official  information is over on an anti-2A site like facebook that only a limited number of members have access to and not on the official SASS Wire.

 

Even the SASS home page is lacking when it comes to EOT.

[Singin' Sue 71615 1,115]

6 minutes ago, Sedalia Dave said:

I find it more than a little sad that all the official  information is over on an anti-2A site like facebook that only a limited number of members have access to and not on the official SASS Wire.

 

Even the SASS home page is lacking when it comes to EOT.

Dave..I hear ya...but...this thread HERE has 1.5k views.

[Safecracker Solon 69206L 18]

Bailey Creek World Shooting Complex (Sparta) is shut down to shooting as of now, even for small monthlies. In the past two years, the state shut down the Grand Nationals trap event and the Junior national trap event, both had contracts.  I agree I would love for it to be there as it is a great facility. Alas Il doesn't seem to care. Hope you are well.

Cracker

[Singin' Sue 71615 1,115]

31 minutes ago, Safecracker Solon, #69206 said:

Bailey Creek World Shooting Complex (Sparta) is shut down to shooting as of now, even for small monthlies. In the past two years, the state shut down the Grand Nationals trap event and the Junior national trap event, both had contracts.  I agree I would love for it to be there as it is a great facility. Alas Il doesn't seem to care. Hope you are well.

Cracker

Speaking with friends, the infrastructure has really been let to ruin. Sad.

[DeaconKC 2,202]

On a rather humorous note about Sparta, while working as a Parole Agent, one of my sex offenders asked if he could go work there. I could see that he would have been very popular as a target! "Pull!"

[Singin' Sue 71615 1,115]

13 hours ago, Aspen Filly 50535 said:

Winter range usually runs somewhere between 600ish-750ish for total shooters....Black Jack Zack could quote numbers more accurately than I.

If I'm not mistaken, I believe one year was 820 competitors. It was decided to add all on the waiting list that year.

Mind you that was the # shooting.

Add in the Conventioneer, Guests and Vendors....

[Sedalia Dave 13,612]

How many shooters were on each posse? 

[Singin' Sue 71615 1,115]

5 minutes ago, Sedalia Dave said:

How many shooters were on each posse? 

Gosh...it was a while back...and they varied...

Were there 35 posses instead of 32??? Hmmmmm...

I can sure find out!

[Dogmeat Dad, SASS #48563L 449]

23 minutes ago, Sedalia Dave said:

How many shooters were on each posse? 

 

Assuming it was 820 shooters with 12 stages shot using 3 flights per day, that would be 820/(12x3) = 820/36 = 22 or 23 per posse, a number that is certainly not out of the question.

Edited February 9 by Dogmeat Dad, SASS #48563L

[Sedalia Dave 13,612]

Just now, Dogmeat Dad, SASS #48563L said:

 

Assuming it was 12 stages shot using 3 flights per day, that would be 820/(12x3) = 820/36 = 22 or 23 per posse, a number that is certainly not out of the question.

 

When posses get that big it sure can make for a long match.

[Billy Boots, # 20282 LTG-Regulator 824]

4 minutes ago, Singin' Sue 71615 said:

Gosh...it was a while back...and they varied...

Were there 35 posses instead of 32??? Hmmmmm...

I can sure find out!

It was not unusual not so long ago to have more than 20 on posse so if 12 stages and three rotations  then 800+ is possible.   Granted, those numbers can sure lead to  long days of shooting, especially for that last rotation, if a bog-down takes place during the day.  Broken targets, re-shoots, rain showers, etc can happen....not to mention hail storms

[Dogmeat Dad, SASS #48563L 449]

Just now, Sedalia Dave said:

 

When posses get that big it sure can make for a long match.

 

Generally, the have expediters there so that the change-over between shooters is fast.  You also have a lot of folks to reset targets, etc.  If managed properly, it's not that big an issue.

[Dogmeat Dad, SASS #48563L 449]

I will add, that as Billy Boots said, one bad stage can result in a massive pileup!  It becomes critical for the Stage Designers to balance the stages as much as possible.  If you have a stand and deliver stage, make it 6 shotgun.  If you have a lot of movement, make it two shotgun.  Keeping everything balanced will avoid having posses stacked up on each other.  But, at an event that size and of that caliber, they are used to addressing those issues.

[irish ike, SASS #43615 1,253]

5 hours ago, Tex Jones, SASS 2263 said:

west of the Mississippi.

I'm a child of public education! Forgive me.

[COLORADO JACKSON 138]

I have been to Winter Range half a dozen times and i can tell you they never had a problem making things run smoothly with 800+ shooters